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Old    Derek Durkin (derek23)      Join Date: Oct 2006       10-16-2006, 9:43 PM Reply   
anyone have a new centurion air warrior T5 or ride behind one? just wondering what the wake is like. pics would be awsome.
Old    rsmith            10-16-2006, 10:36 PM Reply   
Seen the video?: on_T5

Slalom wake is awesome at 34mph:
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-16-2006, 10:41 PM Reply   
My parents have an '03 Eclipse, which is pretty close to the same boat as the T5 from what I understand, other than a few small changes. You have to do a lot of tweaking to get a very good wakeboard wake. We had an '02 that we weighted a lot of different ways and never really got it right.

And, even though you probably aren't asking about the slalom wake, I have to reply to Robert. The 34 mph slalom wake on these boats is probably one of the worst of any slalom boat I have skied behind since the '98 Pro Star 190, which was just horrible. The rooster tail at 34 is rock hard, especially at 34 mph. I ski mainly at 36, 22' off and shorter, where the wake gets a lot better. But if you are looking for a slalom boat, there are a lot better ones out there.
Old    rsmith            10-16-2006, 11:05 PM Reply   
T5's hull is different from the Eclipse. In any case, the T5 caters more to the slalom skier than the wakeboarder. It would make for a good all around boat, and I like Centurion as they build a quality boat at a good value.

Almost forgot--the slalom wakes may not be the flattest and softest out there but they are fine. Also, according to Waterski Magazine, "[T5] acts the part, delivering small, soft wakes that will welcome skiers of all abilities...Whether you're just learning the course or preparing for a tournament, chances are you'll find something you love about the wakes behind the T5...Perhaps its most appealing feature, though, is that it caters to almost any level of skier beginners through advanced skiers can easily slice through these wakes..."

(Message edited by rsmith on October 16, 2006)
Old    bruce_davis            10-17-2006, 1:07 AM Reply   
I really enjoy my Air Warrior T5. I am new to wakeboarding so all I can say is that the wake is fine for beginners. As for slalom, it is great. I usually ski at 28, 32, and 35 off in the course and 15 off in open water. I have no complaints. It's just a real fun boat.

By the way Nick, most boats have a bump at 22 off. I can't believe you are complaining about MasterCraft's wakes. Best of luck beyond 22 off.
Old    Scott Taylor (taylormade)      Join Date: Jun 2001       10-17-2006, 7:09 AM Reply   
I had an 04 T5 and I'll tell ya... it was a nightmare for me. I had problems with the transmission when I weighed it down, then both my tach and my speedo gauges failed. My problem was mainly a dealer issue, but I owned the boat for about 10 months and it was in the shop for 4 of those months. The wake was very difficult to dial in and required so many sacks that you couldn't walk anywhere without stepping all over them. The boat sits really low in the water and you have to be very careful not to take on water. There's NO surfing this wake, either. That said, it's a good deal if you're looking for an entry level boat (vinyl/carpet are less than in other Centurions), no bling, and low monthly payments. It'll do fine if you're a beginner and aren't really expecting to do much with it. I know a few people who've spent 45+K on a wakeboard specific boat who never learned anything more than a HS180, which you could do just fine behind the T5.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-17-2006, 8:11 AM Reply   
The T5 is a totally different Hull than the Eclipse.
Old    Tim (suckbuthavefun)      Join Date: May 2003       10-17-2006, 8:42 AM Reply   
I have an 04 T5. I have not had any major problems. Centurion and my dealer have been nothing but EXCELLENT!

I can't comment on the slalom, but it will throw a decent wake (for a dd) with some weight in the front as well as in the back. I will try and post some pics tonight when I get to the home computer.
Old    bdegeyter            10-17-2006, 11:12 AM Reply   
I have a 03 Eclipse LaPoint and the wakes are fine. For wakeboarding I use a few sacs to create an okay wake for beginners to learn to ride. I'm more into slalom and the Eclipse's slalom wakes are flat and soft.
Old    lizzie            10-17-2006, 12:07 PM Reply   
the Air Warrior T5 is a great entry level family ski boat that does everything. my husband and i mostly slalom ski and the wake is great. my son and daughter love the wake for wakeboarding, kneeboarding, and tubing. Centurion builds great boats for a good price and i have always had a great experience with them. i know as i also grew up with Centurion boats.
Old    Team CBK....Nate (cbk)      Join Date: Aug 2006       10-17-2006, 1:53 PM Reply   
Can't surf?
It may not be a huge surf wake, but it is surfable, with sacs of course!

Old    Team CBK....Nate (cbk)      Join Date: Aug 2006       10-17-2006, 1:54 PM Reply   
Can't surf?
It may not be a huge surf wake, but it is surfable, with sacs of course!

Old    lizzie            10-17-2006, 2:08 PM Reply   
my kids have been wanting to surf behind our T5. being a mom i am concerned they will be too close to the boat plus i'm concerned about carbon monoxide poisoning. i don't know. how do you create this surf wake with sacs (just in case i let them surf)?
Old    Team CBK....Nate (cbk)      Join Date: Aug 2006       10-17-2006, 8:40 PM Reply   
Liz- Start them off with a 500lb sac and put it beside the engine box. That should be enough to get started. Do be careful as to how long they are behind the boat, as you already know, the carbon monoxide is dangerous. Good luck!
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 3:07 AM Reply   
Bruce, have you ever skied behind a '98 ProStar? MC had to offer fiberglass inserts to add to the hull to make it halfway skiable. So yes, I am complaining about an MC wake. The new 197s are very nice. I appreciate the luck past 22', my PB is mid 38' off, so the luck is appreciated.

Kevin, I wasn't aware they changed much, as the boat looks the same minus the walkthrough, and the only T5 I skied, seemed about the same as the Eclipse.

I agree that you can surf the wake. I've actually surfed the wake without a rope with no ballast and two people in the boat. Hard, not much fun, but possible.
Old    ccarter            10-18-2006, 12:47 PM Reply   
MC dropped the ball in '98--what a shame for an "industry leader"
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 3:22 PM Reply   
Chris, that is so true. MC definately didn't have a good end to the 90s, but came storming back, first with the 190EVO, then the 197s. Definately a good boat, but I still don't know if quality is where some others are. I don't want to start a huge boat war, because I actually have MC right at the top of my new boat purchase list, but I have a couple friends with MCs, late model, that have been nothing but trouble. Either way, the new ones ski very nice. If I was buying a 3 event boat though, hands down, Response LXi. I feel Nautique is going kind of the same direction as MC in the late 90s, minus the quality issues. Nothing excites me about Nautiques right now. To me they are like a Corvette pre-C6, I heck of a nice vehicle, but something my dad would drive, not me.
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 3:33 PM Reply   
OK, so I don't get the title Mr. Negativity like it looks like from my posts, I'll get back on topic. Here are some pics of my parents Centurion wake. Some aren't very good, and most have no ballast, just people. Some of the surf wakes are no ballast, anywhere from 2-8 people in the boat.

4 people, no ballast
3 people no ballast
3 people no ballast
4 people no ballast

(Message edited by kstateskier on October 18, 2006)
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 3:37 PM Reply   
6 people no ballast
6 people no ballast
8 people no ballast
8 people no ballast

(Message edited by kstateskier on October 18, 2006)
Old    ccarter            10-18-2006, 3:43 PM Reply   
Nick, is this behind the Eclipse? Great pics by the way.
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 3:47 PM Reply   
Trick wake, 16-18 mph, 3 people in boat

Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-18-2006, 3:48 PM Reply   
Now 8 people in the Eclispe now that must have been......... shall we say cozy

I had a 2000 and 2001 Eclipse. Loved them both!
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 3:58 PM Reply   
It was cozy, but a great weekend with some great friends. Somehow the guys at the factory forgot to put the max capacity sticker on the boat when they were racing it out to get it to us, plus the fact that Kansas has very little water patrol activity, leads to a great time. Kevin, I still remember going out in your '01 when we were thinking about getting into the promo program. Give me a shout as soon as you they get a new Enzo in at Clark, I really want to check that boat out.

Chris, all of the pics are behind an '03 Eclipse LaPoint.

I don't want anyone to get the wrong opinion. After a bad experience in '02, the '03 boat was a great experience, and all around, we have had a lot of fun with it. I just wouldn't say it's a great 3 event or crossover boat. But for someone that is recreationally into any discipline and wants a fun boat on the water, it's great. I will say that it's one of the best looking boats I've ever seen. Here are a couple pics of my parents boat.


(Message edited by kstateskier on October 18, 2006)
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 4:00 PM Reply   
One more

Old    rsmith            10-18-2006, 4:09 PM Reply   
Derek, please keep in mind that the '03 Eclipse LaPoint's hull is different from the T5.
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 4:11 PM Reply   
They may be different, but the boats are still pretty close from what I have seen and from some people I've talked to over the last day or so. It gives the guy an idea.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-18-2006, 4:24 PM Reply   
Eclipse was ICS construction the T5 is all composite but built more like a Malibu to keep the cost down. It does not have snap out carpet.
The hulls are similar but the t5 has a small hump in the middle simalar to the new Enzo SV216
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 4:54 PM Reply   
That sucks, I love the snap out carpet.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-18-2006, 5:10 PM Reply   
I have always thought they should go ahead a build ICS it like the rest of the line.
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 5:13 PM Reply   
I don't get Centurion sometimes. When Robert Thayer was there, the really pushed to get into the 3 event market, especially college, but to me they never gave even close to 100% on building a 3 event boat. The T5 and Eclipse were both jokes. I know they could do better. Neither boat has been in the caliber of the Response, Nautique 196, or the ProStars. I thought if they were going to blow the money to push the ski boat, at least try to make a top notch product. They seem to cut corners on the ski market, but seem to be advancing well in the wakeboard market.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-18-2006, 5:17 PM Reply   
Follow the money
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 6:34 PM Reply   
No, I agree, but don't spend the money wasting peoples time if you aren't going at it. Put all your advertising and marketing dollars into wakeboarding. I don't think 3 eventing is dead, especially with the growth at the college level. In college, skiing has a 5-1 participation advantage over wakeboarding. Malibu and MC do a great job building boats across the board, I think Centurion could do the same, especially with their current growth. That is what it will take for them to be the next Malibu.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       10-18-2006, 6:44 PM Reply   
I could not agree more Centurion has largly ignored the inboard 3 event market. They have lots of room for improvement in that area!
Old    ccarter            10-18-2006, 6:49 PM Reply   
MB used to have 3 event boats and now look--only v-drives. My guess is that Centurion will not become the next Malibu. In time, Centurion may look like MB does today. Just my guess. I think it is sad 3 eventing is dying. Just look next time you are on the lake: see anyone learning to ski on combos? Nope, everything is wakeboarding mostly these days.
Old    rsmith            10-18-2006, 7:48 PM Reply   
This is the hull of the T5. Quite a bit different from the Eclipse which is flat bottom boat. Derek, expect a little better wakeboard wake than in Nick's pics.

Old    bdegeyter            10-18-2006, 7:52 PM Reply   
Wow, T5's hull is a lot different than my 03 Eclipse LaPoint...
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 7:53 PM Reply   
Chris, I actually see more people going back to skis these days. We spent a week at Table Rock (MO) and saw way more skiers than say 5 years ago at the lake. I just think competitive three eventing is so hard to break into because of access issues, that is what is killing the sport. If you ever want to see a lot of people having a great time, go to a college tournament in your area. When I was a senior, Purdue hosted the Midwest Dual Conference Meet, it was something like 20 teams, 500 pulls, amazing event. Good times.
Old    ccarter            10-18-2006, 8:12 PM Reply   
Tim, still have those pics? I'm tired about reading about the hull differences...

Nick, glad to hear you are seeing more people going back to skis. When I take people out that are new to the sport, they only want to learn to wakeboard--don't even want to try to get up on the combos. I totally agree with you that competitive three eventing is so hard to break into because of access issues. I have skied the course a few times, but I am a recreation skier because I never had access to a course... Anyway, hope the sport doesn't die. Maybe college will help keep it alive.
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 9:14 PM Reply   
I'm sorry, but the reason most people wakeboard is the progression is way faster. It's a great sport, but at first, the progression goes quicker wakeboarding. Not trying a ski v. wakeboard thread. At the elite level, they are both very hard, but I can keep an intermediate level wakeboarding with very little practice, where an average 3 event skier is still practicing a lot to get any progression.
Old    bdegeyter            10-18-2006, 9:54 PM Reply   
I don't know that wakeboarding is any easier or faster to learn than skiing. Teaching someone to get up on two skis is a lot easier than trying to help them get up on a wakeboard for various reasons.

I think wakeboarding is more popular and will continue to be. Most people are skiing and/or wakeboarding for recreation. For the people who want to take wakeboarding to next level they will not have to deal with the access issues associated with 3 event skiing.

Sorry for posting this since it is off topic but I had to respond because Nick is wrong by saying the main reason most people wakeboard is the progression is way faster.

(Message edited by bdegeyter on October 18, 2006)
Old    ccarter            10-18-2006, 10:04 PM Reply   
Sorry Nick, the reason most people learn to wakeboard IS NOT because progression is faster BUT because it is the popular thing to do. I consider myself a rec skier and enjoy both skiing and wakeboarding. Enough said! Lets get back on topic.
Old    bruce_davis            10-18-2006, 10:19 PM Reply   
40+ posts in this thread and derek still doesn't really know what the wake is like and no one has posted a pic of the wakeboard wake for the T5. Nick, please do not post any more incorrect or dumb stuff (no offense). I am outta here. This thread is retarded!
Old    Nick Heckerson (kstateskier)      Join Date: May 2002       10-18-2006, 10:33 PM Reply   
Guys, sorry, didn't want to start a war, just my opinion and only that. I definately agree wakeboarding is more popular and won't debate the reasoning for it, because there are a million different opinions.

Bruce, where was your help in the thread. He asked for pics, you have a T5, gave nothing. So I did the best I could, gave pics of a similar wake on a similar boat from the same brand. Not exactly the same, but an idea of at least how big you can make the wake, different shapes of course. As far as dumb posts, two of your 7 total posts have been worthless to me. First of all, you showed lack of knowledge into any history of ski boats with the MC comment, then when I call you out on it, you get pissed with this last comment. Again, I have been around great skiers all my life, and no one skiing into 35' is going to call the Centurion wake great.

Sorry, hijack off
Old    Tim (suckbuthavefun)      Join Date: May 2003       10-19-2006, 8:15 AM Reply   

I looked for the pictures, but can't find them. The only ones I have are of my son and he is off to the side so you can't see the wake.




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