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Old    alan plotz (alanp)      Join Date: Apr 2001       10-10-2006, 11:09 PM Reply   
im not really looking for tips just opinions on if this is a good first mobe. i know raley based inverts are played. ive got over ten inverts with several spins. i dont feel like this is a terribly difficult trick but was wondering others opinions if this was a good first mobe. my thoughts why it would be are because 1) there is no handle pass 2) ive got strong raley based tricks 3) im comfortable spining bs(but i dont think the spins really compare). thoughts
Old    Craig (yosquire)      Join Date: Jun 2005       10-10-2006, 11:17 PM Reply   
I too am interested in this question. I spent most of this summer with a firm focus on strengthening my raley. (right up until the sprained LCL) And was planning on taking the raley to the S-Bend. Technically it doesn't seem like a difficult trick. Though, not many people do it, which concerns me that it may be more difficult than I'm estimating. So, I too am interested in thoughts on this subject.
Old    Ryan Siebring (lostkgb78)      Join Date: Oct 2005       10-10-2006, 11:43 PM Reply   
S-bend, as cool as it can be if done correct... is not a mobius
Old    Viktor Carlquist (vec)      Join Date: Feb 2006       10-11-2006, 12:37 AM Reply   
Easiest mobe would probably be the moby dick...
Old    David D (wakeguru)      Join Date: Feb 2003       10-11-2006, 7:22 AM Reply   
If you can do several spins and inverts...I'm assuming a regular HS 3 and a backroll, I would just try a HS (back) mobe. The learning curve on the HS mobe might be a little less bumpy than that of an S-bend. Take the mobe up rather than out by edging hard at the wake.

I do know a guy who prefers to do front (TS) mobes over HS. If you can do TS 3's and a front roll as well I'd do whichever of those two mobes that feels more comfortable to you.
Old    Eubanks (eubanks01)      Join Date: Jun 2001       10-11-2006, 7:46 AM Reply   
Alan - Why not a Whirly?
Old    Stan Tanner (sbt3)      Join Date: Jun 2002       10-11-2006, 8:57 AM Reply   
My thoughts on a first mobe would be one of these three.
HS Mobe- I have tried a few this summer but am not getting the handle pass. I am landing on the board the right way. I think this trick could be a worker if you don't get the spin and catch a back side edge.

Pete Rose. Again not getting the handle or quite the full rotation. I think this will be my first mode I stick. I am going to work it next season. It seems pretty consiquence free so far.

Crow Mobe would be another one that would seem fairly easy but I haven't tried. I can do crows and land my ts 3's wrapped so I think it will come without too much pain.

I was also thinking of trying an S-bend but I can't do raleys. I have a problem with the hole getting laid out thing and just looking at the water. I can do really laid out backrolls into the flats so I was thinking about trying to just reverse the spin for an s-bend. I know another guy who learned s-bends before raleys.
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-11-2006, 9:48 AM Reply   
Thank you Ryan Seibring. I also believe that a whirly is not technically a mobe too. A mobe constitutes an invert with a handle passed 360. Thats why a whirly and S-bend are not mobes, the s-bend is an overhead rotation and the whirly is an ole spin.
Old    Alpha_Beast (socalwakepunk)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-11-2006, 10:01 AM Reply   
Does a wrapped KGB qualify?
Old    Matthew Bird (ldr)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-11-2006, 10:06 AM Reply   
Under your definition of a mobe the crow mobe would also not be considered a mobe. That is unless you pass the handle prior to landing.
Old    Eubanks (eubanks01)      Join Date: Jun 2001       10-11-2006, 10:07 AM Reply   
And I guess Ruck's HS "Mobe" where he doesn't pass the handle isn't a mobe either??
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-11-2006, 10:15 AM Reply   
TackleBerry, yes because its still the same rotation but you are replicating the pass by wrapping(like Randall's front mobe).

I guess my definition is flawed. Basically what I'm saying is that a mobe is an invert with a straight FS/BS rotation, this whole ole/overhead rotation doesn't jive in my head. I just have a hard time looking at a trick like a Ole 5 and looking at it as a 5 when you never pass the handle. It just looks like an out the back scarecrow or roll to revert to me. And I do a TS ole 5 and it certainly feels different, i just have a hard time claiming 5 when my right hand never leaves the handle.

I'm sure I'll get crapped on for saying a whirly isn't a mobe. Thats cool. (Sits back, waits for the inevitable flame fest)

(Message edited by stephan on October 11, 2006)
Old    B.C.P...........Mike (wakeeater2003)      Join Date: Mar 2004       10-11-2006, 10:24 AM Reply   
I would say crow mobe and Moby dicks are the easiest mobes. It depends on your base of tricks but I think those are the easiest.

I think heel mobe is one of the hardest if not the hardest. It is very tough to get the handle and land. I would either land it without the handle or search for the handle the whole way through and catch my heelside edge like a champ. BCP Mike
Old    Ronnie Romero (rorowake)      Join Date: Oct 2003       10-11-2006, 10:55 AM Reply   
I was wondering if this would ever become a topic on here... I have gone round and round with many people about this same question... what actually constitutes a mobe... I agree, a whirlybird IS an ole spin instead of a handle pass and most people classify a mobe as having to have a handle pass. But MANY people do HS Mobes without a handle pass and MOST people do crow mobes/skeezers (Ryan you are one of em :-) ) without a handle pass. So why are those classified as mobes, then? I think a whirly would be classified as an ole or an overhead mobe, same with a big worm. It is hard not to call a big worm a mobe, but there is no handle pass there either. It is a long drawn out debate, but a fun one, at least! Next good debate... do you consider a raley an invert. And if not, then is a 313 considered a mobe? Have fun!
Old    Joe Umali (dakid)      Join Date: Feb 2001       10-11-2006, 10:57 AM Reply   
at some point, when landing wrapped on a mobe, they have to pass the handle. it's not when the handle is passed that makes it a mobe, it's if it's ever passed during the trick.

(Message edited by dakid on October 11, 2006)
Old    Alpha_Beast (socalwakepunk)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-11-2006, 11:03 AM Reply   
Off topic, does anyone do a KGB 5?
Old    Joe Umali (dakid)      Join Date: Feb 2001       10-11-2006, 11:04 AM Reply   
murray and o'brien are 2 that have done kgb5s that i know of.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-11-2006, 11:14 AM Reply   
That's crap!

So what if a Crowmobe is landed wrapped, then unwound after the landing. Is it no longer a mobe now?
Old    Antbug (antbug)      Join Date: Jul 2004       10-11-2006, 11:20 AM Reply   
I thought SOB did one too.
Old    Joe Umali (dakid)      Join Date: Feb 2001       10-11-2006, 11:22 AM Reply   
if you unwound after the landing on a crowmobe, you're eatin' poo since you'll unwrap towards the wake.
Old    Aden Glatt (aden_g)      Join Date: Mar 2006       10-11-2006, 12:08 PM Reply   
Try a s-bend on a wakeskate first.

You will reconsider your mobe-ladder.

p.s. wear a wetsuit or two.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-11-2006, 12:11 PM Reply   
I think it's all confidence. Allen landed an S-bend on his 2cd or 3rd try. If you're the type that always lands on your feet, no matter what, go for it.
Old    Eubanks (eubanks01)      Join Date: Jun 2001       10-11-2006, 12:14 PM Reply   
Ruck unwraps his HS mobe and never passes the handle!
Old    Antbug (antbug)      Join Date: Jul 2004       10-11-2006, 12:22 PM Reply   
and then prays to god... right Eubanks? hahahaha
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-11-2006, 12:33 PM Reply   
According to Joe that's not a mobe then.
Old    Eubanks (eubanks01)      Join Date: Jun 2001       10-11-2006, 1:01 PM Reply   
Very mature.
Old    Ronnie Romero (rorowake)      Join Date: Oct 2003       10-11-2006, 1:10 PM Reply   
people tic toc out of crowmobes alot (and alot of them then backplant). but it's still a crowmobe.
Old    Antbug (antbug)      Join Date: Jul 2004       10-11-2006, 1:31 PM Reply   
oh come on....that was funny!
Old    John Marshall (johnm_ttu)      Join Date: Jul 2005       10-11-2006, 1:54 PM Reply   
When you do a Whirly are you ever really "inverted"?

I tend to think no, but I have never been able to land one.
Old    David D (wakeguru)      Join Date: Feb 2003       10-11-2006, 1:59 PM Reply   
LOL Ant. Enlighten up Eubanks.

I knew this thread would turn into a mobe debate. Boring. Just ride...grab it, flip it, spin it and don't worry about naming it.
Old    Aden Glatt (aden_g)      Join Date: Mar 2006       10-11-2006, 2:03 PM Reply   
"When you do a Whirly are you ever really "inverted"?"


When you do a scarecrow, are you ever really "inverted"?
Old    Marty G (sdmarty)      Join Date: Feb 2006       10-11-2006, 2:15 PM Reply   
aden g you are way off topic. There are three basic tricks in wakeboarding. grabs, spins and inverts.

An S-bend is not a mobe. A mobe is short for mobius which is an invert roll of any type with a full 3 mixed in.

This is the only thing "I" personally think is GHEY in this sport is the lame names of the tricks.

hoochie glide? tootsie roll?

roll to revert, half-cab roll, why not be a switch roll to revert?

we should have a world wide vote for the trick names and descriptions and than make a damn wake trick dictionary!

just my 2 cents.....



peace

PS. which of you would rather the LF watson or the LF team and why?
Old    Alpha_Beast (socalwakepunk)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-11-2006, 2:23 PM Reply   
"A mobe is short for mobius which is an invert roll of any type with a full 3 mixed in."

What about a Fruit Loop (Front Flip w/bs360,one of the cooler named tricks)?

To answer your last question, neither...

(Message edited by socalwakepunk on October 11, 2006)
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       10-11-2006, 2:25 PM Reply   
watson for sure. landings are SO hard on the team
Old    Bill Montanye (bill)      Join Date: Feb 2001       10-11-2006, 2:30 PM Reply   
actually the Froot loop is a Ts FrontFlip to a bs 180 and a tootsie roll is a ts frontroll with a bs 180...
Old    Aden Glatt (aden_g)      Join Date: Mar 2006       10-11-2006, 2:32 PM Reply   
"There are three basic tricks in wakeboarding. grabs, spins and inverts."

Any simple judging course can tell you that is wrong. Or just a glance at a judging sheet.

and every time I am riding, my ski-backgrounded friends tell me to do a dumdum
Old    Chris Weber (cweb)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-11-2006, 2:34 PM Reply   
A tootsie roll is a Mobe. And it is a front-roll with a BS 180. So, i think you are incorrect when you say a mobe "is an invert with a full 360 mixed in."
Old    Alpha_Beast (socalwakepunk)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-11-2006, 2:35 PM Reply   
Sorry, my bad
Old    Aden Glatt (aden_g)      Join Date: Mar 2006       10-11-2006, 2:38 PM Reply   
How is a tootsie roll a mobe?

It is harder than some mobes, so sometimes people associate it as one, but it is not as far as I know. Otherwise I just added another mobe to my list
Old    Chris Weber (cweb)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-11-2006, 2:40 PM Reply   
I think a Mobe has a very loose Definition. Becasue s scarecrow is an TS front with a 180, and so is a tootsie roll, but obviously one is much more dificult than the other, and on the tootsie roll you are much more inverted. I dont really think there is a solid definition. More like an understanding. err wait..maybe it has to be a 360 unless its a BS 180.. AHHHHH well never know! C-Web
Old    Chris Weber (cweb)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-11-2006, 2:41 PM Reply   
my understanding is that a tootsie roll IS a mobe. I remember tim keepers telling a buddy of mine to work on it as his first mobe...but ive been wrong before
Old    Marty G (sdmarty)      Join Date: Feb 2006       10-11-2006, 2:49 PM Reply   
Goin back to the flight 69 days when only a couple riders were pullin mobes. One of the originals were a backside roll with a 360 handlepass. I am outta here this is going to be a long one......



peace
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-11-2006, 2:52 PM Reply   
Most would not consider a Tootsie to be a mobe.
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-11-2006, 2:57 PM Reply   
Ryan Seibring come back and enlighten us all!!! or da Moose.

cweb, your saying that an invert with a handle pass is a mobe? Regardless of the degree of spin? Fascinating.

Marty G, half cab or cab is from skating. I'd rather say that than "switch roll to revert" which if you think about it, is just a switch roll. haha

Aden, I know you are a good rider...but on a well popped crow you shouldn't be all out the back. Its a trip flip and goes up and over, inverted. }
Old    Chris Weber (cweb)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-11-2006, 3:02 PM Reply   
Big Heavy...I didnt say that. I think that a whirly is a mobe, as is a crow mobe. Thats why i said that it had a very loose definition. Nowhere did i say the handle has to be passed. And if i implied that, my bizzle what do i know anyway....i cant do a TS front, or a BS180
Old    Aden Glatt (aden_g)      Join Date: Mar 2006       10-11-2006, 3:38 PM Reply   
I prefer a good 'ol TS OA FS ole 5 over a crow any day. It sounds more impressive

"did you see my toeside offaxis frontside ole five-fourty?!?"

Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-11-2006, 3:41 PM Reply   
No...but I saw your "out-the-back-scarecrow" You need to clean that up!
Old    Bill Montanye (bill)      Join Date: Feb 2001       10-11-2006, 3:43 PM Reply   
tootsie roll/fruit loop is definitly NOT a Mobe and noone ive ever been around or talked to on or offline would consider one either..

are they hard ,sure and they score as such at a comp or from friends and such..

I dont officially consider a whirly or a sbend a mobe but ill give someone credit as a mobe if they feel it is one without too much argument..its a grey area but a whirly is more so one then an sbend since at least a tantrum is a true inverted flip where a raley is not...
Old    Aden Glatt (aden_g)      Join Date: Mar 2006       10-11-2006, 3:54 PM Reply   
The argument whether a whirly is a mobe or not lies in the definition of a mobe.. either a "Invert with a 360" OR an "invert with a handle-pass 360".

I don't belive the question is whether they go completely upside-down or not. Either way it is a tantrum with an overhead 360.

Either way, an Sbend is not a mobe: however, if I were judging a competition and someone did an sbend, I would classify it as one because of the skill level, and the judging sheet categories..(Flip/Spin/Grab/Mobe/Raley)
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-11-2006, 4:31 PM Reply   
cweb - "A tootsie roll is a Mobe. And it is a front-roll with a BS 180. So, i think you are incorrect when you say a mobe 'is an invert with a full 360 mixed in.'"

So then what constitutes a mobe? Especially since you a feel an invert with a BS 180 does? You weren't basing that off the fact that its a handlepass 180 vs a non handle pass 180?

Note - I'm not saying a whirly isn't hard or completely bad ass, I just don't think its a mobe.
Old    Chris Weber (cweb)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-11-2006, 4:40 PM Reply   
I can see where it would sound like that, however i was not. Thats why i keep saying that i think it is very loosely defined. I think it has alot to do with the WAY a trick is performed, but also its level of difficulty. Mad props to anyone who can stick any of these tricks. Beyond a trampoline, i am worthless.
Old    Matt VdA (mvda)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-11-2006, 4:46 PM Reply   
Here is my take.

A mobe is simply a full twisting flip.

Unfortunately, many people incorrectly label any "technical" invert as a mobe.

A "technical" trick is either 1) an invert with some sort of spin rotation other than a FS 180 OR 2) a spin of more that 360 degress where the additional rotation is something other than a FS 180.

Whirlybirds and Big Worms are in the mobe definition gray area, but they are definitely technical. Purists usually don't consider them as mobes due to the lack of a handle pass or wrapped landing.

S-bends are also technical, but they are not mobes as there is no flip.

(Message edited by Mvda on October 11, 2006)
Old    Antbug (antbug)      Join Date: Jul 2004       10-11-2006, 4:53 PM Reply   
Matt ~ what's you take on a crow mobe then?
Old    Aden Glatt (aden_g)      Join Date: Mar 2006       10-11-2006, 5:09 PM Reply   
There are wakeboarding purists?
Damn, you make us sound like a cult or something.
Old    Matt VdA (mvda)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-11-2006, 5:13 PM Reply   
A crow mobe is a front roll with a fs 360, which makes it a full twisting flip, and thus a mobe.

I know that some people lay it out the back, making it less of a flip, but until it becomes an ts ole 360, I consider it a mobe.
Old    Matt VdA (mvda)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-11-2006, 5:22 PM Reply   
pur·ist (pyrst)
n.
One who practices or urges strict correctness, especially in the use of words.

Aden,
Please re-read the whole thread above. There seems to be plenty of wakeboard purists. While I don't think its a cult, I would argue that we're definitely an "or something".
Old    John Marshall (johnm_ttu)      Join Date: Jul 2005       10-11-2006, 6:57 PM Reply   
Mobe is trick skiing terminology. HS Backroll FS 360 was I believe the original Mobe people strated doing. The rotations on these tricks are similar in wakeboarding and trick skiing and the crossover was clear. Wakeboarding involves a lot of rotations that can't be done on a trick ski. The farther wakeboard tricks became distant from their trick skiing bastard cousins the less the term mobe applies.
Old    Ronnie Romero (rorowake)      Join Date: Oct 2003       10-11-2006, 9:21 PM Reply   
How and when did a tootsie roll become a mobe?

Does that mean you are saying a roll to blind or a t 2 b are mobes, too?
Old    Ryan Siebring (lostkgb78)      Join Date: Oct 2005       10-11-2006, 10:30 PM Reply   
Sorry for the delay...Hawaii time
OK, here it goes...
Mobe= invert and handle pass 360.
Roll to blind= Not Mobe
Kgb= Mobe
Tootsie roll and fruit loop= not mobe
Whirly=not mobe
if some one can do a whirly and land with the roap wraped around their body then I'll call it a mobe
Here's why...
If you take the handle pass out and replace it with an ole 360 then what's to stop some one from calling a crow mobe 5 an off axis 900 with 360 of it being an ole spin???
If you land a mobe wrapped, it's still a mobe because you pass the handle either in the air or after you land. same thing.
Eric Rucks wrapped hs mobe is a very hard variation but it's still a bs mobe.
To finish this I want to say unless it's 1997 again and we all have to write our runs down, perform the trick to the text book definition or we won't get credit. The only thing that matters is riding to have fun. If you want to tell a hot girl your whirly's a mobe to boost your chances... Go ahead. Good on ya.
Peace
Old    Chris Waters (gdillyfunk69)      Join Date: Nov 2003       10-12-2006, 6:41 AM Reply   
ask anyone who judges competitions..... a whirlybird is a mobe anyway u look at it.... thats a fact..... because on a whirly u do a tantrum plus the 0le 3..... that makes it a mobe.... what sperates that from an s-bend, the s-bend is basically one 360 over ur head with both hands on the handle and ur board all the way out.... no invert... its a raley based trick and raleys are counted as inverts.... but for sure a whirly is a mobe
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-12-2006, 11:45 AM Reply   
Chris, I don't know if you know who Ryan Seibring is. Ryan (along with Gregg Necrason) invented the KGB. He was a top pro a few years back and is good friends with all the rippers. I'm not saying he's God or anything, but you might want to respect what he has to say.
Old    Leo Lasecki (malibuboarder75)      Join Date: Jan 2004       10-12-2006, 12:02 PM Reply   
As Jeff Mckee says "they are all a bunch of worthless helicopter tricks". Those arent exact quotes, but he is talking about how Kyle Murphy hasdoes a ton of really hard stylish tricks without doing any whirly 5's.

(Message edited by malibuboarder75 on October 12, 2006)
Old    Matt VdA (mvda)      Join Date: Dec 2002       10-12-2006, 2:37 PM Reply   
Chris- Most people who judge competitions regard whirlybirds as technical tricks on the lower end of the difficulty spectrum. They don't call them mobes.

Leo- When I hear a rider who throws a clean whirly 5 call it a "worthless helicopter trick", then I'll take such comments into consideration.
Old    Leo Lasecki (malibuboarder75)      Join Date: Jan 2004       10-12-2006, 3:43 PM Reply   
Jeff Mckee might have done a whirly 5, not sure.
Old    Ned (mayor_h)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-12-2006, 6:21 PM Reply   
Ryan,speaking of 97, didn't you do an air front to blind in your National finals pass in Denver.....was that a mobe??
Old    David D (wakeguru)      Join Date: Feb 2003       10-12-2006, 6:32 PM Reply   
"The only thing that matters is riding to have fun. If you want to tell a hot girl your whirly's a mobe to boost your chances... Go ahead. Good on ya."

I've tried that...it didn't work....could have been the delivery though, not sure.
Old    Ryan Siebring (lostkgb78)      Join Date: Oct 2005       10-12-2006, 9:38 PM Reply   
Not a mobe
It was an air hasselhof
98 nationals
Old    Gene Williams (gene3x)      Join Date: Apr 2005       10-17-2006, 10:36 AM Reply   
Not to beat a dead horse hear but the original definition of a Mobe came from mathematics stating something that rotates fully around two axis. ie. any full end over end rotation in concert with any full spinning rotation. For wakeboarding most say the real definition of one is if it invloves a handle pass. My question= Why is a crow mobe called a mobe? Technically speaking it is one but why call it that if there is no handle pass?
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-17-2006, 11:44 AM Reply   
Because not all people land wrapped. Watch a Tour event, there is not one pro who lands wrapped on his crow mobe.
Old    Ronnie Romero (rorowake)      Join Date: Oct 2003       10-17-2006, 1:26 PM Reply   
almost EVERY "pro" lands wrapped on a crow mobe. They pass the handle on the water.
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       10-17-2006, 2:36 PM Reply   
I think when it was originally invented the crow mobe was done with a passed handle. Then people started blind landings. Like the Tantrum to Blindside eventually moved to the Tantrum to Blind because riders realized it was easier to land wrapped.

Its like Randy's wrapped front mobe. Is it not a mobe but instead a HS Front w/ wrapped BS 3? I don't agree with that. The only way I can justify it with my view on what a mobe is this, if there is a passed/wrapped Frontside or Backside 360+ with an invert it is a mobe. Excludes overhead spins ie. ole.

As Mr. Seibring says above "If you land a mobe wrapped, it's still a mobe because you pass the handle either in the air or after you land. same thing.
Eric Rucks wrapped hs mobe is a very hard variation but it's still a bs mobe."

(Message edited by stephan on October 17, 2006)

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