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Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       04-29-2014, 2:55 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
But we all know that no dealerships ever sell boats for msrp. We need to also wait and see what the invoice is. The sale price will be somewhere in between.
true, different out-the-door prices in different states and counties, but I just read here on WW somewhere that when comparing boats and boat prices, MSRP HAS TO BE the measuring stick, not the price that "my friend" got it for. So going off of MSRP…. how is 50k all day even remotely close to 63,000?

I remember in 09 Axis had the A22 "starting price" of $39,995 with and asterisks that clearly stated without trailer. IN 09-11 you could still get an A22 with a trailer out the door for $50k or less if you were a good negotiator and were very careful with your options. And the advertisement was clear, "starting price" or "base price" (i forget which one)… which means that NOBODY is going to be paying 39,995 and NOBODY goes into the dealer expecting to walk out with an A22 for 39,995. But MC's "$50k all day every day" or whatever is ridiculous. I highly doubt that anyone will walk out with an NXT on a trailer out the door for under $60,000. I hope I am wrong because a nicely equipped NXT in the 50's would really be great for our sport.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       04-29-2014, 3:01 PM Reply   
I hear ya. Chances are the Invoice is in the low 50s, so a bare bones NXT could probably be purchased in the 50s, but certainly not 50k even. I guess by "50k all day" they really meant "59,999 all day". Typical business people.

By comparison, MSRP on JUST THE BOAT for a 2013 A20 was right at $48k. So there is obviously a big price difference between the Axis and the NXT.
Old     (wake2snow)      Join Date: Oct 2010       04-29-2014, 3:14 PM Reply   
chatwake those prices aren't right that is retail from mastercraft's website. And Like I said I paid $63,000 and some change with the convenience pkg, wakesurf pkg, sub and cleets and with $10,000 down I'm paying around 450 month for all you nosey people out there
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       04-29-2014, 3:15 PM Reply   
And that's a bro deal or going rate?
Old     (wake2snow)      Join Date: Oct 2010       04-29-2014, 3:17 PM Reply   
and trailer and no tom that is going rate
Old    Rusty (Rusty)      Join Date: Mar 2014       04-29-2014, 3:24 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
Here's what I happened to see (I removed specific color selections).

Like I said, maybe the numbers changed.


L.O.L. Thanks Chatt for shedding light on MC's "50K All Day"
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-29-2014, 3:29 PM Reply   
OMG, you could get a Moomba for the same price?!?!? Tell me more......

Speaking of "a lot better options out there"
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       04-29-2014, 3:33 PM Reply   
I would think when a Manufacturer has an add campaign there are talking MSRP Prices. They have no way of knowing what margin a dealer is going to sell at. What Chatt posted appears to be MSRP Numbers. Nowhere do I see 50K!!

MC Owner be like…50K all day!!

Translation for the rest of us….63K all day!!! LOL
Old     (wake2snow)      Join Date: Oct 2010       04-29-2014, 3:53 PM Reply   
Are you guys stupid the boats msrp is 63,000 what ever but map is 50k and that is what the dealer sells it for. That's where the 50k all day comes from a base boat at map 50k.
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-29-2014, 3:58 PM Reply   
80k ???? Go home mastercraft you are drunk!!!! One could get a fairly loaded 210 or lightly loaded 230 in that range?!? And I am not at liberty to say my exact deal on my a24 but let's just say it was less than that with ls3, rims, flake, wetsounds, surfgate etc etc etc and the wake is right there with the g23. Not to mention the mastercraft is on a single axle and a 320hp motor? WOW
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-29-2014, 4:00 PM Reply   
I know the mastercraft fans will flame me for the comparison but this boat was designed to be price point like axis and compete with the a20
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       04-29-2014, 4:03 PM Reply   
I know what MSRP, but what exactly is map in terms of pricing?
Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       04-29-2014, 4:06 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake2snow View Post
Are you guys stupid the boats msrp is 63,000 what ever but map is 50k and that is what the dealer sells it for. That's where the 50k all day comes from a base boat at map 50k.
please explain this to me and how it relates to the last picture chat posted of the NXT 20 new order sheet? I am confused by your statement.

On a side note, IF you subtracted all those options off the chattwake build sheet from the base msrp of 63, you get down to 45,960. So what does an NXT 20 look like if the price is 59,999 or less? It looks like a STANDARD but smaller, with a smaller engine, but in a v drive with an open bow….

I kid… I kid…. but seriously.
Old     (wake2snow)      Join Date: Oct 2010       04-29-2014, 4:09 PM Reply   
Mass you speak a big game about your new boat but want say how much you paid so obviously you got to so called bro deal. And I can confidently say your a 24 wake doesn't come close to the g23 sorry the mxz 24 doesn't even come close to the g
Old     (wake2snow)      Join Date: Oct 2010       04-29-2014, 4:21 PM Reply   
Johnny those prices are retail or know as msrp the dealer price or map pricing is cheaper then retail/msrp pricing do you understand now
Old     (wake2snow)      Join Date: Oct 2010       04-29-2014, 4:23 PM Reply   
So if the boat retails at 63000 the dealer sells it at map which is 50k
Old    Dave Diaz (wakebrdr94)      Join Date: Jul 2010       04-29-2014, 4:41 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake2snow View Post
So if the boat retails at 63000 the dealer sells it at map which is 50k

Here's the problem with that. If MasterCraft, the manufacturer, is going to throw out an ad campaign that says 50k all day, that should be the MSRP on the boat. As you said a dealer will sell it for what they want to, but you show up to a dealership and expect to see 50k as the base, then add options. Not an msrp of 63k. Now you're (MC) giving a false statement to potential customers. If dealers sell it for what they want, maybe the demand will be high enough that no dealer needs to discount a boat and no one sells at 50. See the problem. No one cares about your monthly or how much you put down, we want to see what these things are going for
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-29-2014, 4:50 PM Reply   
Boat show sticker on my boat was 83k msrp... of course I am not going to post my exact deal on here, and yes the wake is very much close to the G when loaded pound for pound I have ridden both along with the new xstar and pretty much every other boat on the market. The G unloaded is 1k lbs heavier than the a24 and factory ballast is 500lbs more than the a24 with plug and play. When we made up the difference and had 1000 over plug and play it was every bit as big as the G i rode with the 3k full and 5 passengers, was the fit and finish and interior to the level of the nautique? No. But I am a young guy and it is perfect for me and in my price range.

The NXT seems like a nice boat man but 83k msrp is HIGH whether it was 63k out the door or not.
Old    Bryce Pool (bryce2320)      Join Date: May 2012       04-29-2014, 4:53 PM Reply   
My opinion is that I think wake2snow is Zane....

I think the NXT is great idea, and regardless of how it's sprayed, I'm sure it'll be a sound boat. The only laughable thing is the price and comparing it to an A22 when it's comparable to the a20 and still more. I don't think the wake can compete with the a20 either but that's yet to be seen. I'm just ready to see some pics of the wake.

MC brought the whole bitching about the price thing on themselves stating 50k all day IMO.
Old    Dave Diaz (wakebrdr94)      Join Date: Jul 2010       04-29-2014, 4:54 PM Reply   
Sorry for the semi double post, I couldn't edit:

Here's the problem with that. If MasterCraft, the manufacturer, is going to throw out an ad campaign that says 50k all day, that should be the MSRP on the boat. As you said a dealer will sell it for what they want to, but you show up to a dealership and expect to see 50k as the base, then add options. Not an msrp of 63k. Now you're (MC) giving a false statement to potential customers. If dealers sell it for what they want, maybe the demand will be high enough that no dealer needs to discount a boat and no one sells at 50. See the problem. No one cares about your monthly or how much you put down, we want to see what these things are going for

However, that being said, if MC hold true to their statement, people need to be reasonable and know they are getting a bare bones boat for 50k. That is what they offer, that's what you should expect. I would say the only real options that should be standard on any boat is Bimini an maybe a basic 4 speaker stereo. If you want cleats, heaters, tower speakers, PNP, etc then we as consumers drive the price of the boat up. People have to be realistic with options to get into the budget they want. I'd say it's like buying a new chevy crew cab. It can start in the 40s, but by the time you add diesel, 4x4, etc, your in the 60s. If I saw a NXT for 50, I would not expect much other than a hull, tower, Bimini, ballast, and motor. In all honesty, isn't that all you need to get on the water and ride?
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-29-2014, 4:55 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wake2snow View Post
Mass you speak a big game about your new boat but want say how much you paid so obviously you got to so called bro deal. And I can confidently say your a 24 wake doesn't come close to the g23 sorry the mxz 24 doesn't even come close to the g
I was told the A24 was the best wakeboard wake in the axis and malibu lineup before it even came out by people who work for both and it is better than the mxz according to basically all who ive talked to who have rode both as well... You likely subscribe to the "if its more expensive it has a bigger wake" school of thought
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       04-29-2014, 4:58 PM Reply   
I'm with Dave. How exactly can Master Craft base an add campaign(50K All day) on a number that they have no clue of? Dealers all sell for different margin. Common sense says that the discount on a brand new not released model isn't going to be far off MSRP. Certainly the norm isn't going to be the 22% off MSRP you claim to have gotten. This so called map pricing. Exactly what is this map pricing, I assume it stands for something. I just finished my accounting degree, am studying for my CPA exam, and have worked for boat dealers and have never heard the term.
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-29-2014, 4:59 PM Reply   
There is live video on that link and it looks tiny. Rider is basically hucking through some spins and inverts. Zane kinda changes the subject when talking about it in the video.

Funniest part was when he boasts the 320hp engine is 30+ more hp than their competitor... who are they competing against? SeaDoo? I havent seen a wake boat with less than 300hp since maybe early 2000s. I am not a mastercraft guy but I kind of was a little interested in this out of curiosity till I actually watched that video, to me it baisically is a replacement for the x2.
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-29-2014, 5:02 PM Reply   
I used to run a pro shop and map pricing is minimum advertised pricing which is kind of the lowest you can go with out getting in trouble with the manufacturer, I have never heard of this in regards to a boat or big purchase but it was commonly listed on price sheets we used for boards, clothing, vests etc.
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-29-2014, 5:11 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by superair502 View Post
Funniest part was when he boasts the 320hp engine is 30+ more hp than their competitor... who are they competing against? SeaDoo? I havent seen a wake boat with less than 300hp since maybe early 2000s. I am not a mastercraft guy but I kind of was a little interested in this out of curiosity till I actually watched that video, to me it baisically is a replacement for the x2.
I am pretty sure that claim goes back to the difference in how the engine companies rate their engines. Ilmore is the only one who uses sae guidelines to rate their engines. (All accessories, cat converters, and the correct manifolds installed)

The only entity, that tests them all, is the California air resources board. Ilmore rated their engines based on the carb test results. The others test results were much lower than they advertise (speaking of false advertising....)

No worse than saying 330hp all day....
Old    Jamie Worline (WaverRider)      Join Date: Mar 2014       04-29-2014, 5:13 PM Reply   
Does anyone know what the "Ready to go package" includes?
Old    Dave Diaz (wakebrdr94)      Join Date: Jul 2010       04-29-2014, 5:24 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by superair502 View Post
I used to run a pro shop and map pricing is minimum advertised pricing which is kind of the lowest you can go with out getting in trouble with the manufacturer, I have never heard of this in regards to a boat or big purchase but it was commonly listed on price sheets we used for boards, clothing, vests etc.

Again, the only flaw with MAP in this scenario is the manufacturer (MC) is the one advertising. So it makes no sense to put any other price on the boat.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       04-29-2014, 5:26 PM Reply   
For those in their 30s...

http://youtu.be/aktPK28QFi8
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       04-29-2014, 5:29 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaverRider View Post
Does anyone know what the "Ready to go package" includes?
Steering wheel, throttle lever, prop, rudder, transmission, smug, billet ballast
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       04-29-2014, 5:32 PM Reply   
Oh skip to 5:48.
Old    Bryce Pool (bryce2320)      Join Date: May 2012       04-29-2014, 5:41 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by polarbill View Post
Steering wheel, throttle lever, prop, rudder, transmission, smug, billet ballast
12 cupholders too. Probably all stainless
Old    Jamie Worline (WaverRider)      Join Date: Mar 2014       04-29-2014, 5:44 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
For those in their 30s...

http://youtu.be/aktPK28QFi8
That's Great! I think I would have to skip the package!
Old    Jamie Worline (WaverRider)      Join Date: Mar 2014       04-29-2014, 5:44 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by polarbill View Post
Steering wheel, throttle lever, prop, rudder, transmission, smug, billet ballast
Sounds like an awesome rowboat!
Old    Ryan K (FastR3DN3K)      Join Date: Jun 2013       04-29-2014, 6:35 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by xstarrider View Post
I would love to know where you are finding this R20 without a trailer for 39k, it's 55 k all day with the bare minimum options. That 55k the going rate not the MSRP
http://www.guideautoweb.com/boat/spe...oats/r20/2014/
Old    Ryan K (FastR3DN3K)      Join Date: Jun 2013       04-29-2014, 7:08 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
Here's what I happened to see (I removed specific color selections).

Like I said, maybe the numbers changed.
That's insane for a "price-point", "entry-level" boat. That's really not much less than I gave for my fairly well equipped brand new RZ4.

And I wasn't bringing Tige into the thread earlier to compare quality, brand bash, or start any other form of a pissing contest. I merely was pointing out the fact that their are a lot of other options out there in the "price-point" class that seem to be much better options than this NXT.

The A20 is probably on the top end of these alternatives since the wake is pretty great considering it's lineage and the surfgate option. Their cost-to-options ratio is pretty phenomenal if you ask me. At the same time Tige has pretty much got most everyone beat with the lowest priced entry level boat out there at the LEGIT $40k (all-day) mark, and considering it's the exact same hull as the RZR, it makes a pretty great wake. For "$50k ALL DAY" you could get a pretty loaded out R20 w/trailer, or even a mildly equipped RZR. If I were a young family that was wanting to get into a relatively nice wake boat without breaking the bank, then there are quite a few better options out there than what's being offered with the NXT. With the way MC is pricing them, they cannot be taken seriously as "price-point" boat. Hopefully they will have an insane wake to make up for their failure with marketing and pricing.
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-30-2014, 5:46 AM Reply   
I think the most telling thing in the video is how Zane answered we made it narrow to fit in shipping containers... Not because it enhanced the wake or any other reasonable answer.
Old    Tampa Wake (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       04-30-2014, 6:20 AM Reply   
NXT 91in beam
A20 98 in beam
R20 94 in beam

Unless you have to have MC not sure why anyone would go that direction. I guess you do get some kick ars billet! At 50k with trailer ballast tower basic stereo boat cover OK might lean that way. Even at the alleged $63k still not that impressive. How long do we see the NXT project lasting???? Who has odds.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       04-30-2014, 6:24 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by superair502 View Post
I think the most telling thing in the video is how Zane answered we made it narrow to fit in shipping containers... Not because it enhanced the wake or any other reasonable answer.
Right, which also goes to show that it's more likely that Mastercraft's main focus here is overseas. When you design something with that kind of restraint, you do it for a good reason. My guess is that they are going after emerging markets like Europe and Australia, where cable parks are popping up like crazy and going after those riders with a better price point and cheaper shipping costs.

The US competition is a nice side-effect, but it sounds to me like it's not the main reason they built this boat.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       04-30-2014, 6:30 AM Reply   
If it's going to Europe, where are the ash trays? Those people smoke like crazy.
Old    Connor (iShredSAN)      Join Date: Apr 2012       04-30-2014, 6:52 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
If it's going to Europe, where are the ash trays? Those people smoke like crazy.
hahaha... That's an additional option, just like tracking fins of course!

Last edited by iShredSAN; 04-30-2014 at 6:53 AM. Reason: .
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       04-30-2014, 6:58 AM Reply   
That's why the cupholders are on the floor! They're multifunction cupholders! So innovative
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       04-30-2014, 7:04 AM Reply   
Ah, I must have missed the "Ready to Smoke" option.
Old     (cheesesteak)      Join Date: Aug 2013       04-30-2014, 7:46 AM Reply   
According to MC - there's some chopper gun construction - but the explanation is vague:

Quote:
Jason from mastercraft:

@Jim Jambolya Hey Jim - it is matt. The only chop is the skin coat which is simply in place to prevent print through and keep the elements away from the fiberglass if there is damage to the gel coat.
Also - there is no stereo equipment in the base boat.

Quote:
Jason from mastercraft:

@robert Hey Robert - all stereo components are optional.
No bow filler cushion (not an option) - no tower wiring unless you order tower speakers? Look at that gunwale and tell me how you're going to run anything anywhere???

I'd have to think if another manufacturer was selling a 20' boat, chopper gun construction, no stereo, no trailer, that porpoised like that boat in the video - for $63K - the MC guys would be all over it saying what a ripoff it was.

Sorry MC - but "entry level" boats shouldn't be priced at $80K . . .

Last edited by cheesesteak; 04-30-2014 at 7:50 AM.
Old    D Hill (dhill)      Join Date: Aug 2010       04-30-2014, 7:53 AM Reply   
can someone repost the link to the video? i've looked back through the forum and cannot find it.
Old    D Hill (dhill)      Join Date: Aug 2010       04-30-2014, 8:01 AM Reply   
sorry, found it...http://mastercraft.yourbrandlive.com...tintroduction/
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       04-30-2014, 8:57 AM Reply   
Careful cheese steak..when I posted there was chopper gun construction I was told to get my facts straight!!! LOL
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       04-30-2014, 9:08 AM Reply   
Is chopper gun really that bad of a thing?

This thread is crazy though. Too many variables that aren't being expressed when comparing boats. What I want to know is what is the MSRP of the NXT with some of the normal option pretty much everybody would want and compare that to the MSRP with similar options on an R20, TWB, A20, Mondo, etc.. and other boats that are competing against it.

Can someone who has more time than me get MSRP sheets for those boats or at least come up with MSRP for those boats with Tower, Racks(fixed if you have the option of fixed or swivel), cover, cruise, base ballast, base FI 5.7L, tandem trailer. Then at least we can attempt to compare pricing instead of bro deal this and way bigger boat MSRP that.

I will admit that 63k actual purchase price is crazy for what that boat appears to be on the surface. How could anyone choose that over a loaded up TWB(If they want the luxury without the bling) or the A20/R20/Mondo with the extra features for less?
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       04-30-2014, 9:30 AM Reply   
I don't really know that chopper gun is bad per say. Like I said above plenty of companies have been using it for a long time and their boats are still floating. But it is a Cheaper method. But there must be a reason companies use the fact that they use hand laid versus chopper as a advertising tag. I'm not a fiberglass expert but maybe is is structurally better, but that doesn't mean to say the chopper gun boat is going to fail. But I do know there is a cost savings to using chopper gun versus hand laid.
Old    Supreme Device (rullery)      Join Date: Jul 2012       04-30-2014, 9:31 AM Reply   
Is reducing the amount of hexagons an option on this boat?
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       04-30-2014, 9:33 AM Reply   
could hand laid just be one of the market trends that doesn't make sense? Hell, most are scared to even think about a boat with a wood product in it like a Sanger but I believe that done correctly a wood stringer boat may have more benefits than negatives compared to an all fiberglass boat. Did the market more towards all fiberglass because it is actually better or because that is the perception?
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       04-30-2014, 9:35 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by rullery View Post
Is reducing the amount of hexagons an option on this boat?
hahahaha. you don't like 6?

That reminds me of 7 minute abs.

"The number is 7, no 6. You can't even break a sweat in 6 minutes. 7 little chipmunks swinging on a branch, eating lots of sunflowers at my uncles ranch"
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-30-2014, 9:57 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by polarbill View Post
Is chopper gun really that bad of a thing?

This thread is crazy though. Too many variables that aren't being expressed when comparing boats. What I want to know is what is the MSRP of the NXT with some of the normal option pretty much everybody would want and compare that to the MSRP with similar options on an R20, TWB, A20, Mondo, etc.. and other boats that are competing against it.

Can someone who has more time than me get MSRP sheets for those boats or at least come up with MSRP for those boats with Tower, Racks(fixed if you have the option of fixed or swivel), cover, cruise, base ballast, base FI 5.7L, tandem trailer. Then at least we can attempt to compare pricing instead of bro deal this and way bigger boat MSRP that.

I will admit that 63k actual purchase price is crazy for what that boat appears to be on the surface. How could anyone choose that over a loaded up TWB(If they want the luxury without the bling) or the A20/R20/Mondo with the extra features for less?
Called dealer... ready to go package is the surf package, amp and sub, and tracking fins. So those are technically doubled on that 80k price sheet. This package is similar to the "Pro Package" on an X series, which included trim plate, amp and sub, tracking fins (on certain models), and a couple other things...


As for MSRPs and standard features.... I can address that on the A20-
It has a cheaper base price ($49,833), And comes with a very basic boatmate trailer. It has less standard features than the NXT, and the base does NOT include a stereo either. Not even a basic one. It also does not include any board rack at all, no gps cruise, no depth finder, no flip up bolster on helm seat, no pylon, No cleats, No carpet or floor covering of any kind, No traction pads on gunwales or transom step, No cooler, no mirror or bracket, no dual battery switch, only a single small tracking fin, unless you get the optional dual tracking fin...... And a few others.... The guys on here saying that the A20 comes better equipped as a standard boat, are completely wrong. The NXT has more standard equipment.

As for option pricing...... The A20 has about $20k worth of options that a normal person would want. (excluding engine options above the 330 and salt water options. Those would be extra.)

The MSRP on an A20, with base engine and the following, would MSRP around $71k-
Dual Battery Switch
Cover
Cleats
Bolster seat
Flip seat
Non skid deck track
cooler
carpet
plastic ptm mirror and bracket
led lighting
underwater lights
cover
base bimini
Stereo pack #2 with blue tooth
depth finder
gps cruise
tracking fins
wedge
surfgate
single set swivel racks
pylon
stainless cup holders
flake on only the small accent portions


The A22, and T22 are slightly more. Basically, add 5k for the A22, and only like 1-2k for the T22.


We can ignore the following, as it is not important for 99.99% of us.
If you added tricked out trailer, second set of racks, more stereo stuff, more flake, 2-tone trailer, certain base colors, Z5, etc...... you will approach an MSRP of 77-79ish, if you went crazy with all options..... And throw a big engine in, and you hit 90k MSRP.


These boats are closer in price, than your warped minds are allowing you to see......



And before anyone jumps on the "BS, I payed way less" Train......THESE ARE JUST BASED ON MSRP

Last edited by Fixable; 04-30-2014 at 10:00 AM.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       04-30-2014, 10:21 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixable View Post
Called dealer... ready to go package is the surf package, amp and sub, and tracking fins. So those are technically doubled on that 80k price sheet. This package is similar to the "Pro Package" on an X series, which included trim plate, amp and sub, tracking fins (on certain models), and a couple other things...


As for MSRPs and standard features.... I can address that on the A20-
It has a cheaper base price ($49,833), And comes with a very basic boatmate trailer. It has less standard features than the NXT, and the base does NOT include a stereo either. Not even a basic one. It also does not include any board rack at all, no gps cruise, no depth finder, no flip up bolster on helm seat, no pylon, No cleats, No carpet or floor covering of any kind, No traction pads on gunwales or transom step, No cooler, no mirror or bracket, no dual battery switch, only a single small tracking fin, unless you get the optional dual tracking fin...... And a few others.... The guys on here saying that the A20 comes better equipped as a standard boat, are completely wrong. The NXT has more standard equipment.

As for option pricing...... The A20 has about $20k worth of options that a normal person would want. (excluding engine options above the 330 and salt water options. Those would be extra.)

The MSRP on an A20, with base engine and the following, would MSRP around $71k-
Dual Battery Switch
Cover
Cleats
Bolster seat
Flip seat
Non skid deck track
cooler
carpet
plastic ptm mirror and bracket
led lighting
underwater lights
cover
base bimini
Stereo pack #2 with blue tooth
depth finder
gps cruise
tracking fins
wedge
surfgate
single set swivel racks
pylon
stainless cup holders
flake on only the small accent portions


The A22, and T22 are slightly more. Basically, add 5k for the A22, and only like 1-2k for the T22.


We can ignore the following, as it is not important for 99.99% of us.
If you added tricked out trailer, second set of racks, more stereo stuff, more flake, 2-tone trailer, certain base colors, Z5, etc...... you will approach an MSRP of 77-79ish, if you went crazy with all options..... And throw a big engine in, and you hit 90k MSRP.


These boats are closer in price, than your warped minds are allowing you to see......



And before anyone jumps on the "BS, I payed way less" Train......THESE ARE JUST BASED ON MSRP
A normal person shopping for a budget boat wouldn't get:

LED Lighting
PTM Edge Mirror
Underwater LED lights
Stainless Cup holders
flake
dual tracking fin (I have the single and the boat tracks and drives GREAT)
non-skid deck track
sound pack 2

My 2013 MSRP was under $60k. Your numbers here are WAY off-base.

Last edited by boardjnky4; 04-30-2014 at 10:27 AM.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       04-30-2014, 10:24 AM Reply   
So if what you're saying is true, the MSRP on an NXT20 with a very basic trailer from MC with a spare, no custom color options at all, no deck track, no ss cupholders, no colored led lighting, no ptm edge mirror, no tower speakers and no bimini, is still over $75k. Why would you compare that price to an a20 with a bimini, with metal flake ($$$), with deck track, with tower speakers and with a bimini? Good grief. That's not exactly apples to apples.
Old    Jay Simmo (JayManAR)      Join Date: Dec 2012       04-30-2014, 10:28 AM Reply   
Yes, those numbers are way off from what I know and have seen regarding A20 pricing.
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-30-2014, 10:29 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
A normal person shopping for a budget boat wouldn't get:

LED Lighting
PTM Edge Mirror
Underwater LED lights
Stainless Cup holders
flake
dual tracking fin (I have the single and the boat tracks and drives GREAT)
non-skid deck track

My 2013 MSRP under $60k. Your numbers here are WAY off-base.
Taking off the following, drops about $1200.00 off the MSRP.
non skid
stainless cupholders
UW lights
Led lights
second tracking fin

As for the flake........ Almost every single new boat, that I see, has at least a small amount of flake. I only added in for the small portion flake addition, not the main color.....

My numbers are not way off on a 2014. They are based on Malibus EXACT MSRP numbers for a 2014 A20, with the EXACT options that I listed..... Sorry, looks like the price of your A20 has increased since 2013.
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-30-2014, 10:39 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
So if what you're saying is true, the MSRP on an NXT20 with a very basic trailer from MC with a spare, no custom color options at all, no deck track, no ss cupholders, no colored led lighting, no ptm edge mirror, no tower speakers and no bimini, is still over $75k. Why would you compare that price to an a20 with a bimini, with metal flake ($$$), with deck track, with tower speakers and with a bimini? Good grief. That's not exactly apples to apples.
Comes standard with deck track, floor covering, led interior lighting, a mirror (not PTM, but the plastic PTM is dirt cheap)

And I NEVER SAID I WAS COMPARING TO THE SPEC YOU POSTED

Flake is allegedly a no cost option for 1 panel selection on the NXT. Additional panels are regular upcharge. So yes, Adding a bimini and tower speakers is going to add 3-4k on the NXT. You are going to end up with an A20 at 71K, or an NXT at $78K MSRP. I will admit, there is a price difference. However, you all are in here saying its 20-30k difference, and it is not. Not even close.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       04-30-2014, 10:41 AM Reply   
I never said there was a 20-30k price difference. I'm just saying you should compare apples to apples. Either way, it's not 50k all day...
Old    Matt (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-30-2014, 10:46 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardman74 View Post
Careful cheese steak..when I posted there was chopper gun construction I was told to get my facts straight!!! LOL
A skin coat of chopper material is hardly equal to saying chopper gun construction. Nautique does it on every single bost they make; are you going to say they are crap too? Its a barrier coat, much like the one you didn't even realize doesn't come on the R20, but is standard on every other Tige...

I thought you were done making this thread about you? I knew you couldn't stay away.

Last edited by MattieK27; 04-30-2014 at 10:48 AM.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       04-30-2014, 10:51 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixable View Post
Taking off the following, drops about $1200.00 off the MSRP.
non skid
stainless cupholders
UW lights
Led lights
second tracking fin

As for the flake........ Almost every single new boat, that I see, has at least a small amount of flake. I only added in for the small portion flake addition, not the main color.....

My numbers are not way off on a 2014. They are based on Malibus EXACT MSRP numbers for a 2014 A20, with the EXACT options that I listed..... Sorry, looks like the price of your A20 has increased since 2013.
You're insane... OK maybe not insane, but that's WAY more than $1200.

If you're numbers are so perfect, then prove it and post the price sheet. It didn't go up by $10,000.
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-30-2014, 11:01 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
I never said there was a 20-30k price difference. I'm just saying you should compare apples to apples. Either way, it's not 50k all day...
Fair enough. It was not you. It was a couple others.

And yes, Based on MSRP, the 50k all day, was a dumb marketing campaign. It would have to be fairly basic to get a trailer and land on 50k. (Say nothing about that campaign, and the MSRP price basis) My point, was that will apply to the others as well.

As for the fact that it is more expensive..... What did you all expect? Did you think MC would cut all the corners, use cheep vinyl and foam, go away from the 1 piece deck, skip the tinned wiring and lateral stringer reinforcements, just to make it cheaper than the others? Not that you need any of that stuff, and obviously the others do well without it. However MC probably still wants the NXT customer to actually have a few things that remind them that it is manufactured by MasterCraft, and those things cost more.

I don't think they were looking for a customer that was telling themselves "Moomba and Axis are too expensive, lets go look at a MasterCraft."
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-30-2014, 11:06 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardjnky4 View Post
You're insane... OK maybe not insane, but that's WAY more than $1200.

If you're numbers are so perfect, then prove it and post the price sheet. It didn't go up by $10,000.
Stainless Cupholders-$247.00
Blue Led interior Lighting- $167.00
Non Skid- $507.00
UW Lights- $333.00
Added Fin- $293.00

Total-$1547.00

Sorry, you were correct, it was a little more. When I posted, I didn't remember the non skid being so ridiculously expensive.

Would you like me to list everything line by line?

Last edited by Fixable; 04-30-2014 at 11:08 AM.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       04-30-2014, 11:16 AM Reply   
The non-skid is pricey. I thought the UW lights were more though.

I'd love to see it all line-by-line... I still don't think it's over 70k.

Isn't the flake $1,000 per accent?

If so, we just shaved off $2,500 from your 71k. We just got the number down to $68,500. A bit more reasonable, but I still think it's high by several thousand.

Last edited by boardjnky4; 04-30-2014 at 11:20 AM.
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       04-30-2014, 11:20 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixable View Post
Stainless Cupholders-$247.00
Blue Led interior Lighting- $167.00
Non Skid- $507.00
UW Lights- $333.00
Added Fin- $293.00

Total-$1547.00

Sorry, you were correct, it was a little more. When I posted, I didn't remember the non skid being so ridiculously expensive.

Would you like me to list everything line by line?
Eww. I just put marine grade stainless steel cupholder in my Axis for $82. That was for 19 stainless steel cups. I only needed 15.
Old    Connor (iShredSAN)      Join Date: Apr 2012       04-30-2014, 11:21 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixable View Post
As for the fact that it is more expensive..... What did you all expect? Did you think MC would cut all the corners, use cheep vinyl and foam, go away from the 1 piece deck, skip the tinned wiring and lateral stringer reinforcements, just to make it cheaper than the others? Not that you need any of that stuff, and obviously the others do well without it. However MC probably still wants the NXT customer to actually have a few things that remind them that it is manufactured by MasterCraft, and those things cost more.
I believe everyone expected a boat to be had for $50k after having "50k all day" crammed down our throats since they first mentioned it. Also, no one has seen or rode one of these so you are assuming they built this just like one of their non price point boats. It has yet to be seen if they "cut corners"
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       04-30-2014, 11:59 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by iShredSAN View Post
I believe everyone expected a boat to be had for $50k after having "50k all day" crammed down our throats since they first mentioned it. Also, no one has seen or rode one of these so you are assuming they built this just like one of their non price point boats. It has yet to be seen if they "cut corners"

I am not going to disagree with any of that.


Time will tell what they skipped, and what they didn't.
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       04-30-2014, 4:11 PM Reply   
Let me summarize all these posts into one.


The only way this boat is 50k is if you stick it in the back of your pickup and drive it home to your lift where it stays forever. The idea of this being a 50k wakeboat is a fantasy played out by MC to the T with their marketing yet again. A wakeboat needs a short list. A trailer to get you there, triple ballast minimum, variation of pp, a base stereo, and tower, of which this boat doesn't come with. It has two of those.

MC's 50k mark obviously means as stripped as it could be which will fail for anyone remotely serious about wakeboarding. This boat will have MSRP in the 60's all day long to make it an official wakeboat contender which puts it just above the other budget boats when optioned equally. MC can do that because of the name.

Anyone who is claiming its still 50k after being optioned because you deal off MSRP is an idiot. You price boats by MSRP . If MC is gonna claim its 50k all day That should be its MSRP. Which it is if you want to pay 10 linemen to Cary it over to your lift or dock and get the wake performance level of any I/O.


We all know the 50k wakeboat is a dream and no one is ever making one again. You may be able to get a deal close to 50k but the MSRP is where the numbers are period. Kudos to the marketing hype of MC yet again. They know how to stir up the pot and get hype started.
Old    Tampa Wake (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       05-01-2014, 6:40 AM Reply   
Xstar thats was a brilliant summation.
Old     (Froggy)      Join Date: Nov 2013       05-01-2014, 6:55 AM Reply   
This is why its doubtful I will ever conciser another new boat . For 60-70k you have your choice of some of the best brands fully loaded and upgraded with under 100 hours . Just look at Chatts boats I think the last one only had 35 hours. Now that's a budget boat that you can be proud of. I would rather have a used like new Lexus than a new KIA .
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       05-01-2014, 7:11 AM Reply   
The last boat I sold was a 13 LSV with the standard motor, pimp trailer and full wetsounds system. It had under 40 hours on it and I sold it to a doctor in Alabama for low/mid 80's. I'm still trying to figure out what I'm going to do for a boat this year.
Old    Ian Brown (wakereviews)      Join Date: Sep 2006       05-01-2014, 7:22 AM Reply   
My 2014 F22 with upgraded ballast, 4 x REV8's, custom bimini and full LED work will be on sale at the end of the season for about the same as a base NXT
Old    L W (501s)      Join Date: Feb 2010       05-01-2014, 8:57 AM Reply   
I noticed that everyone is going off ONLY MSRP numbers. The problem with MSRP numbers is they mean NOTHING in the real world when actually purchasing. Virtually nothing. Each manufacturer will go below their MSRP numbers, but how much varies greatly from one manufacturer to another. I have personally noticed that the higher the MSRP of the boat (MC, CC, BU) the more room they have to move on the price versus a budget brand like Moomba. It's common to get 20-25% below MSRP on the big 3 (with some good negotiation), but you will not find a new Moomba or MB for 20-25% below MSRP.

In my mind MSRP means very little, and the true numbers come out when the dealers actually work with qualified buyers. There is no sense in them heavily discounting a boat just to make a point or from WW members just trying to compare prices.

The more expensive brands also cater to a "richer" clientele. For some of these customers price is less important than features or even the brand name. They aren't out on the water 5 days a week loading up their boats with 4k of ballast to wakeboard at 6 am. They bring out all their friend to party on Saturday afternoons and do a little boarding, surfing and tubing. Stereo's, HP and styling are more important. Some people like to say "I paid $120k for this boat, isn't it awesome", while others like to say "I saved $30k off the MSRP, I got such a great deal".

I guess in the end, I don't feel MSRP's mean much at all since no one ever pays that price and all manufacturers discount to some level. ACTUAL purchase prices for "non Bro deals" are what to base these off.

And you guys in the states don't know how lucky you are. With the exchange here in Canada, even a new Moomba is now going for mid 70's. Here is a new MB 23 listed for $85k: http://www.kijiji.ca/v-powerboat-mot...ationFlag=true
Old    MICAH HARPER (MICAH_HARPER)      Join Date: Apr 2010       05-01-2014, 9:02 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Froggy View Post
This is why its doubtful I will ever conciser another new boat . For 60-70k you have your choice of some of the best brands fully loaded and upgraded with under 100 hours . Just look at Chatts boats I think the last one only had 35 hours. Now that's a budget boat that you can be proud of. I would rather have a used like new Lexus than a new KIA .
Smilling ear to ear on this one.

I Got my 2012 Tomcat (in 2012) with under 100hrs for high 40s

Why buy something new when you can get a great wake at a lower price
Old    Mase (superair502)      Join Date: Mar 2010       05-01-2014, 9:10 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
The last boat I sold was a 13 LSV with the standard motor, pimp trailer and full wetsounds system. It had under 40 hours on it and I sold it to a doctor in Alabama for low/mid 80's. I'm still trying to figure out what I'm going to do for a boat this year.
Gotta go with the A24 man. I have been trouble finding time to go to work I love mine so much. Its like a bigger cleaner 230 wake.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       05-01-2014, 9:12 AM Reply   
+1 on the A24. Give the usual chattwake treatment and you'll be VERY impressed.

I'm surprised we're not seeing more A24s out there. I've been telling people, don't sleep on the A24. Compared to it's siblings, it's in a whole different league.
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       05-01-2014, 9:29 AM Reply   
Not to go too far off topic, but I was very curious about one thing...... And based on the above comments, I would be interested in having Chatt answer it. Chatt, you came from a 23LSV. Do you think the differences in the Axis line would bother you? Axis is a great boat, but I can certainly tell if I step out of a 23LSV, and into an A24. It may be a pointless thing to say, but I wouldn't be able to take that step down, without it bothering me.

The other thing I wonder about, is, with most of us upgrading every few years, does it bother you that the 3 year ownership on a price point boat, is essentially the same as a premium line boat? And in a lot of cases, I have seen the first 2 years ownership be less in one of "the big three". Obviously, this isn't the case, if you are going to keep the boat 5 or 10 years. Eventually, the cheaper boat, will certainly be cheaper to own.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       05-01-2014, 10:16 AM Reply   
I've owned an XStar, 3 SANTE 230's, 2 A22's, a VLX, and an LSV, as well as several other boats. The fit and finish of the LSV, VLX and SANTE 230's were somewhat better, in that there was more bling, more options, screens, etc. However, the Axis line has been, by far, the easiest to use, and my A22's held up very very well. By ease of use, I mean basic rocker switches, analog gauges, manual floating wedge, plug n play - just basic easy technology. You don't have to give someone who is not familiar with your boat a friggin 45minute tutorial on how to use it to give you a pull. To answer your question, I had no problem going to an Axis at all, because it was so much more affordable, and it gave me everything I needed out of a boat. One of the reasons I went with an LSV last year was I wanted surfgate. That, and I was able to get a more favorable build slot.

Presently, I really really want an A24, but I'm trying to find a demo or something in inventory. The only thing that may kill the A24 deal for me is that I moved up on top of a mountain, and that's a big heavy boat to pull up and down some steep grades. I picked up a '13 F150 platinum ecoboost a few months back, so I'm also not sure if an A24 would be too much for that truck (I used to pull my 230's with a modded '05 Ram 2500 with the Cummins).
Old    Eric (Fixable)      Join Date: Oct 2012       05-01-2014, 10:57 AM Reply   
All great points, and make perfect sense. In a perfect world, I wish the premium line boats had a full manual override option. A screen for the coolness and features, but also, a switch to select "manual mode" that would completely kick it over to a toggle and analog guage mode.
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       05-01-2014, 11:17 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixable View Post
All great points, and make perfect sense. In a perfect world, I wish the premium line boats had a full manual override option. A screen for the coolness and features, but also, a switch to select "manual mode" that would completely kick it over to a toggle and analog guage mode.
Supra?
Old    Rusty (Rusty)      Join Date: Mar 2014       05-01-2014, 11:18 AM Reply   
Supra does that with their touchscreen dash and then toggles that control everything too

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