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Old    Danny D (axxxiswake)      Join Date: Jun 2013       09-20-2013, 6:47 AM Reply   
Malibu was just awarded the patent for Surfgate:

http://www.malibuboats.com/news/pres...kesurfing.html

Things are going to get pretty interesting for Nautique
Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-20-2013, 7:02 AM Reply   
I think If Malibu sue's over Surf Gate. Fire Fox Should Sue Malibu
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Old    "G" (grant_west)      Join Date: Jun 2005       09-20-2013, 7:02 AM Reply   
Firefox Logo
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Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       09-20-2013, 7:30 AM Reply   
Lol, that's pretty funny.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       09-20-2013, 7:34 AM Reply   
I was curious, went to search for the patent, its not yet in the full text search for patents, I don't believe. But I did find a malibu patent from this year for this:

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...alibu+AND+surf

Isn't that describing the "CATS" system? A controlled adjustable fin in FRONT of the rudder? Could be wrong, patents are always fun to read.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       09-20-2013, 7:39 AM Reply   
I was curious to see how patent was written and if it would actually be a problem for NSS, but I can't find it. Def interesting.
Old    Bryan James (bjames)      Join Date: May 2012       09-20-2013, 9:11 AM Reply   
Good for Malibu... Be interesting to see what happends now. Although Malibu holds the patent, will other mfgs come out with their own and pay a licensing fee to Malibu? Like all other boat brands pay Nautique a $60 liscense fee for there towers.
Old    Jonathan Bay (john211)      Join Date: Aug 2008       09-20-2013, 9:23 AM Reply   
Malibu has a bunch of published applications on the surf gate. In the "advanced search" search option of the published application database, enter the query:

in/gasper and an/malibu

Probably the press release means that in at least one of the applications, the patent examiner has given an indication of something allowable ... which means that given time, a patent will issue (barring very unusual circumstances).
Old    Ty (wakeandsnow27)      Join Date: Jun 2004       09-20-2013, 10:50 AM Reply   
completely unrelated to surfgate...

The way I read ragboy's patent he posted is almost like a hydrofoil that could creat downforce of the boat when underway. Isn't that a very legitimate idea? basically weightless until movement. The pitch of this horizontal fin would pull the boat deeper or shallower into the water.

Am I missing something?
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       09-20-2013, 11:51 AM Reply   
Sounds like the wedge!!!!
Old    Chris (maxx_wake)      Join Date: Sep 2003       09-20-2013, 1:41 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by john211 View Post
Malibu has a bunch of published applications on the surf gate. In the "advanced search" search option of the published application database, enter the query:

in/gasper and an/malibu

Probably the press release means that in at least one of the applications, the patent examiner has given an indication of something allowable ... which means that given time, a patent will issue (barring very unusual circumstances).
Yeah, or just use Google patents. USPTO site is good for some things and you can look at PAIR info to determine examination history but their search function kind of sucks.

https://www.google.com/?tbm=pts#q=malibu+boat&tbm=pts
Old    Chris (maxx_wake)      Join Date: Sep 2003       09-20-2013, 1:54 PM Reply   
The other thing about patents is just because they are granted doesn't really mean they are valuable. The true test for a patent comes if it is they ever try to enforce it in court. An examiner who reviews hundreds of applications a year isnt going to do near as thorough of a prior art search as a team of lawyers for a company that may have millions of dollars on the line.
Old    Scott (scottb7)      Join Date: Oct 2012       09-20-2013, 3:10 PM Reply   
ok, let me be the first to say that i hope those bastards at nautique take right up the...i think they just imitated someone else's idea. it is not malibu that should kick their ass it is volvo

http://www.volvopentastore.com/QL-Tr...view_id.345015
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       09-20-2013, 5:42 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottb7 View Post
ok, let me be the first to say that i hope those bastards at nautique take right up the...i think they just imitated someone else's idea. It is not malibu that should kick their ass it is volvo

http://www.volvopentastore.com/ql-tr...view_id.345015
yeah! Burn em at the stake!
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       09-20-2013, 6:57 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxx_wake View Post
The other thing about patents is just because they are granted doesn't really mean they are valuable. The true test for a patent comes if it is they ever try to enforce it in court. An examiner who reviews hundreds of applications a year isnt going to do near as thorough of a prior art search as a team of lawyers for a company that may have millions of dollars on the line.
Also, whats up with NSS patent pending... Just because the chicken came before the egg here surfgate vs. bu doesn't mean (to me) that maybe the egg didn't come first - of course I don't know when bu applied for a patent vs. Nautique, but I am willing to wager they were probably at almost the same time. Someone at one company or another heard the other was doing X and they said "**** how can we use their idea to create our own patented system"... its more benchmarking than copying IMO... I don't think NSS is going to steal much business from Surfgate... could be wrong though.
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       09-23-2013, 12:55 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakebordr11 View Post
Also, whats up with NSS patent pending... Just because the chicken came before the egg here surfgate vs. bu doesn't mean (to me) that maybe the egg didn't come first - of course I don't know when bu applied for a patent vs. Nautique, but I am willing to wager they were probably at almost the same time. Someone at one company or another heard the other was doing X and they said "**** how can we use their idea to create our own patented system"... its more benchmarking than copying IMO... I don't think NSS is going to steal much business from Surfgate... could be wrong though.
Have you ever been behind a Nautique with NSS? It is so much better then Surfgate in so many ways. With Surfgate all you can do is weight the boat evenly and switch sides. With NSS you can do all that and adjust the waves length and height. I personally think it throws a better wake behind a G23 then any Malibu or Axis with it.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       09-23-2013, 1:00 PM Reply   
You can adjust wave length and height with NSS? So if I want say a 5 foot wave with a 10 foot pocket, what setting should i use?
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       09-23-2013, 1:17 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardman74 View Post
You can adjust wave length and height with NSS? So if I want say a 5 foot wave with a 10 foot pocket, what setting should i use?
You got like 9 feet of air that time.

James, NSS is adjustable - okay there is one significant difference. The rest, was just you and your opinion... Anyone have any additional info on the NSS patent? They could be two much different animals.
Old    Andrew Moreton (andrew_moreton)      Join Date: Feb 2003       09-23-2013, 1:35 PM Reply   
Malibu filed at least four patent applications on SurfGate and the USPTO recently filed Notices of Allowance in two of those applications while the other two applications are still pending.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       09-23-2013, 3:07 PM Reply   
Volvo Penta has had trim tabs using the same principle as NSS for many years. It drops a vertical panel into the water at the transom to build a fluid ramp which acts just like a trim tab making a mechanical ramp to change water flow. The only difference in the NSS is that it also projects sideways to push the hull as well as lift it some.
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       09-23-2013, 5:46 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakebordr11 View Post
You got like 9 feet of air that time.

James, NSS is adjustable - okay there is one significant difference. The rest, was just you and your opinion... Anyone have any additional info on the NSS patent? They could be two much different animals.
Wow, surprised people still remember that.
Old    Dave (schmo)      Join Date: Oct 2003       09-24-2013, 7:51 AM Reply   
I have not read the patent, but just because Malibu got a patent on Surfgate and has more pending patents, it doesn't mean that Nautique can't get their own patent and not be in violation. As someone else said as well, it isn't who came out with the idea to market first, it is who filed for the invention first, whether or not it was produced yet.

In addition, the devil here will be in the details. While the end concept may be the same which is the delayed convergence of the two wakes, the implementation of each is COMPLETELY different.

Malibu approached this with big flaps hanging off the back that rotate outwards. Nautique has plates mounted on the back, underside of the boat that slide out and down by an inch or so. They really are two completely different ways of achieving a result. It reminds me of the difference between a wakeplate and the old Nautique hydrogate. One is a flap that rotates down and the other is a plate that extends down.

Most patents that are awarded as of late do require detail to the implementation as the patent offices have been a little better and not just awarding vague and all encompassing patents.

It will be interesting. I am just glad I have the NSS on my boat already. They can't take it away and it works great.

Last edited by schmo; 09-24-2013 at 7:53 AM. Reason: typo edit
Old    Danny D (axxxiswake)      Join Date: Jun 2013       09-24-2013, 12:36 PM Reply   
Lawsuits coming.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       09-24-2013, 4:09 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by axxxiswake View Post
Lawsuits coming.
From whom?
Old    Danny D (axxxiswake)      Join Date: Jun 2013       10-07-2013, 6:41 AM Reply   
Malibu

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