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Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-03-2013, 8:43 AM Reply   
I just purchased a used 2012 boat from a dealer, the boat came with 4 rev 8's powered by a HT4 amp. By the looks of it is was not a dealer install (unclean wiring).

The issue I have is they seem very under powered, we were surfing yesterday and it was very disapoingting. My old kicker coaxials were louder and clearer at surf range then the rev's. so something is obviously wrong.

Is there anything obvoius I should be looking for with respect to how the speakers were wired?

Thanks everyone!
Old    Earmark Marine (david_e_m)      Join Date: Jul 2008       06-03-2013, 8:57 AM Reply   
In this case a 4-channel amplifier driving four 4-ohm speakers does not get the maximum power from the amplifier so you are definitely under-powered. You need a Wetsounds Syn2 at minimum to approach the potential of these speakers.

David
Earmark Marine
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       06-03-2013, 9:01 AM Reply   
That amp is not even close to the right power specs for (4) of those Rev8's. it would would great for 2 of them in bridged mode, but it's is awful for 4.

Depending on your budget I would suggest a Wetsounds SD 2, Syn 2, or Ppi 600.2.
That would be the way to go to power 4. That ht4 is tge completely wrong amp for powering 4 rev 8's. ......... wonder who suggested that or who wired that up.


If your budget is tight or you want to get out a few more times and have great sound before a new amp arrives take down two of those 8's. Run the other two in bridged mode(the Wetsounds manual will show you what that means) on the HT 4 ( which is a perfect match for 2 rev 8's) and they will blow you away. Hell you may even like it so much you sell the other 2 and buy a new board or vest or something.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       06-03-2013, 9:08 AM Reply   
^^ Exactly. I am in the process of putting 2 Rev8's on my tower pushed by a Ht-4. @300watts each I expect them to sound great. But 4 off the same amp...no way!
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-03-2013, 9:16 AM Reply   
Thanks guys,

Can't see me selling two of the speakers, thats like reducing ballast....

I will disconnect two and bridge the two remaining until I get the proper power to them.

So a Syn @ at a minimum?

can you suggest a good, better, best? option form me?.. I am unfamiliar with preciscion power, I am however a fan of JL audio amps.

Would there be any value in adding a second HT4 (each amp bridged and powering two speakers) or should I just replace the HT4 with something else.

as a side note the sub is powered by a SYN Micro and it kicks very well.

Thanks again everyone.
Old    Earmark Marine (david_e_m)      Join Date: Jul 2008       06-03-2013, 9:39 AM Reply   
A single Syn2, single SD2 or dual HT-4s give you three great options in the Wetsounds line.
The ideal set-up from JL Audio for two pair Rev8s is twin bridged XD400/4 which as tested would produce 4 X 280 watts at 14.4 volts or 4 X 200 watts at 12.5 volts. However, that makes no sense when you can add a single Wetsounds HT-4 to what you already have.

David
Earmark Marine
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-03-2013, 9:46 AM Reply   
Thanks a bunch Dave,

it sound like the buggest bang for the buck is just to add a second HT4.

Thanks again!
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       06-03-2013, 9:51 AM Reply   
Give a rundown of what you got in the boat now. Maybe you can salvage the ht4 and run it to your inboats if they don't have any extra power and power the sub. Again all dependson what you have

Not knowing the JL line specs very well in my memory without looking them up........ My list above would go like this. SD2at the top, The Syn 2 and PPI 600.2 can be argued both ways. You get a better quality amp with higher end materials along with some better features going with the SYN 2. However you sacrifice some output from the wattage difference compared to the PPI. To me the features materials, customer service, and quality outweigh the wattage and thus push it ahead. Some others may argue that the wattage from the ppi push it ahead. What can't be argued is that for the budget concious PPI makes a hell of an amp. Arc audio is another above avg amp mfg to keep in mind. There are a few at the top for the marine industry JL and Wetsounds being the most publicized and ready available in the marine industry,but there are a ton of options at the mid level. Since you mentioned JL the Wetsounds stuff is right up on par with them in sound quality and build. I won't go into all the other saw ery one has their fav mid level stuff.


A second ht 4 is an option but now we are talking re wiring and really you can get what dual ht 4 amps offer in a single amp solution

Last edited by xstarrider; 06-03-2013 at 9:58 AM.
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-03-2013, 10:09 AM Reply   
Swat guy...

Will do, I just got this thing and will dig around later today (once the rain stops) and come up with a comprehensive list..

Again, thanks everyone... electronics are a science and I want the Rev's to perform like they should.
Old    Chase Tillett (tn_rider)      Join Date: Dec 2009       06-03-2013, 11:10 AM Reply   
I'm not sure what model it is but I have a buddy with 4 pro 80's on a Precision Power amp and is not happy with it AT ALL. In two songs it goes into protect and the tower speakers shut off. However, it only does this with the boat off. With it running it takes about 5-6 songs to send it into protect. Mostly happens when wakeboarding or in tie ups.
Old    Earmark Marine (david_e_m)      Join Date: Jul 2008       06-03-2013, 11:30 AM Reply   
With two HT-4s you do need eight conductors up the tower. With one HT-4 running four discrete channels there is probably eight conductors run now. The dealer could have bridged the amplifier and seriesed the speakers for the identical output and used only four conductors but I suspect that's not the case from any dealer who choose that amp-speaker combo. It's easily confirmed though.

David
Earmark Marine
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       06-03-2013, 11:59 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by tn_rider View Post
I'm not sure what model it is but I have a buddy with 4 pro 80's on a Precision Power amp and is not happy with it AT ALL. In two songs it goes into protect and the tower speakers shut off. However, it only does this with the boat off. With it running it takes about 5-6 songs to send it into protect. Mostly happens when wakeboarding or in tie ups.
There are way too many variables on why that can happen. Voltage drops , incorrect wire sizes , wrong speaker wiring schematics, bad batteries......way too many to even count , but that's definite something that needs to be worked on and tracked down pronto.
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-03-2013, 12:38 PM Reply   
Ok I went and took an inventory, and this is what I found... again sorry and thanks this boat is very new to me:

Cabin 6 @ wetsounds XS 650's
Tower speakers 4 @ rev 8's
Sub = wetsounds ss10b

Amps

1 HT6 (not 4) amp (looks like it running the cabin and the tower
1 SYN MICRO running the sub

to my untrained eye it apears that he is asking wayyyy to much out of the one amp
Attached Images
 
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       06-03-2013, 1:18 PM Reply   
Thats a killer system in there completely missing the mark with power. Even with an HT6 Befrore I make a suggestion are you sure the cabin speakers are xs 650's and not xs 65's. They look similar, but are completely different in requirements and sound. All that money on top of the line gear and no attention to power ratings is a travesty.

Last edited by xstarrider; 06-03-2013 at 1:25 PM.
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-03-2013, 1:33 PM Reply   
Xstar, I will pop one out, and have a look to make sure....

Thanks again
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       06-03-2013, 1:41 PM Reply   
Man, 2 pairs of REV8's and 3 pairs of XS650's with that little power seems crazy. I would run the 6 interiors off the HT-6, buy 2 HT-4's for the tower, replace the 10" sub with an XS12 and power it with an HT-2 if you want to keep it all wetsounds.
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       06-03-2013, 1:44 PM Reply   
Are you sure that is a syn-micro? It looks kind of big compared to that HT-6. The micro is only 8x5 which is a little more than half the size of the HT6.
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       06-03-2013, 1:48 PM Reply   
good call bill I didnt even see that second amp in there. Also the micros are silver/grey
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-03-2013, 2:07 PM Reply   
Hi Bill,

Yes its a Syn Micro, or at least thats what is printed on the side of it and it is about 8x5

I pulled a cabin speaker, no markings on the back as to which model but based on the size (depth) of the magnet compared to wetsound's webpage its the 650

Thanks again everyone
Attached Images
 
Old    Swatguy (xstarrider)      Join Date: Jun 2007       06-03-2013, 2:11 PM Reply   
I try to use the least amount of amps in my systems. Just my personal preference, some guys like each component on different amps IE tower speakers, subs, interiors. Just personal preference.

XS650 scenario


Lets assume you have XS 650's in there. I would run the 6 inboats on the front 4 channels of the HT6, run the sub off the two remainig channels in bridged mode and ditch the micro. You're a little light on the power with 4 of the 6 speakers only seeing 75watts RMS a piece and the other 2 getting the optimal at 110watts rms . you are right on target with the sub getting 300 in bridged mode off the HT6 Now you can add that JL 2 Channel or SD2 or Syn 2 ETC and still only run 2 amps. This scenario doesnt give you exactly the peak output you can get, but its dam close and requires minimal re wiring and changes.

The most optimal is to run all 6 inboats off the HT6 now every speaker is getting a solid 110watts RMS. Now your sub is getting what it needs with the Micro, and you add a 3rd amp again of the previously mentoned dedicated to the REV 8's. However this is gonna require some rewiring, more parts, much more space on your amp rack (possibly an entirely new fabbed amp rack to hold all 3) re location of a few different things. IT can be done if you want to tackle it. You can pay someone to do it. This option gives you the optimal power to everything.

Will you notice the 75 watts vs 110 to those 4 speakers in this situation. If you ask me NO! Reason being is you have 4 rev 8's on the tower. If those didn't exist then yes I would highly recommend the second pairing because without tower speakers it would be more noticeable. Again I prefer the 2 amp scenario if it were my boat even with the XS 650's, but others may opt for the 3rd amp. For me all the extra work and $$ wouldn't add up to the power gain in this scenario in my eyes.


Now in the event you have XS 65's
The first scenario with ditching the micro, running the HT6 for the inboats and sub with a second amp for the towers will put you in the perfect power range and most optimal configuration with only two amps.

Last edited by xstarrider; 06-03-2013 at 2:15 PM.
Old    TigeMike (chpthril)      Join Date: Oct 2007       06-03-2013, 3:20 PM Reply   
I would add another HT-6 in this configuration:

HT-6 #1
Chnl 1/2 bridged Rev-8 = 300W
chnl 3/4 bridged rev-8 = 300W
bow speakers on 5 and 6 = 110W each and gain-matched to the 4 main cabin

HT-6 #2
Chnl 1/2 bridged Rev-8 = 300W
chnl 3/4 bridged rev-8 = 300W
Port side mid and aft speaker chnl 5 = 75W each
STBD side mid and aft speaker chnl 6 = 75W each

Leave the sub on the Micro or move the bow speakers to the Micro and bridge the sub on HT-6 #1 chnls 5/6

OR

6 in-boats on HT-6
Sub on Micro
Syn-2 or SD-2 for 2 pair Rev-8

Another variation would be to run the 6 in-boats and sub on a single HT-6, Syn-2 or SD-2 for the 2 pair Rev-8 and leave out the Micro

I would not sweat whether the in-boats are 65's or 650's. the 65's will handle the 110W from a HT-6 just fine and the 650's still sound great with 75W rms. $.02
Old    Earmark Marine (david_e_m)      Join Date: Jul 2008       06-03-2013, 3:43 PM Reply   
I like a 6-channel amplifier set-up where you run no more than four of the six channels into either a bridged 4-ohm load or stereo 2-ohm load (same load) and leave two channels running stereo at 4-ohms. The power supply will thank you come July/August. Now if you are running a larger SD6 on the conservative side then it's a walk in the park. But an HT-6 is likely to be run much closer to its full capacity.
The XS-65 has a W-Dome which is easy to identify. The XS-65i has a 0.75" full dome. The XS-650 has a 1.0" full dome. It sure looks like an XS-650 to me.

David
Earmark Marine
Old    Bill Smeltzer (runin90lx)      Join Date: Sep 2009       06-03-2013, 6:29 PM Reply   
can anyone tell me what speakers these are by this pic?

also what amps these are?

i noticed this past weekend that the stereo doesnt sound very good in boat, and im sure it just needs a good tuning or changing the way everything is setup. it sounds as almost all the sound is coming from tower speakers, the sub doesnt have any bass at all. i am not very stereo savy so if someone could give me a rough rundown of what to look for it would be much appreciated. i have 6 in cabin speakers(shown), sub(pretty sure its a xs 10-fa), and 2 rev 8 tower speakers

Last edited by runin90lx; 06-03-2013 at 6:35 PM.
Old    TigeMike (chpthril)      Join Date: Oct 2007       06-03-2013, 6:47 PM Reply   
What year is that MB? If a 2012 or 2013, im betting they are the XS-65. The amps are the Wet sounds HT series. The lower is the HT-6 and the upper looks to be the HT-2. The sub is the XS-10fa.

Yes, the 4 8" Rev-8 HLCDS will over power the in-boats volume wise, but this is different from not sounding good sound quality wise. I would check the fade position in the head-unit. One of those amps will be on the front and the other will be on the rear. The fade position can effect the volume of the in-boats and sub its its biased toward the tower amp. using the fade will also allow you to listen to each zone without the other.

You will want to pull the sub and add a foam gasket to its mounting surface to fix the leak. This will improve its sound. That location is not completely flat, to the sub does not sit flat, allowing the air leak.

I would do this first before getting into the amp settings.
Old    Bill Smeltzer (runin90lx)      Join Date: Sep 2009       06-03-2013, 6:51 PM Reply   
it is a 2013 MB. and the stock radio is a clarion (m502 maybe..its the bluetooth one). its a major pain in the ass to operate thats for sure!
Old    Bill Smeltzer (runin90lx)      Join Date: Sep 2009       06-03-2013, 6:52 PM Reply   
tige mike..i guess i may should have started my own thread but didnt see the need since its basically the same question the OP had. but i only have 2 rev 8 tower speakers
Old    TigeMike (chpthril)      Join Date: Oct 2007       06-03-2013, 6:55 PM Reply   
^^ No problem, doesnt change much as they will still be loud.
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-04-2013, 8:27 AM Reply   
So I think the idea of running the cabin speakers and the sub off of the HT6 and adding a Syn 2 for the tower speakers is the route I am going to go. This way the fade control on the deck will let me seperate the volume from the cabin and the boat.

I am thinking if I run a third amp, logically I will need to add something like the 420 eq to control the sounds better.

One more question I have is (sorry if this seems silly) would it be better to buy a 4ch amp for the speakers (Syn4), as there is four tower speakers?

R
Old    TigeMike (chpthril)      Join Date: Oct 2007       06-04-2013, 8:47 AM Reply   
Zap,

The WS-420SQ will give you 3 zone volume control and dual EQ function with the current HT-6 driving 4 in-boats and sub and new tower amp. You would not need to expand to a 3rd amp to take advantage of what the WS-420SQ has to offer.

A 4 chnl like the Syn-4 would deliver 125W rms to each of your 4 tower speakers. The 2 chnl Syn-2 will deliver 175W rms to each of your four tower speakers. Go with the Syn-2.
Old    rzap (zap)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-04-2013, 9:04 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chpthril View Post
Zap,

The WS-420SQ will give you 3 zone volume control and dual EQ function with the current HT-6 driving 4 in-boats and sub and new tower amp. You would not need to expand to a 3rd amp to take advantage of what the WS-420SQ has to offer.

A 4 chnl like the Syn-4 would deliver 125W rms to each of your 4 tower speakers. The 2 chnl Syn-2 will deliver 175W rms to each of your four tower speakers. Go with the Syn-2.
Thanks Mike,

Now I am leaning towards adding the HT6 as a third amp

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