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Old     (chubbychaser55)      Join Date: Mar 2013       03-12-2013, 8:08 PM Reply   
Hey fellas, new to wake world and have a few boats to consider. I have narrowed down my search to some value boats 1. 2009 tige z1 2. 2011 supra 21v 3. New 2013 moomba lsv. They are all within $5k and I could use some feedback since I'm not familiar with the quality and pros cons. Any feedback is much appreciated.
Old    Detox (bass10after)      Join Date: Feb 2010       03-12-2013, 8:24 PM Reply   
probably should do a search on here, these questions get asked a lot... a lot lot. They almost always turn into fiasco and ultimately the decision comes down to what you like, not what everyone else thinks. You have three good options in front of you, drive em all and take your pick.
Old    Bryce Pool (bryce2320)      Join Date: May 2012       03-12-2013, 8:36 PM Reply   
Piece of mind from a brand new boat would be nice, along with the warranty. What are your plans with the boat? Im sure youll get a lot of opinions on this since its still winter
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       03-12-2013, 9:46 PM Reply   
There is a new tige z1 out... I'd take the 21v personally but brand new would be great too
Old    Jeff Hill (hillbilly)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-12-2013, 10:02 PM Reply   
I have a 2007 LSV and it has been trouble free.
The new Moomba has the same running surface as mine but different top cap. So deeper and seating is a bit different.
With extra weight the wake is good. Not the biggest or best but plenty big with a good shape.
Supra and Moomba are both made by Skiers Choice, But Supra has more bling.

My boat has held up well,And I've ran it slammed more often then not.
But remember a new boat with a bad dealer is sometimes worse then a used boat with no warranty......
Good Luck with your decision!!!!!
Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       03-12-2013, 11:11 PM Reply   
alright, who's going to be "that guy" first.....

(I think I know which boat that is not on his list will be suggested first...)
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 3:51 AM Reply   
Nothing against Tige but I think you should rule it out. It is the smallest of the boats you listed. The 21V is a couple of inches shorter but wider than the LSV and has a larger capacity rating. If the 21V came with some upgrades like tower speakers, Perfect Pass, and ballast, then that would be my choice. It really depends on the options between the two. The 21V will have a better looking interior also.
Old    Axis22            03-13-2013, 4:22 AM Reply   
If you just want a nasty wake for boarding and surfing and are looking for a great price for a brand new boat I would look at the Axis A22 you want find a better wake for the price on a new boat. Keeps a simple dash layout that is simple to use and slick looking but the wake packs a serious punch and has reliable Engine and Malibu Build Quality makes it a boat you should Definitely look at.
Old    SS (illini88)      Join Date: Oct 2007       03-13-2013, 5:26 AM Reply   
How are the hours on the used boats? Also, how are they optioned.? I think in some years different companies have used different speed controls. And, of course, color/gell scheme Unless the tige is the cheapest or has crazy low hours', I'd probably rule it out due to the age in comparison to the others. Sounds like a fun choice to make.
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 5:45 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Axis22 View Post
If you just want a nasty wake for boarding and surfing and are looking for a great price for a brand new boat I would look at the Axis A22 you want find a better wake for the price on a new boat. Keeps a simple dash layout that is simple to use and slick looking but the wake packs a serious punch and has reliable Engine and Malibu Build Quality makes it a boat you should Definitely look at.
I agree with this statement. The A22 is hard to beat for the price.
Old     (chubbychaser55)      Join Date: Mar 2013       03-13-2013, 7:20 AM Reply   
z1 200hrs z tower with speakers 41k, 21v 400 hrs digi screen no tower spkrs 46k, new lsv 46-47k w/crap trailer really don't need it
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 8:50 AM Reply   
I'd go new all the way. I was in the same situation last fall and we decided to raise the budget a little and go new. The piece of ind was worth it for the few dollars more.

Tim, how is a Z1 smaller than an LSV? The new one is WAY bigger and even the older hull was deeper and felt bigger than an Mobius LSV. We are talkign a Moomba LSV(21) here not a Malibu LSV(23). The 21V is bigger.
Old    MICAH HARPER (MICAH_HARPER)      Join Date: Apr 2010       03-13-2013, 8:56 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny_defacto View Post
alright, who's going to be "that guy" first.....

(I think I know which boat that is not on his list will be suggested first...)
Heck i will.....GET A MB!!!!!!
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 11:10 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardman74 View Post
I'd go new all the way. I was in the same situation last fall and we decided to raise the budget a little and go new. The piece of ind was worth it for the few dollars more.

Tim, how is a Z1 smaller than an LSV? The new one is WAY bigger and even the older hull was deeper and felt bigger than an Mobius LSV. We are talkign a Moomba LSV(21) here not a Malibu LSV(23). The 21V is bigger.
Moomba Mobius LSV 2013 Specs
Length: 216
Beam: 97
People: 13
Load capacity: 1,800 lb.
Fuel: 39 gal.
Dry weight: 3,800 lb.
Standard ballast: 1,800 lb.
Max ballast: 1,800 lb.
Standard engine: Electronic fuel injection 330 HP V-8
Max horsepower: 450

Supra Launch 21 V 2011
Length: 21 ft. 4 in.
Width: 99 in.
Passengers: 14
Load capacity: 1,950 lbs
Dry weight: 3,800 lbs
Fuel capacity: 50 gal.
Standard ballast: 1,450 lbs.
Max factory ballast: 1,450 lbs.
Standard engine: Indmar Assault 5.7L 325 hp EFI
Max horsepower: 409

Tige Z1 - 2010 (Couldn't find stats for an 09)
People: 11
Dry weight: 3,714 lb.
Fuel capacity: 38 gal.
Length: 21 ft.
Width: 8 ft. 4 in.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 12:27 PM Reply   
The person capacity on the Tige is 16 and the beam is 100". Making it the widest and deepest of the bunch. May be the shortest, but surely not the smallest inside. I have been in all 3 of those boats and would own any one of them. IMO the mobius will feel the smallest.
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 12:36 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardman74 View Post
The person capacity on the Tige is 16 and the beam is 100". Making it the widest and deepest of the bunch. May be the shortest, but surely not the smallest inside. I have been in all 3 of those boats and would own any one of them. IMO the mobius will feel the smallest.
Everything I am reading says it has 11 people capacity.

http://www.boattest.com/boats/boat_video.aspx?id=1857
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 12:39 PM Reply   
http://www.tigeowners.com/model_specs.php
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 12:40 PM Reply   
I stand corrected was looking at the one next door to it. 10 it is!!
Old     (chubbychaser55)      Join Date: Mar 2013       03-13-2013, 1:11 PM Reply   
yeah if I could get a 50k plus boat it would be an MB hands down. The budget for now is mid 40s and I would like to get the 21v but I probably could get the tige for 39-40k right now so im just not sure if the 21v is worth the extra 7-8k. Just fishing for opinions.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       03-13-2013, 1:40 PM Reply   
What about loan rates of new vs used, or you have a method of paying without financing?
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 2:14 PM Reply   
That could be a factor too. Rates on new are sure alot better than used at most banks/Credit Unions.
Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       03-13-2013, 3:27 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MICAH_HARPER View Post
Heck i will.....GET A MB!!!!!!
Thanks Micah... that's what I was waiting for, but unfortunately Seth Graham beat you to it, is whoring out Axis (not just this thread), but is being totally serious, unfortunately.

I am with Boardman... I was looking at used VLX's, then decided to spend another 5K and get a brand new, built for me boat that has a full warranty. Worth it to me.
Old    Chris Walker (redsupralaunch)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-13-2013, 3:33 PM Reply   
If the '09 Tige does not have engine w/ CAT and o2 sensors like both the '11 Supra and '13 Moomba, then scratch that off your list. My guess the 09 Tige does not because PCM engines as $ upcharged way too much before mandated by EPA. There is at least 10% but 20% better fuel economy based on my experience with the CAT/o2 set up. Surfing behind a non-cat sucks and is worse for those in the boat.

Be careful comparing how much capacity a boat is rated. Supra/Moomba changed reporting how ballast effects capacity in 2013 - the rating is now with full ballast + capacity rating to meet the upcoming capacity reporting mandate for 2015.

I have owned 10 Supra/Moomba and it would be a difficult choice between the 11 Supra 21V and the 13 Moomba LSV. Both are now very deep boats and both bows ride high in water which is a great thing. I personally love the way the Supra 21V drives but the wake is pretty steep when compared other boats, but not near a bad as the old Nautques. The wake of the Moomba LSV has a longer transition - everyone will like it. Both will have automatic ballast controlled from a display and both will have wakeshaper plate but the Supra is intergrated with ballast setting to give best hole shot and automatically adjusts, so its out of sight & out of mind. Both Supra/Moomba really stepped up upolstry for 2013, so the new Moomba will almost be as good as the older Supra except its newer. You did not say if the 11Supra 21V was a walk-thu bow or playpen seating, but you are not stuck on one or the other I would get the new boat as the forward tower on the moomba is more of an uptated look and you will get a new warranty.
Old    Axis22            03-13-2013, 4:56 PM Reply   
Wow Johnny I since some hostility it's all personal Preference I have never even heard of mb boats until I joined this form a few months ago O maybe it's because I can't find a dealer in the state of GA and I am not buying with no dealer around me. Maybe the state of ga does not allow Mechanically crappy boats to be sold. LOL
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-13-2013, 4:59 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by redsupralaunch View Post
If the '09 Tige does not have engine w/ CAT and o2 sensors like both the '11 Supra and '13 Moomba, then scratch that off your list. My guess the 09 Tige does not because PCM engines as $ upcharged way too much before mandated by EPA. There is at least 10% but 20% better fuel economy based on my experience with the CAT/o2 set up. Surfing behind a non-cat sucks and is worse for those in the boat.

Be careful comparing how much capacity a boat is rated. Supra/Moomba changed reporting how ballast effects capacity in 2013 - the rating is now with full ballast + capacity rating to meet the upcoming capacity reporting mandate for 2015.

I have owned 10 Supra/Moomba and it would be a difficult choice between the 11 Supra 21V and the 13 Moomba LSV. Both are now very deep boats and both bows ride high in water which is a great thing. I personally love the way the Supra 21V drives but the wake is pretty steep when compared other boats, but not near a bad as the old Nautques. The wake of the Moomba LSV has a longer transition - everyone will like it. Both will have automatic ballast controlled from a display and both will have wakeshaper plate but the Supra is intergrated with ballast setting to give best hole shot and automatically adjusts, so its out of sight & out of mind. Both Supra/Moomba really stepped up upolstry for 2013, so the new Moomba will almost be as good as the older Supra except its newer. You did not say if the 11Supra 21V was a walk-thu bow or playpen seating, but you are not stuck on one or the other I would get the new boat as the forward tower on the moomba is more of an uptated look and you will get a new warranty.
I would agree with this. For wakeboarding, I would definitely take a look at the Axis A22 and compare the two. The price points should be close if you find a slightly used Axis.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       03-13-2013, 7:50 PM Reply   
chubbychaser55, I don't know where you are from but you are boing to get many MY BOAT comments. If you can test drive those three boats you will quickly notice the differences and be able to decide which features are best suited for you. The Supra and Moomba are very similar in the mechanicals but when you ride in them you will notice why they charge more for the Supra. The Tige feels quite different from the other two and you may or may not like that. Test drive if you can and you will quickly get better answers than everyones opinions because they are not you.
People generally love their own boat, of course, because it is what they decided to spend their money on. Just filter their comments with that in mind. Except if I tell you to look at my boat because it's better than any of those mentioned above.
Old    Drew Richardson (surffresh)      Join Date: Jun 2010       03-14-2013, 6:30 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Axis22 View Post
Wow Johnny I since some hostility it's all personal Preference I have never even heard of mb boats until I joined this form a few months ago O maybe it's because I can't find a dealer in the state of GA and I am not buying with no dealer around me. Maybe the state of ga does not allow Mechanically crappy boats to be sold. LOL
So you found the forum a few months ago? Have never heard of MB and go on to say that they are mechanically crappy ? The OP must have seen one and got to see the quality or perhaps even had a chance to ride / demo one. I have MB's in Orlando and Charlotte and will bet the farm that if you have the chance you will then understand why it's a" hands down" choice for the OP and many others.
Old    Dave (davenk)      Join Date: Feb 2008       03-14-2013, 10:55 AM Reply   
chubbychaser 55 - (haha) Opinions are like @#$^% and everybody has one, here is mine... I have an 09 Z1 - got it new and love it. Size is great for me. I did not want a larger boat. We usually take 4-6 people on the boat (sometimes 7 or 8) and have plenty of room. The wakeboard wake is great, the surf wake is great, no real bad exhaust smell. We have the PCM 343=plenty of power. It does real good on gas. Usually use about 1/4 to 1/2 tank with 4 riders. 3 sets with some surfing. We have the factory 900 lbs ballast ant have added a 750 lb bag for surfing. We also added the surf pockets in the bimini to hold the surf boards. We have the Alpha Z tower as well. At the time we looked at Supra/Moomba and felt that construction was better on the Tige, we liked the deeper floorboard and overall fit and finish. Maybe the newer Supra/Moomba are better, I have no idea. We have over 200 hours on our boat and it has been flawless. Cruise (Tige Speedset) works great. Easy to drive etc. There is a reason a 3 year old boat is as much as a brand new boat of another brand - JS Happy shopping
Old    Sam Miller (boss409)      Join Date: Mar 2013       03-14-2013, 10:56 AM Reply   
Drew: What makes them good besides the price and what makes them a mechanically sound vessel? Seems like you would loose something with all other brands being significantly higher in price. If they are so great why are there only two dealers on the east coast? If they were a big company like malibu, skiers choice, mastercraft or centurion seems like they would be more spread over the country. And I was wondering why they dont have the NMMA certification? I heard from a dealer that they dont have any foam flotation, as well no ball valves where water enters the boat, in case of any failures. Is that true? Could just be speculation.
Old    Drew Richardson (surffresh)      Join Date: Jun 2010       03-14-2013, 1:41 PM Reply   
Sam, this thread is not about me or MB, my response was to Axis22's unfounded bash. I believe TX MC sold around the 50 + or - mark of MB's last year, our AL dealer sold 5+ at this years show, that should answer a lot of your questions. And to the OP.... happy shopping and I am sure that you can turn the thread around because plenty of us are curious as to what you choose.
Old    MLO (cbarguy1)      Join Date: Dec 2012       03-14-2013, 1:51 PM Reply   
The uglyness took longer than usual this time. Maybe we're growing up.
Old    Axis22            03-14-2013, 6:03 PM Reply   
Surfresh the lol Meant I was joking around but Obviously you toke it a little to Serious and since you are in sale for mb and toke comment to heart maybe they are a crappy product and you are sick of the MC, Supra, Nautique and Malibu boat company's that have been building boat 10 + years longer and have 10 times as many dealers around US out selling MB every year😩
P.S I have never seen at a pro wake event a MB boat towing the pro's just saying. And I don't care what he buys I don't sell boats and have nothing to gain from him buying an AXIS I was just telling him of a reasonable price wakeboard boat
Old    Jeff Hill (hillbilly)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-14-2013, 6:13 PM Reply   
MB's are a West Coast boat, Great qaulity just not a big market share.
I know a few owners of them and they love them.
Axis,MB, Moomba are all good boats.......but they are price point boats.
And they save money in different places....
Axis have great wakes
MB has great wakes
Moomba has good/great wakes....to each his own.
Old    Axis22            03-14-2013, 6:31 PM Reply   
They look sweet hillbilly Except the tower looks like something that would be an aftermarket add on for a 1997 bay liner. Just my Opinion
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       03-14-2013, 7:58 PM Reply   
Axis must save a lot by not including a full windshield...
Old    Jeff Hill (hillbilly)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-14-2013, 10:18 PM Reply   
^^^^LOL^^^^^
I like the wakes on Axis,but not a fan of the looks of the boat.
And MB towers are not the best looking.....but I own an 07 Moomba so I guess I'm supposed to say its the best........lol.

Any of the boats he's looking at would be nice to own, They all would need extra ballast and they all have different positives and negatives.....tough choice!
Go with your gut........
Old    Axis22            03-15-2013, 1:17 AM Reply   
I love not having a full Windshield when pulling up next to dock and grabbing things off dock. Lol
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       03-15-2013, 7:03 AM Reply   
How fun is it repeatedly taking it in the face from splashes and wind spray and if anyone is ever surfing goofy? Does AXIS offer a full windshield as an option?
Old    David Langston (rdlangston13)      Join Date: Feb 2011       03-15-2013, 7:31 AM Reply   
The supra will have a more consistent wake and will be less finicky than the Moomba. No clue how the wake is on the tige


Sent from my iPhone
Old    Erik Forinash (4Nash)      Join Date: May 2011       03-15-2013, 8:04 AM Reply   
We have a 2011 Moomba LSV and it's been great! It does everything we need it to do...surfs well and we can fill 4000lbs all plumbed with NO visible bags.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Old    Miguel (migs)      Join Date: Aug 2006       03-15-2013, 8:17 AM Reply   
buy a brand new sanger V215.
Old    Sam Miller (boss409)      Join Date: Mar 2013       03-15-2013, 8:43 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by surffresh View Post
Sam, this thread is not about me or MB, my response was to Axis22's unfounded bash. I believe TX MC sold around the 50 + or - mark of MB's last year, our AL dealer sold 5+ at this years show, that should answer a lot of your questions. And to the OP.... happy shopping and I am sure that you can turn the thread around because plenty of us are curious as to what you choose.
Well that really answered my questions. MasterCraft of Texas sold fifty, and Alabama sold five. I guess outta the seven million people in the 50mi area around dallas there are 50 suckers. I felt like i was giving u an opportunity to tell more about the MB boats and what makes them a good boat besides the cost. Maybe u miss understood my questions. But if you go by the fact that some MBs have sold here and there and thats all the information needed to make a 50,000 boat purchase, i guess we all could go get yugos, pintos, or maybe a pontiac aztek. I was simply saying what I was told by a dealer, when I asked them about the MB line.
Old    Jeff Hill (hillbilly)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-15-2013, 9:22 AM Reply   
^^^^^ If you believe what a dealer told you about a boat they dont sell.....HERES YOUR SIGN!!!!!
And if said dealer does sell MB's and bash them they must be trying to upsell a more expensive brand.

I love my Moomba it does what I ask it to do.
Old    Jeff Hill (hillbilly)      Join Date: Aug 2002       03-15-2013, 9:27 AM Reply   
Oh and Erik where do you have 4k hidden?
I run 750's in the rear and a triangle sac on top of the bow cushions. Did you put 1100's in the lockers?
Old    Tim (dezul)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-15-2013, 9:35 AM Reply   
This thread needs to die. The original poster of the thread has not came back to it to comment. Just let it die.
Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       03-15-2013, 3:19 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakebordr11 View Post
How fun is it repeatedly taking it in the face from splashes and wind spray and if anyone is ever surfing goofy? Does AXIS offer a full windshield as an option?

lol at those of you who ride in really windy conditions... and those of you who surf.

I never have been splashed in my face in any boat, and def not my Axis. Looks are subjective, so I could see that some will hate the style, but function is mainly objective, and the design of the open side is really functional.

Malibu uses the same exact windshield, but adds the sides to it, obviously, for all the malibu lines. Due to the axis tower, you could not add the side windows unless you moved the tower back a foot or so.

Once I was in havasu in white caps and side wind and my right arm was being sprayed with some water so I just used my buddies master craft t shirt to block the spray because mastercraft makes everything better than every other company... even t shirts
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-15-2013, 4:00 PM Reply   
Was the T-shirt thicker than all other T-shirts? Must have had 30% more water stopping power too!!
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       03-15-2013, 5:45 PM Reply   
Don't you mean 30% more cotton than other manufacturers t shirts?
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-15-2013, 5:53 PM Reply   
That too.
Old     (chubbychaser55)      Join Date: Mar 2013       03-15-2013, 7:01 PM Reply   
thanks for all the input fellas, I ended up with the tige mainly because of price and the thing has barely been used. I didn't get any negative feedback about tige either so hopefully it will be a reliable boat. Take it easy and don't bicker so much that's what wives are for!
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       03-15-2013, 7:23 PM Reply   
Nice man, post some pics!
Old    Jordan Leininger (jordanleininger21)      Join Date: Aug 2012       03-16-2013, 6:10 AM Reply   
Post some pics when you have decided. Good luck man!
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       03-16-2013, 3:02 PM Reply   
Head over to tigeowners.com. Lot of great info and knowledgable people.

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