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Old    Dan Yeoh (biomaster)      Join Date: Jan 2013       01-29-2013, 5:45 AM Reply   
Chasing a new wakeboard to replace my old 05' model hyperlite era.

The boat I usually ride behind is aluminium and doesn't have the biggest of wakes, so i was wondering what board I would be best off buying.

Would I be better off with a 3stage rocker to give me the most pop straight off the wake, or a continuous rocker to give me a longer jump?

Im currently thinking of either 2013 Hyperlite Marek Bio or Ronix One Time Bomb/Mondello.

With my current setup, I can just go W2W, but havent seemed to be able to go out onto the flats no matter how hard I try yet.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       01-29-2013, 5:50 AM Reply   
My old era was great for a ski boat wake...

Straight up pop for sure. No tricks take length over height... Look at a ronix one or a slingshot recoil 2 agressive popping 3 stagers
Old    MICAH HARPER (MICAH_HARPER)      Join Date: Apr 2010       01-29-2013, 9:42 AM Reply   
i would think a 3stage...i got a Ronix Mana this winter...havnt rode it yet but it is suppose to have huge vertical pop..because of the late rocker....but like i said i havnt rode it yet...so im just informing you of what it is suppose to do.
Old    Austin (austin)      Join Date: Apr 2010       01-29-2013, 10:43 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by simplej View Post
Straight up pop for sure. No tricks take length over height... Look at a ronix one or a slingshot recoil 2 agressive popping 3 stagers
In my opinion and based on my experience, I kind of disagree with you. Certainly pop is good, but for small wake I would never recommend sacrificing any speed for pop. All tricks require length if you want to make it over the second wake, so I would say being able to go wake to wake is first priority over being concerned about height.

Small wakes often have the added disadvantage of not having a tower. If the tow point is further back, then you have a shorter approach relative to the width of the wake compared to riding with a tower. In my experience, yes, I know that you CAN go wake to wake on a small wake with no tower using a slow three-stage board (e.g. my Watson Classic), BUT it takes a lot more effort. It can certainly be done, but given a choice I wouldn't recommend sacrificing speed for pop. If you have a tower and a big wake, then yeah, a board that isn't known for being the fastest (like the Ronix One) may be perfectly acceptable, but my personal recommendation would be to get a really fast board for small wakes especially when lacking a tower.
Old    A-dub (behindtheboat)      Join Date: Aug 2006       01-29-2013, 10:43 AM Reply   
Interesting, I always found continuous rockers to be better on smaller wakes, just seemed more consistent and easier to drive through the wake.
Old    Ben Wilcox (benjaminp)      Join Date: Nov 2008       01-29-2013, 12:22 PM Reply   
Do we still believe that rocker affects pop more than technique? I've ridden several different rocker types behind my 17' I/O, and didnt notice a difference in pop once I got a feel for the board and adjusted my technique accordingly.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       01-29-2013, 12:46 PM Reply   
No it's more about feel and amount than just 3 stage vs continuous. And to the responses above, when riding a ski boat I have always felt more abrupt kick needed because of the suuuuupper mellow lip at the wake. I want to go up not out no matter the boat BUT especially on a small wake, this is kind of all personal preference
Old     (SouthCack)      Join Date: Jan 2013       01-29-2013, 12:51 PM Reply   
So for a smaller wake, which would better suit an aggresive/ go big riding style... 2011 viva or 2012 mana
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       01-29-2013, 1:30 PM Reply   
I would say mana... But others will disagree and say viva
Old    MICAH HARPER (MICAH_HARPER)      Join Date: Apr 2010       01-29-2013, 2:15 PM Reply   
i would also say that technique has more to do with it also than rocker type
Old    Tyler Royal (broski)      Join Date: Nov 2011       01-29-2013, 2:50 PM Reply   
The O'Brien Contra is everything you're looking for. It is a 3 stage board so it has explosive pop off the wake, but it is still super fast! Definitely the fastest 3 stage board i have ever ridden. i got one in 2012 and just got my new one for this year and Im super pumped on getting out to ride it. Ive ridden it behind small I/O wakes and it allows plenty of speed to be able to clear the wake effortlessly, and still giving the kick to allow inverts and spins at the same time. You definitely cant go wrong with that board!
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       01-30-2013, 7:41 AM Reply   
Mana for small wakes and good pop for me. Although my buddy rides a ONE and he pops well too. Technique > board. Also, a fast board isn't going to fix crap technique on going wake to wake. If you can barely go wake to wake, you need to work on technique or shorten your rope/change your setup...
Old    Goonz (Goonz)      Join Date: Sep 2012       01-30-2013, 11:20 AM Reply   
As i am on a lake where we cant use ballast or boats over 4000 lbs i am going in my second season with the Mana.

This is definitely the board you are looking for to get the max pop out of your little wake!
Old    Justin Harrelson (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       01-30-2013, 11:52 AM Reply   
Any board with rocker heavily weighted on the tip and tail is a good choice: This could be a 3stage, accelerated continuos, I think I have even seen an abrupt continuous. The reason is drag.

A board with more drag will sit deeper and allow you to build a larger convex of water between you and the boat and as a result, send you more up.

Why? Even the biggest wakes in the world are only about thigh-high. If you hit a thigh-high skateboard ramp you might go chest or maybe head-high. Wakeboarders go much higher because at the base of the wake you "load" the line building a wedge of water in front of your board. Where the wedge in front of your board collides with the wedge of the wake you make a mini-doubleup right under your feet. If the wedge of the wake is small you can make up for it with a bigger wedge under your board.

That said, there are a lot of things to consider and a slower board will not equal more pop unless you are really putting it to work. It is really a balance and that is why most boards actually fall into the hybrid rockerline category. The One and the Mana are both great choices.
Old    Dan Yeoh (biomaster)      Join Date: Jan 2013       01-30-2013, 5:57 PM Reply   
Thanks for the suggestions guys!

I understand that my technique still definitely needs work, and im sure technique is much more important than board choice, but i want to maximise my airtime, so i'm sure a better board will help.

I think at the moment I'm currently swinging towards a 2012 Viva 140, or 2013 One Mondello 142.

Im about 200lb, currently riding a 142, was thinking of going a slightly smaller board to give myself more maneuverability/control, however the One is only produced in a 138 and 142, which is why i think i'm leaning towards the Viva 140.

Would i be better off staying with the bigger board for more speed?
Old    Lou Ferraro (ferral)      Join Date: Sep 2007       01-30-2013, 6:43 PM Reply   
I would go bigger, not smaller. For a big guy like you, you want more board surface area to help pop you up. I'm pretty close to the same weight and ride a 142. I would not go smaller.
Old    MICAH HARPER (MICAH_HARPER)      Join Date: Apr 2010       01-30-2013, 7:25 PM Reply   
yes i would for sure stay big....142 or bigger...im also @ 200lbs and any thing smaller than a 142 i can tell a big differance and there is not near as much pop from the board...i say the bigger the better
Old    Goonz (Goonz)      Join Date: Sep 2012       01-31-2013, 2:37 AM Reply   
The One also comes in a 146
Old    James Tiblier (jtiblier123)      Join Date: Jan 2011       01-31-2013, 3:27 AM Reply   
The more the surface area, the easier the board will be to ride behind your smaller boat. With more surface area, the board sits higher in the water. This can also aid in getting more vertical.
I rode a Viva 140 for a couple of seasons and I am now on a Ronix District. I loved the Viva (fast, accurate, tracks well) but once I rode the District, I fell in love with it. Oh by the way, if you are getting a Ronix board, watch what fin size you get. They used to sell the boards with a 1" fin but my 2013 came with .8" fins, which I like much more.
Old    Austin Ferguson (cbk_watersports_fergie)      Join Date: Oct 2009       01-31-2013, 6:21 AM Reply   
2010-2012 Ronix Mana! That board has so much straight up pop no matter wake size!
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       01-31-2013, 6:23 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by biomaster View Post
Thanks for the suggestions guys!

I understand that my technique still definitely needs work, and im sure technique is much more important than board choice, but i want to maximise my airtime, so i'm sure a better board will help.

I think at the moment I'm currently swinging towards a 2012 Viva 140, or 2013 One Mondello 142.

Im about 200lb, currently riding a 142, was thinking of going a slightly smaller board to give myself more maneuverability/control, however the One is only produced in a 138 and 142, which is why i think i'm leaning towards the Viva 140.

Would i be better off staying with the bigger board for more speed?
I don't buy the smaller board and more maneuverability/control. A larger board might give you more stability and control. I rode a 140 when I was 175, and have ridden a 142-144 weighing in from 205 down to 185 now I ride my Mana 143... Size the board for your weight. The viva 44 doesn't ride like a big board, it is fast.

I also don't buy the "board rides deeper in the water so it has more pop" The mana actually rides the highest in the water out of any 3stage board (that I have ridden**). I like riding on top vs plowing deep...
Old    Justin Harrelson (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       01-31-2013, 7:31 AM Reply   
Delta, The Mana is flat in the center with visible kick at the tip and tail. This increases drag "sits deeper."
This is how it works:
You can hang-ten on a wakeboard believe it or not. This is because there is a massive amount of suction in the tail. The tail will always maintain solid contact with the water. If you stand centered on the board the tail will barely give but the middle of the board goes down. Boards with later, steeper rockerlines sit lower. Therefore, the Mana is a slow board with a lot of pop. Take a spin on the Ronix district if you want to feel something that sits high in the water.

On any wake, I would never consider going under a 140cm at 200lbs. For a 200lb guy a 142 is a small board.
Old    Austin (austin)      Join Date: Apr 2010       01-31-2013, 7:56 AM Reply   
If you're getting a Ronix One I would recommend the Timebomb over the Modello if you can afford it. It is supposed to be both lighter and stiffer.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       01-31-2013, 10:16 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by austin View Post
If you're getting a Ronix One I would recommend the Timebomb over the Modello if you can afford it. It is supposed to be both lighter and stiffer.
why spend the cash?
he just said he is working on technique? i would bet again that you wouldnt notice much difference until you start swining the board around 720 or more... but to each their own i suppose...
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       01-31-2013, 10:22 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboarder View Post
For a 200lb guy a 142 is a small board.
i disagree here... i am 6 foot and 2 bills and i found a 145/6 is WAAAAAYYY too huge for me. it sits me so high out of the water and the speed for my weight is almost too much that you begin to loose control because of the speed, found the board getting away from me a bit on landings, i think people forget about board width as well. i agree though keep it 140-142 range

Last edited by simplej; 01-31-2013 at 10:26 AM.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       01-31-2013, 11:30 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboarder View Post
Delta, The Mana is flat in the center with visible kick at the tip and tail. This increases drag "sits deeper."
This is how it works:
You can hang-ten on a wakeboard believe it or not. This is because there is a massive amount of suction in the tail. The tail will always maintain solid contact with the water. If you stand centered on the board the tail will barely give but the middle of the board goes down. Boards with later, steeper rockerlines sit lower. Therefore, the Mana is a slow board with a lot of pop. Take a spin on the Ronix district if you want to feel something that sits high in the water.

On any wake, I would never consider going under a 140cm at 200lbs. For a 200lb guy a 142 is a small board.
Do you ride the mana? It rides higher in the water and looser for me than the previous generation, which was a similar shape to the substance and old era/premier... That is the shape I have experience with. Mana rides higher than that old shape.

I don't think how deep a board rides in the water has to do with how much pop you can get per shape... More rocker will allow the board to sit deeper in the water... so will channels in some cases allow the edge to sit deeper. A 3 stage board will in general be slower because the 'kink' drags, it isn't smooth... I ride my board very centered and ride right on the flat spot...

I also know you can hang ten, I know about surface tension "suction on the tail"...

Last edited by wakebordr11; 01-31-2013 at 11:37 AM.
Old    Justin Harrelson (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       01-31-2013, 12:43 PM Reply   
The mana is loose without the center fin, but it still sits deep. Your weight may be centered, but you are riding on the back two thirds of the board. That is where the drag comes in. I'm using deeper and drag interchangeably. I don't typically use drag because it sounds bad.

It is not just more, but where. The later the "kick" of the rocker the slower the board in-general. The mana has a very late kick and therefore the board is so slow (draggy). Drag aids in pop because of the explanation that I provided earlier( Loading the line, wedge of water...etc). I've ridden all of the shapes listed above. And in my opinion, the manas and the original premier are nothing alike. you are comparing a very moderate 3 stage rockerline to a very late very aggressive rockerline.
Old     (SouthCack)      Join Date: Jan 2013       01-31-2013, 1:36 PM Reply   
Dean Smith says the sharp rails on it makes it a fast ride though?
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       01-31-2013, 2:43 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboarder View Post
The mana is loose without the center fin, but it still sits deep. Your weight may be centered, but you are riding on the back two thirds of the board. That is where the drag comes in. I'm using deeper and drag interchangeably. I don't typically use drag because it sounds bad.

It is not just more, but where. The later the "kick" of the rocker the slower the board in-general. The mana has a very late kick and therefore the board is so slow (draggy). Drag aids in pop because of the explanation that I provided earlier( Loading the line, wedge of water...etc). I've ridden all of the shapes listed above. And in my opinion, the manas and the original premier are nothing alike. you are comparing a very moderate 3 stage rockerline to a very late very aggressive rockerline.
The original premier and the original mana are nearly the same shape, same channels etc.

I said the new shape mana is loose 'for me'. It is more loose with fins than the old shape was finless, maybe it's my riding style but as I said **my experiences** fastest abrupt 3 stage board **for me** Is it as fast as the Viva? No. Is it faster than the old shape and other 3 stage boards I've ridden? Yup

Drag is the force of the water, its the technical term for what is happening. I can see in pictures and video that I ride higher in the water on the new shape than the old shape.

Last edited by wakebordr11; 01-31-2013 at 2:47 PM.
Old    Justin Harrelson (skiboarder)      Join Date: Oct 2006       01-31-2013, 2:51 PM Reply   
The mana is a great board and I have seen a lot of guys ride it well. I guess I am not completely understanding what you mean by higher in the water.

Fast vs slow really has to do with drag in this case. The sharper tip and tail edges do help because Dean uses a very hard edge all the way through the wake, but I wouldn't say it makes it faster. It helps the board perform when he is flying at the wake.

There is a downside to a board with a lot of drag. It requires a very powerful and consistent edge all the way through the wake. If you get off the gas, you are going to slow down fast. I don't like that on many of my tricks so I ride a little mellower rocker line: the Timebomb. The rocker is pretty late on this board, but it has a little less rocker than most to balance it out a bit.

Last edited by skiboarder; 01-31-2013 at 2:55 PM.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       01-31-2013, 3:02 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by skiboarder View Post
The mana is a great board and I have seen a lot of guys ride it well. I guess I am not completely understanding what you mean by higher in the water.

Fast vs slow really has to do with drag in this case. The sharper tip and tail edges do help because Dean uses a very hard edge all the way through the wake, but I wouldn't say it makes it faster. It helps the board perform when he is flying at the wake.

There is a downside to a board with a lot of drag. It requires a very powerful and consistent edge all the way through the wake. If you get off the gas, you are going to slow down fast. I don't like that on many of my tricks so I ride a little mellower rocker line: the Timebomb. The rocker is pretty late on this board, but it has a little less rocker than most to balance it out a bit.
We're probably talking about the same thing, in different words...

To address what was said about Dean Smith's point... faster on edge is different than faster what we're talking about...

I feel like I am riding the surface on the new mana, whereas before I felt like I was plowing more water on older 3 stage shapes. I think it is due to the board having a giant flat spot and a soft edge in the middle and no real channels...
Old     (SouthCack)      Join Date: Jan 2013       02-02-2013, 11:38 AM Reply   
trying to decide between 2012 mana and 2012 parks modello
Old    DirtyCracker (ghettofab)      Join Date: Aug 2008       02-02-2013, 3:52 PM Reply   
A flex board like Slingshot adds a whole other dynamic to riding behind the boat. The softer flexer board is so much fun just carving around. Then its great for small wakes as you can really load the flex and get great pop.

I can't imagine riding anything but flex anymore.

Give it a try!
Old     (SouthCack)      Join Date: Jan 2013       02-02-2013, 4:57 PM Reply   
I've ridden a slingshot recoil behind boat before. Great board, but IMO it is over hyped. not as fast as i thought it would be and pop wasn't as explosive as i figured. The landings were really soft, though.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       02-02-2013, 5:07 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghettofab View Post
A flex board like Slingshot adds a whole other dynamic to riding behind the boat. The softer flexer board is so much fun just carving around. Then its great for small wakes as you can really load the flex and get great pop.

I can't imagine riding anything but flex anymore.

Give it a try!
This!

Wasn't a huge fan of the recoil but the kine really got me going
Old    Dan Yeoh (biomaster)      Join Date: Jan 2013       02-06-2013, 4:13 AM Reply   
Thanks for the info guys.

Unfortunately there's no local stores in my area where I can demo boards, so Im just going to have to buy a new board based on reviews and recommendations.

I think I'm going to end up going for a 2013 Ronix One 142. Still deciding whether to go for the modello or timebomb.

I like the look of the timebomb a hell of a lot more than the modello, and it's meant to be a lot lighter, with more pop. The only thing i'm worried about is because its stiffer, will it be much less forgiving on the landings?

When I last rode, I was actually quite confident crossing w2w, however still stuffed up quite a few landings when i was trying tricks.
Old    Goonz (Goonz)      Join Date: Sep 2012       02-06-2013, 12:35 PM Reply   
If you are just starting to jump wake 2 wake i would say the timebomb is a waste of money.
Old    Dan Yeoh (biomaster)      Join Date: Jan 2013       02-06-2013, 5:31 PM Reply   
II know it's an expensive board, but t's only $90 more than the Modello, and it looks hell of a lot better, so I'm leaning towards it, even if it's just for the looks more than anything else that I will notice at the moment.
Old    Drew Yoder (yodrew)      Join Date: Sep 2012       02-17-2013, 2:06 AM Reply   
Hows the swing weight on the 2012 time bomb? ...and 2012 hooke?
Old    Jo Shmoe (joeshmoe)      Join Date: Jan 2003       02-17-2013, 7:18 AM Reply   
"The One also comes in a 146"
Do not hesitate to get the 146, it rides like a 142 because of its lightness and does not "stick" to the water.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       02-18-2013, 10:28 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by yodrew View Post
Hows the swing weight on the 2012 time bomb? ...and 2012 hooke?
Is swing weight even a factor in boards these days? I'd say the swing weight is negligent
Old    Joe Jones (BamaLurker)      Join Date: Dec 2011       02-21-2013, 12:48 PM Reply   
^^^agreed^^^

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