Articles
   
       
       
Pics/Video
   
       
       
Shop
Search
 
 
 
 
 
Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
WAKE WORLD HOME
Email Password
Go Back   WakeWorld > Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles

Share 
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-01-2012, 4:35 PM Reply   
I am planning on getting a new boat soon and these are the 3 we were looking at. I am looking at the 2012 Tige Z3, 2012 Nautique 230 or the 2013 MXZ. I mainly wakeboard and thats all I want to do. Wakesurf a little, but it isnt very important. Out of those 3 which would throw the biggest and best wake. Keep in mind that I would be using it in saltwater. I am mainly thinking the Nautique because of the Coastal Edition and the quality of Nautiques. Also because Nautiques are used at the Gravel Tour in Orlando and once I get a new boat I plan on competing a lot there. What are your thoughts?
Old    Skippabcool (skippabcool)      Join Date: Mar 2011       10-01-2012, 4:47 PM Reply   
What are you used to now? I know, the over used demo them all and see, but they might be different and your opinion might vary from other riders. Why 2012 on Tige and Nautique but 2013 on the Malibu? Are all the dealers close and how is their service?
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-01-2012, 5:40 PM Reply   
I guess your going to have to ride the 3 and see what works for you. I don't think what they use at a tournament should be a factor, because unless you have the same boat set up exactly the same it will still be different. Any of those 3 boats are going to build a monster wake.

You being a 14 year old sponsored rider you should just get a sponsor boat!!! Probably should be happy with any boat that mom and dad come home with that costs that much. Not trying to be rude, but be thankful for what the parents are providing for you. Not a lot of kids get the opportunity to ride a boat like that everyday.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-01-2012, 7:19 PM Reply   
The biggest wakeboard wake IMO which isn't from the XStar or G-series is from the X25 hands down. MC also has the best salt water closed cooling system. It you are set on not MC then SAN 230 no question. Tige and Bu are not in same class as CC or MC quality wise.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-02-2012, 6:23 AM Reply   
Here's our MXZ 22 Wake 800 over stock with 6 people. The shape is hard to beat, and the wake is very configurable for different tastes. The wake is amazing.

Only a few people have been on the 24 MXZ. You'll have a hard time finding a review from a wakeboarder at this point..
Attached Images
  
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-02-2012, 6:29 AM Reply   
And don't let anyone tell you that Malibu is not is the same class as CC or MC. I've owned 6 Mastercrafts and 3 Malibus. The Malibu is a premium boat, and in many ways, they are better than the two others. The interior of the boat is flat out luxurious. You won't find a more comfortable boat to ride in, and at a more affordable price.
Old    Tampa Wake (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       10-02-2012, 7:35 AM Reply   
I sat in a Z3 this weekend the damn thing was plush!!
Old    Mark V (mark197)      Join Date: Dec 2009       10-02-2012, 7:47 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jarrod View Post
The Malibu is a premium boat, You won't find a more comfortable boat to ride in, and at a more affordable price.
I really don't think that any of the big 3 can even be in the same phrase as affordable, it is actually laughable.
Old    Jay Landry (shredthagnar)      Join Date: Oct 2011       10-02-2012, 7:48 AM Reply   
They are all boats. They all displace water and make wakes. Find the one that you like the most and you'll be happy haha
Old    Ron (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       10-02-2012, 8:34 AM Reply   
So when did it even become the "big three"? Since the days of the scurfer it has always been if you wanted the best highest quality boat it was ONLY- Mastercraft or Correct Craft end of story. Now I will admit Malibu makes a nice boat now but where where you 10yrs ago? And to even include Tige in the same comparison? Please...
Old    J D (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       10-02-2012, 8:42 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordicron View Post
So when did it even become the "big three"? Since the days of the scurfer it has always been if you wanted the best highest quality boat it was ONLY- Mastercraft or Correct Craft end of story. Now I will admit Malibu makes a nice boat now but where where you 10yrs ago? And to even include Tige in the same comparison? Please...
The only "big 2" is price tags.

Malibu, Skiers Choice, MB, Tige - they all make beautiful, well crafted boats..
Old    Ron (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       10-02-2012, 8:54 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff_mn View Post
The only "big 2" is price tags.

Malibu, Skiers Choice, MB, Tige - they all make beautiful, well crafted boats..
With the exception of MB in your list everyone of those Manufacturers is pricing their boats right up towards MC and CC price wise.
Old    L W (501s)      Join Date: Feb 2010       10-02-2012, 9:04 AM Reply   
I own a new MC X-30 and its an amazing boat but I owned a 08 Moomba XLV before it and that was also a great boat. I would say that the build quality is definitley higher on the MC but they are both boats that do the same thing: Pull riders and make wakes. As a MC owner I don't think it's fair to say that MC & CC are "way above" all the rest. They may have some of the best fit and finish and features, but brands like tige and SC and closing the gap year after year, both in terms of quality and price. Heck the Tige dealership in Alberta couldn't touch the price of my X-30 (Or a Malibu LSV) with a Z3. This was after after seeing my posts on WW about the boats, and contacting me privately to offer a factory tour and test drive (talk about going after sales!). This surprised me.
Old    Sean (slax303)      Join Date: Oct 2005       10-02-2012, 10:16 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordicron View Post
So when did it even become the "big three"? Since the days of the scurfer it has always been if you wanted the best highest quality boat it was ONLY- Mastercraft or Correct Craft end of story. Now I will admit Malibu makes a nice boat now but where where you 10yrs ago? And to even include Tige in the same comparison? Please...
Since the days of the sKurfer, all 3 of these companies have made nice boats. Just because Mercedes has been around longer than Lexus, it doesn't mean that Lexus didn't catch up with them and make just as nice of a car. I don't care what happened 10 years ago. When was the last time Nautique sold more boats than Malibu in a year? Its been quite a few years. So are the "big 2" Mastercraft and Malibu these days (not 10 years ago. Lets live in the present). As for Tige, try riding in and behind a new one, before you start talking about things you know nothing about.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-02-2012, 10:25 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordicron View Post
So when did it even become the "big three"? Since the days of the scurfer it has always been if you wanted the best highest quality boat it was ONLY- Mastercraft or Correct Craft end of story. Now I will admit Malibu makes a nice boat now but where where you 10yrs ago? And to even include Tige in the same comparison? Please...
Agreed!
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       10-02-2012, 10:31 AM Reply   
What does 10+ years ago have to do with the boats in 2012/2013?
Old    Ron (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       10-02-2012, 10:39 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by slax303 View Post
Since the days of the sKurfer, all 3 of these companies have made nice boats. Just because Mercedes has been around longer than Lexus, it doesn't mean that Lexus didn't catch up with them and make just as nice of a car. I don't care what happened 10 years ago. When was the last time Nautique sold more boats than Malibu in a year? Its been quite a few years. So are the "big 2" Mastercraft and Malibu these days (not 10 years ago. Lets live in the present). As for Tige, try riding in and behind a new one, before you start talking about things you know nothing about.
Dude I have crawled through and opened up enough tiges that I know I didnt want to ride in one.

And because bayliner sells more boats than Malibu that makes it a better boat also? Seriously? Like I said sure there are other boats out there but Tige doesn't even deserve to be in the same sentence as MC or CC as much as they'd like to think they are. It takes more than slapping in a PCM and marking up your price and calling yourself part big "3" or "2". Malibu is getting close and their tract record and loyalty is getting there.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-02-2012, 10:40 AM Reply   
Apparently a lot if you are a MC or CC owner. Boat snobs are sensitive people!! Just like the HS star quarterback....in his mind if he was once the star he will always be the star and you had better recognize him as such!!!!
Old    Ron (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       10-02-2012, 10:41 AM Reply   
Sorry for the dup
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       10-02-2012, 10:54 AM Reply   
What is your job Ron where you've opened up a bunch of Tiges? I am a CC fan and will be buying an older sport or super sport, not a big money boat guy. Family has a Tige with 815 trouble free hrs on a mercruiser, from the dark ages - 99. The rear seat vinyl is cracked. They have wood stringers, big deal, lots of boats use wood, applied correctly is a good build method IMO. I know they had QC problems back in the day, the family boat has held up just as well as friends MCs CCs and Supras from the same era... better than some due to the maintenance it received.

Who ever said Tige sells more boats akin to Searay/Bayliner, compared to Malibu, you sir are a moron. And if you don't lump Bu in the top 3, well then, not really sure but they really stepped it up and have some of the highest quality plushest interiors on the market since 05/06. Even boats like the G23 and 230, yes, super high quality, great fit and finish, but the cushions aren't super thick and areas like the observer seat are small and don't fit well...

To answer the OP - I like the Z3 but the 230 is a sweet boat. Why not go G23 if you are going to go big?

Last edited by wakebordr11; 10-02-2012 at 10:56 AM.
Old    Tallredrider (talltigeguy)      Join Date: Sep 2003       10-02-2012, 11:45 AM Reply   
This site has been destroyed by a few of the trolls here. It is painful to read it anymore. I used to come here every day to see what was being said, now it is down to every 2 weeks or less. That is sad, because there are a few knowledgeable great people on here, but sorting through the idiots to get to the good information has become painful.

Back on topic...I think that even on Tige owners, the Z3 is not well hyped as a wakeboard boat. That is mostly due to marketing. It is advertised as a surf machine, but there are a few vids of Ruck killing it behind a Z3, but he could do that behind a Ranger Bass boat. I would like to hear more from people who wakeboard behind it regularly.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-02-2012, 1:18 PM Reply   
My post may have been a bit harsh or a little rude. I have just read one to many "my CC or MC is better than anything else". Gets even better when the rest of us mortals can't even put our boats in the same sentence.

I have looked at 100 plus used boats over the last 3 months. The nicest one was by far a 05 CC SV211 with like 100 hours. Mint. With that said I don't think that a CC or a MC wears any better than any other quality boat out there. The worst boat I have seen is a 04 MC X30 that was literally falling apart with not a lot of hours. Quality is seen as a boat ages.

It's cool to love your boat and be proud of it. Not cool is acting like it's made of Diamonds and gold and that everyone else's suck or is subordinate to yours. Then telling us why we all suck.

Funny thing to me is most of these guys talking all this smack aren't the owners of the new 100K CC's or MC's. There the ones who own the 20 year old ones worth 20K talking crap about someones new 60K+ boat.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       10-02-2012, 1:28 PM Reply   
Well all this BS aside...

Dowdy came fingertips away from a KGB 7 behind a z3 with just stock ballast.
The 230 is a proven beast.
The 24 Mxz hasn't been released yet but the 22 is supposed to be sick...


So basically you have a tough decision
Old    Michael Hunter (mhunter)      Join Date: Mar 2008       10-02-2012, 2:02 PM Reply   
Test drive /ride them all , Buy the one that works best for you . Would you really buy a boat based on what you read on WW?
Old    Tampa Wake (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       10-02-2012, 2:21 PM Reply   
Not sure if you have seen this video but the wake looks pretty damn nice and on both sides as well. Obviosly its loaded up like every pro boat gets loaded up including the new G and X and at least Tige is trying to hide it. Looks legit to me and the boat is super comfy and HUGE!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cT-c-UaZNgA


Quote:
Originally Posted by talltigeguy View Post
This site has been destroyed by a few of the trolls here. It is painful to read it anymore. I used to come here every day to see what was being said, now it is down to every 2 weeks or less. That is sad, because there are a few knowledgeable great people on here, but sorting through the idiots to get to the good information has become painful.

Back on topic...I think that even on Tige owners, the Z3 is not well hyped as a wakeboard boat. That is mostly due to marketing. It is advertised as a surf machine, but there are a few vids of Ruck killing it behind a Z3, but he could do that behind a Ranger Bass boat. I would like to hear more from people who wakeboard behind it regularly.
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-02-2012, 2:26 PM Reply   
In case all of you guys are wondering I am not a snobby rich kid, its just We have a big 30ft sea ray now, it just doesn't cut it for wakeboarding but its worth around $50,000 which we would use as a trade in. I know MC makes amazing boats but I guess you could say they are all kinda small. We looked into getting the G25 but the price tag on that thing even with the trade was almost 100k. All of you saying test drive/ ride behind them all, your probably right. The reason I like Nautique the most is they have been around forever, I trust there quality, and they throw amazing wakes. I went and looked around the Tige Z3 this weekend at my local boat show and it was very nice and all but the quality of the overall boat seemed to lack, and Tiges are mainly known as wakesurf boats. The Malibu's I looked over a little bit at Redbull Wake Open. They seem very nice and seeing some of the videos of Raph and Phil riding behind one the wakes seem massive. I really just don't know that much about Malibus or Mastercrafts.
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-02-2012, 2:41 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by skippabcool View Post
What are you used to now? I know, the over used demo them all and see, but they might be different and your opinion might vary from other riders. Why 2012 on Tige and Nautique but 2013 on the Malibu? Are all the dealers close and how is their service?
I am used to a mix of a 2012 Sport Nautique and SeaRay 270 SLX. All of the dealers are with in a few miles of me. The dealer that sells the Tige and Malibus is supposed to be good and the Marine Max where the Nautique would come from we have bought two boats through all ready.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-02-2012, 3:42 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesHawk101 View Post
In case all of you guys are wondering I am not a snobby rich kid, its just We have a big 30ft sea ray now, it just doesn't cut it for wakeboarding but its worth around $50,000 which we would use as a trade in. I know MC makes amazing boats but I guess you could say they are all kinda small. We looked into getting the G25 but the price tag on that thing even with the trade was almost 100k. All of you saying test drive/ ride behind them all, your probably right. The reason I like Nautique the most is they have been around forever, I trust there quality, and they throw amazing wakes. I went and looked around the Tige Z3 this weekend at my local boat show and it was very nice and all but the quality of the overall boat seemed to lack, and Tiges are mainly known as wakesurf boats. The Malibu's I looked over a little bit at Redbull Wake Open. They seem very nice and seeing some of the videos of Raph and Phil riding behind one the wakes seem massive. I really just don't know that much about Malibus or Mastercrafts.
Bu's look good I'll give them that in my opinion one of the better looking boats. The X25 or X30 will be same size as any of the other boats inside except maybe the MXZ. But if you want big and proven and a good deal a new SAN 230 is your best bet, though if it were me I'd get a X25 cause I'm pure wakeboard.
Old    Dom W. Forte (fic)      Join Date: May 2008       10-03-2012, 3:42 AM Reply   
You can also get some good info about the boats on boattest .com., dont forget about fuel economy when testing, the Tige is #1 , also if the Tige is not as good of quality how has it won the NMMA CSI award 8 years in a row, thats based on custormer surveys.
Old    Tampa Wake (tampawake)      Join Date: Mar 2008       10-03-2012, 6:28 AM Reply   
James sounds like your in the tampa st pete area. Why dont you just grab your fat sacks and pump call Tony at Fortes load up the Z3 and see the wake for your self. Then after that head to Marine Max and hit the 230. Your gonna have to drive to O town to catch a ride in the MXZ though. The build and fit and finish are all going to be the same or damn near the same on 2012s and 2013s. Make sure you take your very cool parents with you that are willing to support you and your sport. Not sure the quality of service at Marine Max but you will get top notch service and care at Fortes. Good luck take pictures of your new boat when you get it. Oh I will take a pull as well.
Old    Andy (michridr69)      Join Date: Dec 2008       10-03-2012, 8:43 AM Reply   
24 mxz nuff said.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-03-2012, 8:44 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by fic View Post
You can also get some good info about the boats on boattest .com., dont forget about fuel economy when testing, the Tige is #1 , also if the Tige is not as good of quality how has it won the NMMA CSI award 8 years in a row, thats based on custormer surveys.
His dad is buying the boat don't think this kid is worried about fuel economy...
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       10-03-2012, 9:15 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by michridr69 View Post
24 mxz nuff said.
I find your post highly valuable to this discussion. Thank you for the contribution.

I wasn't suggesting that any of the big 3 are affordable - it's a relative term. I was trying to say the Malibu is a little more affordable than the MC or CC, but that didn't come through. You'll spend a little less on an MXZ than your would on a XStar or G23.
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-03-2012, 12:03 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroyD View Post
His dad is buying the boat don't think this kid is worried about fuel economy...
Actually fuel economy does matter a bit. My current boat literly gets .8 mph. So really anything that gets around 3 would be amazing. I heard the Tiges do get very good gas mileage though. Does anyone know the gas mileage for a SAN 230? Also I figured up some numbers of pricing and the 230 vs. The g23 its a better deal to just get the g23 I will post the full sheet when I get to my computer.
Old    DBC (ixfe)      Join Date: Aug 2008       10-03-2012, 12:30 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesHawk101 View Post
Actually fuel economy does matter a bit. My current boat literly gets .8 mph. So really anything that gets around 3 would be amazing. I heard the Tiges do get very good gas mileage though. Does anyone know the gas mileage for a SAN 230? Also I figured up some numbers of pricing and the 230 vs. The g23 its a better deal to just get the g23 I will post the full sheet when I get to my computer.
Are you honestly trying to compare the fuel efficiency of three $100k boats that weigh close to 5000lbs/ea. and use HUGE motors to push themselves through water?

Speechless...
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       10-03-2012, 12:40 PM Reply   
If you want a 23' boat that throws up a huge wake and gets good fuel economy take a look at cody(chicksdigflips) Epic 23v with a 6cyl diesel in it. It will probably burn half the fuel of the other boats you are talking about.

http://onlyinboards.com/Details.aspx?ID=34745
Old    Mark V (mark197)      Join Date: Dec 2009       10-03-2012, 1:01 PM Reply   
How do you calculate MPG's on the water
Old    Timmy! (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       10-03-2012, 1:12 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark197 View Post
How do you calculate MPG's on the water
It's actually Gallons per hour (GPH)...
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-03-2012, 1:13 PM Reply   
This whole thread is amazing. This kids is 14!! Really your working up some numbers??? Your mean you DAD is!!!! Dude your not writing the check, or working the deal. Stop trying to act so grown up. Its cool to be excited that your FAMILY is getting a new boat, but it sure isn't you at all. It's your parents.

If your are worried about gas milage on a 100K boat, you can't afford it. Thats what anyone worth their salt in the boat world will tell you. Because if your buying a 100K boat the gas is chump change.

Not trying to bust your chops, but does your dad know your buying a boat? If my kid who is about your age was on here talking about the new RZR/R-20/Vride he was deciding between he'd take a summer off riding to remember how thankful we should be for what we have.

Curious who you are sponsored by???? Since your profile said you were a sponsored rider, atleast before you changed it!!!!
Old    Mark V (mark197)      Join Date: Dec 2009       10-03-2012, 1:13 PM Reply   
^sarcasm bud.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       10-03-2012, 1:21 PM Reply   
Haha, Todd you aren't going pro? You mean I don't need a G23 to be pro? WHHHHAAAAAT?
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-03-2012, 1:29 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardman74 View Post
This whole thread is amazing. This kids is 14!! Really your working up some numbers??? Your mean you DAD is!!!! Dude your not writing the check, or working the deal. Stop trying to act so grown up. Its cool to be excited that your FAMILY is getting a new boat, but it sure isn't you at all. It's your parents.

If your are worried about gas milage on a 100K boat, you can't afford it. Thats what anyone worth their salt in the boat world will tell you. Because if your buying a 100K boat the gas is chump change.

Not trying to bust your chops, but does your dad know your buying a boat? If my kid who is about your age was on here talking about the new RZR/R-20/Vride he was deciding between he'd take a summer off riding to remember how thankful we should be for what we have.

Curious who you are sponsored by???? Since your profile said you were a sponsored rider, atleast before you changed it!!!!
Here they are. I based these off of MSRP's plus the Coastal Edition, which I assume is around $11k.

Super Air Nautique G23

Price: $115,000
Less Trade: $50,000
Total: $65,000
Sales Tax: $68,550
License: $295.00
Total: $68,845


Super Air Nautique 230

Price: $107,000
Less trade: $50,000
Total: $57,000
Sales tax: $3,990
License: $295.00
Total: $60,990

Tige Z3

Price: $90,000
Less trade: $50,000
Total: $53,500
Sales tax: $3,500
License: $295.00
Total: $53,795

And man just because my family can afford a 100k boat doesn't mean that we don't have to worry about gas. Also if you notice we would be trading a $50k boat. Technically I am not sponsered, I just get amazing discounts and are great friends with the guys that work at my local board shop. I changed it now though. Also I am trying to be mature. Is it OK for me to be a mature 14 year old? I also realize at the end of the day that I am not bringing the money home but I do have a say in what boat we would get since my dad knows that I know a lot more about wakeboarding boats then he does.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-03-2012, 1:29 PM Reply   
I wish....only if I was sponsored by Advil, Aleve, or motrin!!!!
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       10-03-2012, 1:35 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesHawk101 View Post
Here they are. I based these off of MSRP's plus the Coastal Edition, which I assume is around $11k.

Super Air Nautique G23

Price: $115,000
Less Trade: $50,000
Total: $65,000
Sales Tax: $68,550
License: $295.00
Total: $68,845


Super Air Nautique 230

Price: $107,000
Less trade: $50,000
Total: $57,000
Sales tax: $3,990
License: $295.00
Total: $60,990

Tige Z3

Price: $90,000
Less trade: $50,000
Total: $53,500
Sales tax: $3,500
License: $295.00
Total: $53,795

And man just because my family can afford a 100k boat doesn't mean that we don't have to worry about gas. Also if you notice we would be trading a $50k boat. Technically I am not sponsered, I just get amazing discounts and are great friends with the guys that work at my local board shop. I changed it now though. Also I am trying to be mature. Is it OK for me to be a mature 14 year old? I also realize at the end of the day that I am not bringing the money home but I do have a say in what boat we would get since my dad knows that I know a lot more about wakeboarding boats then he does.
Where did you find a G23 for 115, in stock without ordering it???? Do they offer them stripped with no options. I bet it'd be hard to get out the door for 125. Also, who says your boat is worth 50?
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-03-2012, 1:40 PM Reply   
Alright man I'm gonna stop busting your chops because you do seem mature and you explained yourself and what the deal is. That says something about you...

Those are going to be super rough numbers. Nothing goes off retail. The more expensive the boat usually the farther you can get under. Also where are you getting your trade number? Was that quoted by a dealer? If it's NADA or anything similar forget it. I researched what i thought my trade was worth and no dealer was anywhere close. I got a $3000 swing between dealers and all under where I thought it should be. That was on a 10K boat. So on a 50K boat the swing is going to be bigger. But at the end of the day the numbers don't matter...if your trading is the difference. Figure out your best deal without the trade so you know where they will go. Then tell them you have a trade. Because if they will drop 10K off MSRP and want to give you 40K on trade...they will just go back to MSRP and then "show" you 50K for your trade on paper. Difference is all that matters.

I know your Tige dealer is one of the best around. The support at Marine Max(the Walmart of boat dealers) isn't going to be anywhere close.
Old     (simplej)      Join Date: Sep 2011       10-03-2012, 1:47 PM Reply   
i dont think it is inappropriate for him to be asking about the different boats. he will likely be the one riding behind it a vast majority of the time over the next several years...
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-03-2012, 1:56 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by boardman74 View Post
Alright man I'm gonna stop busting your chops because you do seem mature and you explained yourself and what the deal is. That says something about you...

Those are going to be super rough numbers. Nothing goes off retail. The more expensive the boat usually the farther you can get under. Also where are you getting your trade number? Was that quoted by a dealer? If it's NADA or anything similar forget it. I researched what i thought my trade was worth and no dealer was anywhere close. I got a $3000 swing between dealers and all under where I thought it should be. That was on a 10K boat. So on a 50K boat the swing is going to be bigger. But at the end of the day the numbers don't matter...if your trading is the difference. Figure out your best deal without the trade so you know where they will go. Then tell them you have a trade. Because if they will drop 10K off MSRP and want to give you 40K on trade...they will just go back to MSRP and then "show" you 50K for your trade on paper. Difference is all that matters.

I know your Tige dealer is one of the best around. The support at Marine Max(the Walmart of boat dealers) isn't going to be anywhere close.
You guys aren't gonna like this but the local Marine Max did. We have bought 2 boats through them so we trust them. Your right about NADA also its way off. Those numbers for the base price might be different from what u guys see. I saw the actual numbers for a G25 with Coastal Edition and it was around $9,000 more then the MSRP online so I pretty much took the MSRP and Added 9,000 to it.
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       10-03-2012, 1:59 PM Reply   
Give the kid a break guys. It isn't like he is coming in here being a cocky little butt$**** or like Ryanxstar. He is coming here just like any other person would for advice so he can take the info to his pops. Maybe it helps them make a decision, maybe it doesn't?

James, I sure somewhere in the is thread someone said go demo and see which one you(more importantly your mother and father) like and are comfortable paying for. Truth of the matter there are a dozen boats out there that all produce ridiculously amazing wakes that anybody(besides the wakeworld wake snobs) happy. My thoughts that don't really amount to a hill of beans:

Boats I would consider in the price range you are talking about. Nautique 230 and G23, Mastercraft X25 and Xstar and maybe even the X30, Malibu 23LSV and MXZ 22 and 24, Supra SA series, Tige RZ2, RZ4 and Z3. There are some other boats that you may want to consider but I will just leave it with the ones I mentioned. Keep in mind that if you decide to go G23 or Xstar and your pops is going to let you slam the living crap out of it than you are going to need the 450 or 550 hp motor options. You do that and the price is going to jump through the roof and you are going to burn a ton of fuel. Boats like the Tige Z3, San230, MXZ, 23LSV, RZ2, X25, etc are all powered just fine with a 400hp motor or so although some of the brands might jump straight from 350hp or so to 450hp. Don't let anyone tell you that any of the boats are significanlty better quality than others. In my opinion Mastercraft and Nautique are probably better quality than the others but the difference is so little I don't think is worth worrying about especially since the a mastercraft and nautique will be more expensive than any comparable boat in another brand for the most part(still can't believe the X30 is less than a Z3 like Levi got quoted but maybe that was just a dealer thing). All of them will last for decades if properly maintained and all will be huge piles of crap in a few years if neglected. All will produce Pro level wakes as far as I can tell. All will burn a crap load of fuel although the G23 and Xstar will probably burn the most. Most seem to think the Tige's will burn the least. I would expect the new Supra's to be fairly fuel efficient as well because they have a trim tab just like the tige an I am not sure if tieg has it but the supra tab supposedly starts down when you pull off the throttle and goes up to its preset position once the boat is up on plane. That is a ridiculously awesome feature that no one seems to talk about. Also don't listen to the crowd that says Tige or Centurion or whatever other boat is just a surf boat or just a wakeboard boat. If I was looking for a 23' boat that produces a pro level wave my top couple choices would be the Z3, SAN230 and Malibu 23LSV. I would expect the SAN230 to be in the 90-100k range, while the Z3 and 23LSV to be closer to the 80-90k range. The MXZ and SA series are probably in the 90-100k range, the Xstar and G23 will be in the 115-140 range I would assume. All my guestimates are with the upgraded engine to run weight(550 in G23 and Xstar, 400-450 in all the others) and similar options. If you need a saltwater package I would expect to add 5-10K to all of these boats.

The bigges factors that should help you make your decision:

1) what your parents like.
2) what dealer are you comfortable with
3) wakeboard wake
4) expected fuel economy.
5) price would eb number 1 but it sounds like initial purchase price isn't a very big limiting factor.
Old    J D (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       10-03-2012, 2:16 PM Reply   
Awesome to see an adult (Todd) act more childish than the kid (James) while lecturing him about acting like an adult..

Well done, Todd! Color me impressed.

Good luck James - great list of boats you guys are looking at. You're looking at a lot more than I would have at 14. I would have just wanted whichever one I could get in lime green and could fit the most box on.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-03-2012, 2:25 PM Reply   
Well sorry. I didn't realize you were so tough to impress. I'll try harder next time.
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-03-2012, 2:27 PM Reply   
On a second note I got to ride in the new G25 last weekend and lemme say that thing is monster. The wake had to be a good 2.5 feet atleast probably way more and the amount of room in it was crazy. But the price tag was insane 130k+.
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       10-03-2012, 2:42 PM Reply   
That an awesome boat. Little jealous I haven't seen one yet. Marine Max up here has a G23 I think but haven't been out there to see it. Plus I haven't heard anything good about the Marine Max store here.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       10-03-2012, 3:22 PM Reply   
If you get the G23, you aren't going to need extra weight... What tricks are you pulling now and what do you expect to be pulling, I know if it were me, having ridden the G, I would be better off learning tricks on the 230, the G23 is just so big and daunting...
Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       10-03-2012, 4:25 PM Reply   
delta, did you ride it with no ballast? what was that like?
Old    Brad Noneedtoknow (bspot5)      Join Date: Sep 2008       10-03-2012, 7:03 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesHawk101 View Post
Here they are. I based these off of MSRP's plus the Coastal Edition, which I assume is around $11k.

Super Air Nautique G23

Price: $115,000
Less Trade: $50,000
Total: $65,000
Sales Tax: $68,550
License: $295.00
Total: $68,845


Super Air Nautique 230

Price: $107,000
Less trade: $50,000
Total: $57,000
Sales tax: $3,990
License: $295.00
Total: $60,990

Tige Z3

Price: $90,000
Less trade: $50,000
Total: $53,500
Sales tax: $3,500
License: $295.00
Total: $53,795

And man just because my family can afford a 100k boat doesn't mean that we don't have to worry about gas. Also if you notice we would be trading a $50k boat. Technically I am not sponsered, I just get amazing discounts and are great friends with the guys that work at my local board shop. I changed it now though. Also I am trying to be mature. Is it OK for me to be a mature 14 year old? I also realize at the end of the day that I am not bringing the money home but I do have a say in what boat we would get since my dad knows that I know a lot more about wakeboarding boats then he does.
I think you better check your math on the Z3 again.
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       10-03-2012, 7:19 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnny_defacto View Post
delta, did you ride it with no ballast? what was that like?
I've ridden it 75-80% and 12 or 13 people, adults... It was retarded huge. Long transition, super ramp, hard and huge. Then I rode it 50% ballast and 8-10 guys and I really couldn't feel the difference. It was still bigger longer and crazier feeling than the 230. The 230 with stock plus 12 ppl plus plug n play was just like a larger version of an already slammed old style 210 I felt. The G23 you've got to wait so long to pop and then when you do it doesn't buck you, its crazy smooth wake to wake. Like I said I only rode it twice but even Adam Wensink said it took him.a few times out before he was dialed. It's huge and rampy and when I say huge, I mean super huge
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-05-2012, 5:33 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by bspot5 View Post
I think you better check your math on the Z3 again.
Nope I have a quite for it at $89k.
Old    TigeMike (chpthril)      Join Date: Oct 2007       10-05-2012, 5:47 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesHawk101 View Post
Nope I have a quite for it at $89k.
Then your dealer needs to check his math. 90K - 50K trade doesnt = 53,500
Old    Delta Force (wakebordr11)      Join Date: May 2001       10-05-2012, 6:47 PM Reply   
Seriously, if you've got the coin for a G23, and are thinking that is a strong possibility, I would stop thinking about any other boat. The G is the best out there
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-05-2012, 7:45 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chpthril View Post
Then your dealer needs to check his math. 90K - 50K trade doesnt = 53,500
Oops yah that was actually my fault. It should be $43k
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-05-2012, 10:17 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakebordr11 View Post
Seriously, if you've got the coin for a G23, and are thinking that is a strong possibility, I would stop thinking about any other boat. The G is the best out there
I'd spend the extra 10K and get the new Star with 550hp. But then again, that would be up to your old man...
Old    KEVIN (kko13)      Join Date: Jul 2006       10-06-2012, 1:43 AM Reply   
Only problem with that was the Xstar @ the show had a $167,000 price tag (without power tower)..Plus he has already norrowed it down to 3 boats..the star not being one of them.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-06-2012, 5:52 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by kko13 View Post
Only problem with that was the Xstar @ the show had a $167,000 price tag (without power tower)..Plus he has already norrowed it down to 3 boats..the star not being one of them.
The kid is only 14, he has no idea what he wants. How many of us would love to go back to our 14-year old selfs and smack some sense into them?
Old    Dave O (wakedaveup)      Join Date: May 2012       10-06-2012, 5:56 AM Reply   
Hey James, what area of FL are you in? I may be able to help ya out a bit. I can tell you that if you plan on seriously competing in the Gravel Tour than a Nautique would be a great boat to practice behind. Also, every 6.0LT PCM engine on up has closed cooling which is very beneficial in salt water not to mention the corrosion resistent engine harness, zincs, and anodized components. The 230 when loaded properly has been a boat that guys like Danny, Bob, and others have been praticing behind for years. The other two boats you are looking at are solid as well. I think the 230 will honestly out preform the MXZ on the water in terms of handling. Always a plus when driving double ups as well. Plus the 230 has an extra foot of room over the 22MXZ. Not AT ALL knocking Malibu, but from what your needs sound like, you would be happier in a Nautique and have a slight advantage over other Gravel Tour competitors being that you get to practice behind the Tour tow boat or similar wake. The Tige is a nice boat as well but I feel the Z3 was designed to be a better surf boat than wake and you clearly aren't looking for a dedicated surf boat. I had a chance to ride the G25 about a month ago and it's amazing. It's pricey, but if you can afford it, that's a boat you can keep forever and be happy with. Don't really need more than stock ballast until you get to upper pro level and even then it's plenty big! Plus the newer fly by throttle and Zero Off are a perfect blend for speed control and response. Just things to think about. I love the look of the MXZ I really do, just think the Nautique is the best fit.
Old    KEVIN (kko13)      Join Date: Jul 2006       10-06-2012, 6:01 AM Reply   
He is only 14..but he seems to be pretty informed on the boats and has it down to 3 so just trying to keep in on topic with him.
James my advice would eb the same as others. Get your family together setup demos for the boats you like and see wich one fits your needs and budget.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-06-2012, 9:06 AM Reply   
The fact that he had a Tige on his list and no MC shows he is anything BUT informed!

You wanna be a pro kid and be on the pro tour you tell your old man to buy a star even it means your dad getting a second job. The Star is pulling the PWT and that's where you want to be.
Old    Dave O (wakedaveup)      Join Date: May 2012       10-06-2012, 9:22 AM Reply   
You never let me down Troy haha!
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-06-2012, 9:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakedaveup View Post
You never let me down Troy haha!
I just want the best for the kid...otherwise he'll just be another has been on the outside looking in!
Old    Sean (slax303)      Join Date: Oct 2005       10-06-2012, 9:27 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroyD View Post
The fact that he had a Tige on his list and no MC shows he is anything BUT informed!

You wanna be a pro kid and be on the pro tour you tell your old man to buy a star even it means your dad getting a second job. The Star is pulling the PWT and that's where you want to be.
Lol.. I know right? How did Phil Soven EVER win a PWT without having an Xstar? It's truly a mystery.

You are seriously the biggest troll on this forum
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-06-2012, 9:51 AM Reply   
^^You think this kid's future is a joke? I implore of you to tell me exactly the ratio of MC pro riders vs. others who podium on the PWT? You eve heard of the term "statistically insignificant?" That's how I'd describe Soven's podium. Anything else you wanna bring up?
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-06-2012, 9:53 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroyD View Post
The fact that he had a Tige on his list and no MC shows he is anything BUT informed!

You wanna be a pro kid and be on the pro tour you tell your old man to buy a star even it means your dad getting a second job. The Star is pulling the PWT and that's where you want to be.
Here the main reason we don't get a mastercraft. Most of them have pitch fork bows. Pitch fork bows do not work well with the amount of chop in the intercostal down here in florida. They are good boats just not for me.
Old    TigeMike (chpthril)      Join Date: Oct 2007       10-06-2012, 10:01 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroyD View Post
The fact that he had a Tige on his list and no MC shows he is anything BUT informed!

You wanna be a pro kid and be on the pro tour you tell your old man to buy a star even it means your dad getting a second job. The Star is pulling the PWT and that's where you want to be.
Yeah right LOL Back in 6th grade, I bought some Adidas shoes cause I thought they made me run faster
Old    Dave O (wakedaveup)      Join Date: May 2012       10-06-2012, 11:40 AM Reply   
Sooooo your saying MC boats is what gets riders to the podium and all I have to do is buy one to get there!!?? YESSS I'm quiting my job with Nautique today and going down to the MC dealer to get an Xstar so I can be a pro by the end of the season and live the good life!! Hahaha, Troy even the MC guys are probably begging for your non sense to stop. The old Xstar has one of the best wakes around (Look at that a CC guy saying an Xstar has a great wake) but it drove like a freakin school bus. For such big talk, big name, and best around.... that's the best performance they could come up with? Don't even get me started AGAIN on the marketing side of MC. And don't get me wrong man I like MC I think they build a great boat, but it isn't there boats that get guys on the podium it's there money and what they dish out to buy these guys.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-06-2012, 12:30 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by wakedaveup View Post
Sooooo your saying MC boats is what gets riders to the podium and all I have to do is buy one to get there!!?? YESSS I'm quiting my job with Nautique today and going down to the MC dealer to get an Xstar so I can be a pro by the end of the season and live the good life!! Hahaha, Troy even the MC guys are probably begging for your non sense to stop. The old Xstar has one of the best wakes around (Look at that a CC guy saying an Xstar has a great wake) but it drove like a freakin school bus. For such big talk, big name, and best around.... that's the best performance they could come up with? Don't even get me started AGAIN on the marketing side of MC. And don't get me wrong man I like MC I think they build a great boat, but it isn't there boats that get guys on the podium it's there money and what they dish out to buy these guys.
Relax I'm just trying to bait MHunter.

You really think I really believe any of the drivel I spout out? You knooooooow this already. I only started defending MC on this site because no one else would. I still love CC and one of my life's biggest disappointments is the fact that the G is so god-awful ugly that I had no choice but to buy a star.

I've told you this a million times, time for you to turn the page and stop hating so much, life is short...

And to the OP (James): Stay in school! Your odds of collecting a solid paycheck from wakeboarding are slim at best.
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-06-2012, 9:22 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroyD View Post
Relax I'm just trying to bait MHunter.

You really think I really believe any of the drivel I spout out? You knooooooow this already. I only started defending MC on this site because no one else would. I still love CC and one of my life's biggest disappointments is the fact that the G is so god-awful ugly that I had no choice but to buy a star.

I've told you this a million times, time for you to turn the page and stop hating so much, life is short...

And to the OP (James): Stay in school! Your odds of collecting a solid paycheck from wakeboarding are slim at best.
I have plans for life. Even though I'm 14. Don't you worry.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-06-2012, 9:39 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesHawk101 View Post
I have plans for life. Even though I'm 14. Don't you worry.
Elaborate please?
Old    Jimmy S (JamesHawk101)      Join Date: Sep 2012       10-06-2012, 9:59 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by TroyD View Post
Elaborate please?
You can invest money you win.
Have another job mainly.
For me I would like to be a action sports cinematographer, in the sports I do like snow skiing, downhill mtb, and wakeboarding. But first be a pro wake boarder. Follow your dreams in exactly what I going to do.
Old    Travis (fman)      Join Date: Nov 2008       10-06-2012, 10:28 PM Reply   
James, here is how you become a pro wakeboarder....

Get a really good education, this will allow you to get a great job, this will allow you to afford a great boat, and then when you go "pro" your sponser will give you a free wakeboard to use!

Very little money in this sport, no different than a pro snow skiier, skateboarder, surfer, etc... most pro wakeboarders have a full time "job" to pay there bills, and wakeboard on the weekends and evenings...
Old    Seahawks #1 Fan Robert T (cwb4me)      Join Date: Apr 2010       10-07-2012, 4:24 AM Reply   
Most all pro wake boarders come up through the ranks too. They all have started wake boarding by the time they are 12 to 14.i don't personally know any 14 year olds that own a Wake boat. I guess if you cut enough grass and washed enough cars it could be possible.
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       10-07-2012, 5:26 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesHawk101 View Post
You can invest money you win.
Have another job mainly.
For me I would like to be a action sports cinematographer, in the sports I do like snow skiing, downhill mtb, and wakeboarding. But first be a pro wake boarder. Follow your dreams in exactly what I going to do.
If you want to be rolling in a 100K plus boat you'll need to be in the top 3-5 percent of income earners. You won't get there filming. Most other jobs that pay very high wages require you to always be working. I'd say enjoy your youth where your old man makes the boat payment and maybe in 6-7 years you can buy that SAN 230 he's about to buy from him cheap.

Reply
Share 

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 6:33 PM.

Home   Articles   Pics/Video   Gear   Wake 101   Events   Community   Forums   Classifieds   Contests   Shop   Search
Wake World Home

 

© 2012 eWake, Inc.    
Advertise    |    Contact    |    Terms of Use    |    Privacy Policy    |    Report Abuse    |    Conduct    |    About Us