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Old    Logan Ball (LBall22)      Join Date: Aug 2012       09-18-2012, 6:32 PM Reply   
All things being equal, and could be had for relatively the same price what would you choose? Looking for best all around boat
Old    Matt K (matt75)      Join Date: Nov 2010       09-18-2012, 7:05 PM Reply   
I haven't ridden behind an MB or Mojo, but have an Axis. Love how you can scale the wake and how simple the boat is. The quality of interior I would give to MB. I'm not a fan of the dash or interior layout of the Mojo. I wouldn't even consider it...2013 Moomba LSV I would in that price range. Surfing wake I would have to give to MB, but wakeboard wake- Axis.
Best to demo all three and see what YOU like about each of them. Dealer support is important too- so talk to buddies that purchased boats from dealers who sell these brands and get feedback from them.
Old    Seahawks #1 Fan Robert T (cwb4me)      Join Date: Apr 2010       09-18-2012, 7:14 PM Reply   
If you told us what were your preferences between Surfing,Skiing,Wakeboarding and tubing.Then we could tell you which boat will serve you the best.
Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       09-18-2012, 10:17 PM Reply   
x2 robert.... need more info about you and your needs.

I have not ridden or driven the mojo yet. But between the MB and Axis, I made my choice and am very happy, but you are not me. If you really like wakeboarding then go demo both boats to see the wake shape. Bring a 400-600 sack for the MB in the bow, I hear that with stock 1800 the wake is really good. For the Axis, bring vdrive locker sacks 400 or 500's, plus a 650-1000 triangle sack, that will give you about 2500+ of ballast total and you can see for yourself how the 2 wakes compare. They are very different and it is just rider preference of which is better.(also take those sacks on the mojo).

MB's interior is very high quality, magnetic carpet is the most ingenious carpet of any manufacture, cab forward design, small bow, and small sunpad gives a big cabin area and you can definitely notice it. The wake is on the steeper side, but not SAN steep. Handles chop well, but does not turn/handle very well for a 21 footer (added tracking fin option helps with this according to salesman). Does not need crazy amount of weight to get a big steep wake, although if you load her down, the wake gets huge. Due to ballast design, the seat bases are low and you feel like you sit high up in the boat compared to some boats. Has a lot of nice standard features. No decals, all graphics are gelled in... good or bad, that is all preference. The 4 point tower is solid, the new 2 point is unknown thus far. Boat seams to have a lot of storage, lockers fit full size wake boards with bindings. The pumpless ballast is cool and very fast. Its great if you never want more weight than stock. otherwise you have to add a separate pump system or use sumo sacks and pumps.

Axis interior is simple and vinyl is lower quality/thickness (2013 has really nice vinyl tho), snap out carpet is nice. Cabin space is big and has a big bow. Chilax seats are awesome and slide box seat allows 4-5 people to sit facing the rider comfortably. The boat handles really well for a 21 footer, except that it is a 22 footer, turns wherever you point it (even with 4800 lbs in it). Tower is solid, requires 4 hand knobs (or 4 bolts) to be removed to lower tower on 2012+ boats. 2011 and before it is 8 hand knobs or bolts. bimini works great. The speedster style windshield without sides works great. Some do not like the looks, but thats all preference. Having that open side is very functional. you don't have to stand to talk to your rider and you can grab the dock and hold it while sitting down. Never had any problems with splashing water from the sides. The wake is very mellow, add more weight it gets steeper. It is a malibu, so it likes and needs bow weight. It also needs more weight than the MB to get a similar size wake i think. The wake at slow speeds (17-18) is clean and mellow, great for beginners and kids, but then throw more and more weight at it and the wake gets more and more amazing. The wake is one of the least tempermental that I have experienced in that it is not sensitive to weight shifts, that the wake is really clean and not finicky. Plug n play is awesome. just pick the rear bags you want and you can install them in an hour or less. Drop your boat in, hit 4 switches, and in about 5-10 minutes (depending on the rear sacks you choose) you have a really nicely weighted boat.... no pumps over the side. Storage is good, but once you throw sacks in the lockers, then you start to run out of storage fast. The seats are pull off seats, no hinges. The rear corner cushions can be hard to get out. The rear lockers will not fit a wakeboard with bindings. it will fit wakeskates and wakeboards without bindings. Swimstep is solid, big, and is the tightest looking swimstep I have seen.... great design. 2012+ have the new platform designed to improve the surf wave. (I don't surf but I think for occasional surfers, the old platform is not an issue).

They both drive significantly different and the wakes are significantly different. Have fun demoing. Take a friend and some fat sacks.
Old    J D (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       09-19-2012, 5:07 AM Reply   
Why would you advise him to put 400 in one boat and 2,500 in the other boat when demo'ing? Apples to oranges much?
Old    Ian Brown (wakereviews)      Join Date: Sep 2006       09-19-2012, 5:22 AM Reply   
Since they have changed the fins on the MB's they handle a TON better. It is night and day. My F24 handles incredible, even for a 24 footer. if you are considering the MB 21 footers, then the stock wake is very very good. If you are looking for perfection then the 400 in the nose helps a lot. Am I biased? Yes as I have an MB and have a promo deal with them. But I do believe their build quality is as good as anyone else in any price range.
Old    jkw (lakesurfer)      Join Date: Jul 2009       09-19-2012, 5:48 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeff_mn View Post
Why would you advise him to put 400 in one boat and 2,500 in the other boat when demo'ing? Apples to oranges much?
I think he means 400lbs in addition to the stock 1,800lbs quick fill
Old    Shawndoggy (shawndoggy)      Join Date: Nov 2009       09-19-2012, 5:52 AM Reply   
I have an MB twb 23 and I like it but I've also cautioned people against them if they pull newbs or kids a lot. The wake won't clean up under 21mph, and even when it does it's bigger and steeper than some other boats, even with the ballast empty. If you need the ability to keep it slow and clean, simply put, MB is the wrong boat.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-19-2012, 6:19 AM Reply   
As others have said, we need to know what you intend to use the boat for. I love my A22, but we wakeboard and surf exclusively.

Also, what are you local dealer options, and where are you located. Whatever boat you buy, you should consider potential resale value down the line. Some markets are more receptive to a particular brand or brands. Keep in mind that, regardless of what you buy, you will eventually need something fixed, and it's nice to have a good local dealer to work with who knows the boat you have.
Old    J D (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       09-19-2012, 6:39 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by lakesurfer View Post
I think he means 400lbs in addition to the stock 1,800lbs quick fill
I get that.

But he said bring 400 for the nose of the MB.
And bring 600's and a 1000lbs bow sack for the Axis..

Just seems odd to say to bring a **** pile of weight for one boat and only a nose sack for the other and think it's a fair comparison. Stock ballast + 2200 in the Axis better be a better wake than stock ballast + 400 in the MB..

I get that this is where people say the wake is "dialed" - but some people put 1500lbs in a 2000 X-Star and some people put 5500 in a 2000 X-Star, both say its dialed but they dont comapre. Just thougth it was odd. Perhaps it just says something about both boats.
Old    Rance Taylor (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       09-19-2012, 6:54 AM Reply   
What he is saying about the boats and the weight is correct. I have owned both boats and the MB is just a better boat overall. The wake on an MB is more tempermental than an Axis but if you don't want to add an additional 2500lbs of weight every time you get in the boat then MB it is. Boat handles just as good as the Axis too. The MB will take rough water a little better than the Axis.

With all that being said, you can't go wrong with either boat really. If you buy the Axis, get the A22. MY choice MB 21TC!!

Last edited by DatTexasBoy; 09-19-2012 at 6:56 AM.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-19-2012, 7:07 AM Reply   
I disagree that you have to add 2500lbs to get a good wake out of an A22. That being said, you can put 5klbs of weight in the A22 if you want a pro sized wake, and the boat can handle it and the wake will retain shape without washing. There's a reason why Deano and Vandall love their A22's.
Old    J D (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       09-19-2012, 7:10 AM Reply   
^^ It doesn't happen to be the same reason that every pro rider is happy with the boat they are sponsered by, does it? Or is Axis somehow different where the riders appreciate the actual boat itself, not the saved $60-$120,000 investment?
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-19-2012, 7:13 AM Reply   
In considering whether to buy and Axis or an MB, do a search on here. There have been tons of threads comparing the two brands. Personally, I like having pumps for rear, center and front ballast. I'm not sure whether MB has the option of adding ballast for the nose yet or not. If not, then you're stuck using a manual pump and bag. I also like how, with Axis, you have the option of adding extra bags by just hooking up two hoses with the plug n play system.

I love the idea of how fast the pure vert is, but I'm not sure how easy the system is to really dial in a wake when you need to dump just a little weight or add just a little weight for fine tune adjustments. Again, I may be way off here, but I seem to recall a few people making that observation about pure vert.

As for fit and finish, for the pre-'13 boats, there's no doubt that the mb vinyl is superior. I'm not sure that holds true for the '13 Axis boats.
Old    Rance Taylor (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       09-19-2012, 7:18 AM Reply   
Chatt- I totally agree that you don't have to add that weight to the Axis to have a great wake. Although with stock ballast and wedge it will not be near as big as stock MB. Axis boats are very good and it just depends on what you want out of a boat. The pure vert system is super wasy to use and to dial in, but you have to use either lead or a manual sack in the front to add weight. You can however add a custom system from wakemakers if you want(pumps,sacs,etc)

I had bad service #1 reason I didn't buy another Axis, second I wasn't pleased with the interior. They have since upgraded the interior on the Axis, but I doubt it is 52g vinyl. As far as the service goes, I had no choice TXMC is the best I've found and they just happen to carry MB!!!

Last edited by DatTexasBoy; 09-19-2012 at 7:23 AM.
Old    Chattwake (chattwake)      Join Date: Jan 2010       09-19-2012, 7:19 AM Reply   
JD, well, I spent a bunch of time talking to Deano and Vandall in Tampa at the Red Bull Wake Open about their A22's (and mine), and they definitely love their boats and the A22 wake. I think it's fairly well known and accepted fact that the A22 can handle tons of weight and produces one of the most clean, non-tempermental, well shaped wakes on the market. It's just something to keep in mind when demoing and considering a purchase - especially if you are an pretty advanced rider.

Rance - I don't doubt that you are correct regarding factory ballast. Oh, and I'm sorry to hear you had bad service. That's one of the points I made earlier. It's important to know who the good local dealers are. If my BU/Axis dealer was terrible, it would be hard for me to own an Axis or Malibu.

Last edited by chattwake; 09-19-2012 at 7:21 AM.
Old    Rance Taylor (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       09-19-2012, 7:27 AM Reply   
Chatt- You know the boats very well and I used alot of your info on various things while I owned my Axis. I have a very close friend whom I talked into buying an Axis while I had mine and I assure you had I been getting good service I would have bought another one.

I never heard of MB before I really started searching because of the service issue.

Thx
Old    L W (501s)      Join Date: Feb 2010       09-19-2012, 7:37 AM Reply   
No Love for the Mojo? Oh wait it's WW. Demo one of these too. The Mojo Wake is excellent, surf wave is Bananas and it is a very well built boat. We just spent a week houseboating and riding the Mojo everyday. Can't say enough good things about this boat. And you don't need a ton of weight to produce a huge wake. And it can be clean for kids under 21mph which is a big plus for familes.
Old    Diggs (pdxWAKE) (tyler97217)      Join Date: Aug 2004       09-19-2012, 7:45 AM Reply   
I have not ridden behind any of these. I have checked them out and heard peoples reviews. My preference would be in this order.....
Mojo
MB
Axis

This is strictly my own opinon in that order just from my observation and assuming all prices are even. Everyone else's opinion could and should be different. You really need to go and look at all three, demo them, and make sure you are working with a dealer that you want to have a relationship with.
Old    Jason Buffalow (buffalow)      Join Date: Apr 2002       09-19-2012, 7:52 AM Reply   
Hey Logan,

Where are you at in the country? I can set you up with an MB demo.

I will not preach the brand. The best thing you can do is compare boat to boat, no sacks and make a decision yourself.
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       09-19-2012, 8:27 AM Reply   
I think the point of Johnny's post about 400 in the nose of the MB and all the extra ballast in teh Axis is that the MB with the extra bow weight and the Axis with the plug and play have similar quality wakes and how most advanced riders would set them up.

As for which boat this would be a tough choice. I would love to have all 3. It sounds like all can make amazing wakeboard and surf wakes with the correct ballast setup. The Moomba and MB have more freeboard then the axis but the Moomba is noticably deeper inside than the MB. The MB appears to have the best fit and finish of the 3. I think the MB is the best looking. I am not a huge fan of the looks of the Axis or Mojo. If it was me and the prices were all the same I think I would rank them like this

1) MB TWB or Tomcat and plumb in triple ballast to help with wakeboard and surf wakes.
2) Mojo with plug and play
3) Axis with plug and play and wedge.

There isn't much seperation their though. A good dealer or better deal could easily change the order in which I would pick those boats.
Old    J D (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       09-19-2012, 10:04 AM Reply   
My opinion is that anyone who says there isn't a seperation between them hasn't sat inside of them.

MB - plush interior, solid wake, fast ballast
Axis - bomb wake, worst interior of group, huge ballast upgradability, optional seating
Mojo - solid wake, middle interior, lots of freeboard, 1 piece tower

Comes down to priority. Plush interior? MB. Best wake? Axis. Good middle ground for all? Mojo.

The end result is the same as every single thread about "what boat to get". It comes down to the demo, the service from your local dealer and what your intended use is. I'd buy an MB - fits my needs most. Chatt loves the Axis. Fits his needs best. Levi loves his friends Mojo - fits his needs best.

All great boats - all very different.
Old    J D (jeff_mn)      Join Date: Jul 2009       09-19-2012, 10:08 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattwake View Post
JD, well, I spent a bunch of time talking to Deano and Vandall in Tampa at the Red Bull Wake Open about their A22's (and mine), and they definitely love their boats and the A22 wake. .
This is not unlike any other sponsored rider. No one sits around at a show or wherever talking about how they hate their free expensive wake boat. I'm sure Harley would sit around and tell you about how he loves his X Star and if you had one he'd talk about how awesome yours was too.

Your conversation with those guys is not an isolated incident. I believe 100% they that they are happy with their boats. But I'll bet you 99% of guys with a free $100k boat in their slip are happy with theirs too.
Old    Jeff Hill (hillbilly)      Join Date: Aug 2002       09-19-2012, 10:39 AM Reply   
FWIW.....A friend of mine runs a stereo shop and he says MB is the best fit/finished of all. And he see's all brands. To me that says a lot.
I own an 07 Moomba LSV.....I love my boat...but fit/finish is not it's strong point.
Agree all 3 would be nice to own.....
I like the fact I don't see a lot of other Moomba's where I ride. And it's fun watching ppl be surprised that my budget boat has a legit wake!!!!!
Old    Andrew Carnacchi (07launch22ssv)      Join Date: Feb 2007       09-19-2012, 11:04 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by hillbilly View Post
I own an 07 Moomba LSV.....I love my boat...but fit/finish is not it's strong point.
Moombas of that vintage and Moombas of today are not even comparable in that department.....
Old    Jeff Hill (hillbilly)      Join Date: Aug 2002       09-19-2012, 12:26 PM Reply   
I know 05 and older qaulity and everything was pretty bad.
I'm not saying its falling apart....things loosen up in boats I get that.
Just a few little things.....Again I love my boat and we run it 90% of the time it is on the water. It doesnt just sit and float.
Old    Johnny (johnny_defacto)      Join Date: Sep 2006       09-19-2012, 1:52 PM Reply   
yeah JD, maybe I wasn't very clear. I was suggesting to the OP to make 2 very different boats easier to compare (trying to make it apples vs apples) by setting them up the way most riders seem to like both boats. The MB has a lot more stock ballast but nothing up front. I hear often that all you need is a front 400-600 sack in the bow of the 21'ers and with the stock ballast = 2200-2400 the wake is really good. (my few experiences were with 21'ers really loaded up though). As for axis, the stock 900 plus 2 400's and a bow sack 600-1000 for a total of = 2300-2700 would mimic how most people set up their plug n plays. the 600-1000 bow sack to represent the 950 under floor pnp front sack (completely full probably closer to 750 lbs). As I said before, I think the MB requires a little less weight than the A22 to get a similar size wake... thus 2200 vs 2700 is apple to apples in my opinion.

And as far as the f21/twb handling as well as the axis... i need to drive a new MB with the second fin. I know the running surface of both boats has not changed in the last few years for MB and never for Axis, but the MB's I have driven and ridden in turned as well as a master craft... it may have had one fin, or none, but the A22 with the single fin will turn inside it all day without chine locking... even with 4800 lbs in it. Also, you can add a 2nd tracking fin to the Axis as well, but if you need that fin to turn around where you ride, then your riding spot is way too narrow to wakeboard in
Old    Tyler Smith (smitty1258)      Join Date: Jun 2009       09-19-2012, 7:26 PM Reply   
Why not look into an Epic if your in that price range?

Fast fill ballast in the nose and both sides, sick wake with no weight and clean at 19mph+

http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=795017

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