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Old    Aaron (aarond0083)      Join Date: Apr 2007       08-23-2012, 10:21 AM Reply   
Hopefully this boat doesn't belong to anyone here. I can't tell exactly what make and model it is but appears to be a wake boat. MasterCraft maybe because of the pickle fork bow?

My wife's cousin is a police officer up in Holyoke, MA and he posted these pictures on his FaceBook this morning. Happened on the Connecticut River. Thankfully the five people on board weren't injured but the boat is toast.










Old    Rob.B (rbeckei)      Join Date: May 2007       08-23-2012, 10:32 AM Reply   
Wow, It looks like a mastercraft
Old    Dave (davenk)      Join Date: Feb 2008       08-23-2012, 10:38 AM Reply   
I wonder if it has anything to do with not running their blower motor?
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-23-2012, 10:58 AM Reply   
That looks like an X2.
Old    Tom (boardjnky4)      Join Date: Dec 2011       08-23-2012, 11:05 AM Reply   
it always has something to do with not running the blower motor
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       08-23-2012, 11:13 AM Reply   
Wow!! Glad everyone was OK. Thats would ruin your day!
Old    Murphy Smith (murphy_smith)      Join Date: Dec 2005       08-23-2012, 12:04 PM Reply   
That is the second mastercraft I have seen on fire this summer...
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       08-23-2012, 1:01 PM Reply   
Thats what happens when there is to much friction from the payments rubbing on the bank accounts.
Old    Joe (ilikebeaverandboats)      Join Date: Jul 2007       08-23-2012, 1:06 PM Reply   
glad i replaced my blower yesterday!
Old    RB (boardman74)      Join Date: Jul 2012       08-23-2012, 1:17 PM Reply   
Paul.....isn't that the truth!!!!
Old    CORY MITCHELL (stang_killa_ss)      Join Date: Jan 2010       08-23-2012, 1:23 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by psudy View Post
Thats what happens when there is to much friction from the payments rubbing on the bank accounts.
lol
Old    Dan (hco)      Join Date: Jun 2006       08-23-2012, 1:50 PM Reply   
LOL@ the size of the hose on the water rescue boat. I think my garden hose has a better flow rate than that 'rescue' craft.
Old    Paul (paublo)      Join Date: Jul 2002       08-23-2012, 2:04 PM Reply   
That was almost me two years ago. I'm idling back in towards the dock after being out for a few hours and the engine starts missing while at the same time I smell gas. I slip it into neutral and go back and pop the engine cover. I have a '09 SAN 210 with the PCM 343, and the fuel pump/filter cannister had come unclamped, dropped down about 3", and raw gas was spraying everywhere. Threre were probably 8 people in the boat including 3 small grandsons. I stopped the engine and yelled for everyone to jump out and swim clear of the boat. After 15 min. we pulled it to the dock with a rope and carefully checked it out. There was about a 1/2" of gas in the bottom. We still don't know why it didn't blow up when that much gas was spraying around a running engine. The dealer looked it over for a week and never could figure out how that came apart. We were just extremely lucky that it just wasn't our time to go or else it was devine intervention, because that boat should have blown sky high.
Old    Cobra Rob (CobraRob)      Join Date: Aug 2010       08-23-2012, 2:12 PM Reply   
Paul because it's REALLY hard to ignite gas. Too much concentration and it won't ignite. It's only the fumes that will ignite in a situation like that. Also need the right ratio of O2.


As for the boat looks more like a Tomcat to me. The bow is too far apart and not pointy enough to be a MC.
Old    BELEZA (beleza)      Join Date: Mar 2010       08-23-2012, 2:23 PM Reply   
hard to find an MB way up in MA. judging by the rear lines of the boat I would also guess its a Mastercraft
Old    LR3w8kbrdr            08-23-2012, 2:31 PM Reply   
Glad to hear someone say an X2...for a moment I thought it was TroyD in his new Xstar ballin glad to hear it wasnt
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       08-23-2012, 2:36 PM Reply   
It is definately an X2/Maristar 200.
Old    MCXSTAR (snork)      Join Date: Jun 2007       08-23-2012, 5:14 PM Reply   
Not an XStar, but if it were not for the chine I'd would had guessed it was. possibly an X2. Must be time to get a new 2013 XStar
Old    Aaron (aarond0083)      Join Date: Apr 2007       08-23-2012, 5:44 PM Reply   
Wonder why the tower isn't visible at all?
Old    Jeff Rowland (HygOctaneGraphics)      Join Date: Oct 2011       08-23-2012, 5:59 PM Reply   
Tower is laying next to the boat. It obviously fell. Either way this sucks. Glad everyone is ok.


Jeff Rowland - Hygh Octane Graphics
Old    KnoxVol (KnoxVol)      Join Date: May 2012       08-23-2012, 9:51 PM Reply   
So looks like a 2007 Mastercraft. Given that it says it was a 20' boat, has to be an X2.

http://www.gazettenet.com/2012/08/24...occupants-flee
Old    Tim (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       08-24-2012, 6:10 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CobraRob View Post
Paul because it's REALLY hard to ignite gas. Too much concentration and it won't ignite. It's only the fumes that will ignite in a situation like that. Also need the right ratio of O2.
Don't count on that theory to save your ass. There is no telling when you reach that magical ratio. I'm just getting over serious fuel related burns. I never thought I would be on fire "literally" and there was no warning.
Old    A S (ag04blast)      Join Date: Jun 2012       08-24-2012, 6:48 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by srock View Post
Don't count on that theory to save your ass. There is no telling when you reach that magical ratio. I'm just getting over serious fuel related burns. I never thought I would be on fire "literally" and there was no warning.
This requires repeating. Do not under estimate the ease of igniting gasoline vapors. While the flammability limits of gas vapor is only between 1.5-8%, that mixture is easily achieved from natural vaporization and that mixture requires little energy to reach ignition. And worse yet the consequences from such an event can be bad real fast, especially in an environment when many more flammable materials are right there to add fuel to the fire (literally).
Old    Brendan (kybool)      Join Date: Aug 2004       08-24-2012, 7:57 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by psudy View Post
Thats what happens when there is to much friction from the payments rubbing on the bank accounts.
Great quote, I wish my friction would finally create a spark
Old    Haugy            08-24-2012, 9:42 AM Reply   
That's just the new G23's onboard heater.
Old    Trenton Allman (TrentAllman1)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-24-2012, 5:01 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by CobraRob View Post
Paul because it's REALLY hard to ignite gas. Too much concentration and it won't ignite. It's only the fumes that will ignite in a situation like that. Also need the right ratio of O2.


As for the boat looks more like a Tomcat to me. The bow is too far apart and not pointy enough to be a MC.
My guess is it was too rich to burn, gas will only burn/explode in the proper air/fuel mixture
Old    Timmy! (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       08-24-2012, 5:15 PM Reply   
Yikes! Run the blower...
Old     (constructor)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-25-2012, 9:10 AM Reply   
I ran the Gen III chevys in off road race rigs, they will run upside down and don't leak gas if they are correctly assembled. If you smell gas something is wrong with the fuel delivery system, hoses, connections, filter or fuel pump, usually after the high pressure fuel pump.
I found a fuel pump on a new boat installed by Indmar with a loose stud on top of the fuel pump, it was squirting gas all over. It was a 20 minute fix but should have been caught in testing by the boat manufacturer.
Old    Raf (Raf1985)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-25-2012, 6:25 PM Reply   
After reading this I ran my blower non stop all day today, from the minute I arrived at the launch ramp, all through party beach time, and up until the moment it was pulled from the water. Neurotic? Nah........
Old    David Langston (rdlangston13)      Join Date: Feb 2011       08-25-2012, 6:43 PM Reply   
i run my blower for 5-10 mins before launch and shut it off a few minutes after the engine is started. i run again after we are stopped for a good amount of time before restarting the boat. not sure is that is adequate but it seems to be working for us. running it all day would be annoying since it seems to create a hiss thru the stereo speakers when on
Old     (constructor)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-26-2012, 5:23 PM Reply   
I'll take a educated guess here, Indmar engine with a fuel pump that has 3 studs on top, studs are also used to mount the fuel pump in rubber. Someone cross threaded the nut mounting it to the engine, tried to remove the nut loosening the stud below holding the fuel pump plate to the pump body... gas squirts out between pump body and top plate.
Pump is located on the starboard side in a V drive, looks like this. photo up in a minute.
Old     (constructor)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-26-2012, 6:01 PM Reply   
Sorry computer not recognizing my droid at the moment, anyway from the side it kind of looks like a small gold colored oil filter mounted near what would
normally be the rear of the engine in a car and below the exhaust ports in the head. There is a 5/16" hose attached near the top front and rear. If you smell fuel that is the first area to check for a leak.
Old    Ron (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-27-2012, 7:13 AM Reply   
Boat just exploded on one of my home lakes last week. Everyone was ok but makes me wonder what they would have done if it was another month later and the water was 55 degrees.

Would sure like to know what boat this is.

http://www.wxow.com/story/19371911/b...n-lake-mendota
Old    Cory D (cadunkle)      Join Date: Jul 2009       08-28-2012, 6:05 AM Reply   
This is what happens when you don't use transom straps! Oh, wrong thread...
Old    Ron (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-28-2012, 6:08 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordicron View Post
Boat just exploded on one of my home lakes last week. Everyone was ok but makes me wonder what they would have done if it was another month later and the water was 55 degrees.

Would sure like to know what boat this is.

http://www.wxow.com/story/19371911/b...n-lake-mendota
Just read in another article this boat was a 2010 SAN 230. nothing running blower would have done in this case I don't think.
Old    LR3w8kbrdr            08-28-2012, 7:05 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nordicron View Post
Boat just exploded on one of my home lakes last week. Everyone was ok but makes me wonder what they would have done if it was another month later and the water was 55 degrees.

Would sure like to know what boat this is.

http://www.wxow.com/story/19371911/b...n-lake-mendota
Forget the boat...Im curious to know where water is only 55degrees during peak summer!
Old    Ron (Nordicron)      Join Date: Aug 2011       08-28-2012, 8:10 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by LR3w8kbrdr View Post
Forget the boat...Im curious to know where water is only 55degrees during peak summer!
Lol! No we go out well into nov here in wisconsin when the water can be below 40! For sure drysuit time. Couldn't imagine having to ditch the boat during those times.
Old     (constructor)      Join Date: Aug 2012       08-28-2012, 8:23 AM Reply   
This is the photo I tried to post yesterday. This was found on a 1 day old boat, Indmar engine. Not sure if Indmar installs the fuel pump or the manufacturer did. You can see the stud was not tight and did not hold the top plate on the fuel pump. After a 20 minute ride we slowed down in a no wake zone and smelled gas. I cut the engine and jerked the hatch open, the fumes were bad. I pulled the side panels off around the engine and found gas dripping off of this fuel pump. There was apx 1/2" of gas built up in the hull below the engine. Blowers would not have saved this one either and it could have blown riding down the lake.
It seems to me the manufacturer would test the engine and boat before sending them to customers. It seems like the guy that installed the pump would know the risk of leaking fuel in a boat but in this case the guy that installed this one should go back to sweeping up.
Anyway it took me about 20 minutes total to fix the pump and get it back together.

If you smell gas don't just run the blower, find the leak.
Attached Images
 
Old    Raf (Raf1985)      Join Date: Mar 2012       08-29-2012, 8:11 AM Reply   
^^what boat is that? so much for quality control if its 1 one day old....
Old    Scott Bartley (kysurfer)      Join Date: Jul 2012       09-02-2012, 10:37 PM Reply   
Damn,,, that's why I check my boats out before each launch !!!!
Old    Troy Deschamps (TroyD)      Join Date: Jan 2012       09-03-2012, 1:33 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by LR3w8kbrdr View Post
Glad to hear someone say an X2...for a moment I thought it was TroyD in his new Xstar ballin glad to hear it wasnt
My new Star will not run on gas, only my sense of self-satisfaction will power it.

It's deff an X2 though.
Old    Jo Shmoe (joeshmoe)      Join Date: Jan 2003       09-03-2012, 3:35 PM Reply   
"i run my blower for 5-10 mins before launch and shut it off a few minutes after the engine is started." Not good enough,
The only time you should shut off the blower is when you are up to speed, then air is automatically blowing through the engine.
Old    Kat Laird (wakekat15)      Join Date: Jul 2005       09-04-2012, 5:56 PM Reply   
Yet another over the holiday weekend:

http://www.kten.com/story/19446415/l...plosion-update
Old    Max T. (airbeast)      Join Date: Oct 2009       09-05-2012, 10:59 PM Reply   
Man that sucks. I feel more at ease being diesel powered. No exposed fuel and no gas all together.
Old    Haugy            09-06-2012, 9:02 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by airbeast View Post
Man that sucks. I feel more at ease being diesel powered. No exposed fuel and no gas all together.
You're not very smart are you? I've seen just as many diesels burn as I have seen gas.
Old    Sheldon (Fiveflat)      Join Date: Sep 2010       09-06-2012, 9:47 AM Reply   
How many people really run their blowers non stop while the engine is running? I definitely run it for about 5 minutes when I launch my boat while I'm parking the truck and trailer but I shut it off after I start...
Old    Tim (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       09-06-2012, 9:51 AM Reply   
I started to this year. Big deal if it runs constantly. It also helps keep the engine compartment cooler especially if you run it a couple minutes after shutdown.
Old    Brett B. (Brett_B)      Join Date: Sep 2010       09-06-2012, 9:57 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by constructor View Post
This is the photo I tried to post yesterday. This was found on a 1 day old boat, Indmar engine. Not sure if Indmar installs the fuel pump or the manufacturer did. You can see the stud was not tight and did not hold the top plate on the fuel pump. After a 20 minute ride we slowed down in a no wake zone and smelled gas. I cut the engine and jerked the hatch open, the fumes were bad. I pulled the side panels off around the engine and found gas dripping off of this fuel pump. There was apx 1/2" of gas built up in the hull below the engine. Blowers would not have saved this one either and it could have blown riding down the lake.
It seems to me the manufacturer would test the engine and boat before sending them to customers. It seems like the guy that installed the pump would know the risk of leaking fuel in a boat but in this case the guy that installed this one should go back to sweeping up.
Anyway it took me about 20 minutes total to fix the pump and get it back together.

If you smell gas don't just run the blower, find the leak.

Why would Indmar install the fuel pump in the boat? Wouldn't that be the boat manufacturer? Just like the manufacturer also installs the fuel tank and fuel lines into the boat? You certainly seem to have some anti-Indmar bias. If the boat is 1-week old and spraying fuel from a fuel pump mounted in the hull near the v-drive then that is the manufacturers fault, since they are supposed to water test every boat. How about you tell us who the manufacturer is?

Last edited by Brett_B; 09-06-2012 at 9:59 AM.
Old    Max T. (airbeast)      Join Date: Oct 2009       09-06-2012, 10:17 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haugy View Post
You're not very smart are you? I've seen just as many diesels burn as I have seen gas.
Maybe not but I think I'll safely claim being smarter than you.

What exactly do you do where you see diesel boats burning? I've yet to see any boat burn in person.

Unless you have a leak, there's no exposed fuel with direct injection. Different story with mpi and carbs especially. Also no ignition system. In any case, I'll take a diesel leak over a gas leak.

Bilge blowers are not even a requirement on diesel boats in most places.

That said, I run my blower the entire time.
Old    Rance Taylor (DatTexasBoy)      Join Date: Aug 2012       09-06-2012, 2:11 PM Reply   
This thread made me start running mine everytime I go out.
Old    Ben Sampson (816)      Join Date: Dec 2011       09-06-2012, 2:39 PM Reply   
so no blower equals boat fire, totaled boat, and no boat payments=WINNING!!
Old    Raf (Raf1985)      Join Date: Mar 2012       09-06-2012, 3:53 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by DatTexasBoy View Post
This thread made me start running mine everytime I go out.
Same here, last 3 sessions it ran the whole time. Doesn't bother me a bit.
Old     (constructor)      Join Date: Aug 2012       09-06-2012, 9:22 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett_B View Post
Why would Indmar install the fuel pump in the boat? Wouldn't that be the boat manufacturer? Just like the manufacturer also installs the fuel tank and fuel lines into the boat? You certainly seem to have some anti-Indmar bias. If the boat is 1-week old and spraying fuel from a fuel pump mounted in the hull near the v-drive then that is the manufacturers fault, since they are supposed to water test every boat. How about you tell us who the manufacturer is?
The engines are GM, all of the marine add on's are Indmar. The manf said Indmar installed the pump.
I like Indmar but there was a mistake made for sure, you're right Sanger should have caught it.
The point I tried to make is a fuel injected gen III chevy should not smell of gas or leak. I have run them upside down, 14 times in one year, they don't die, they dont leak. If you smell gas find out why. Don't think it is normal and "just" run the blowers.
Old     (constructor)      Join Date: Aug 2012       09-06-2012, 9:23 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brett_B View Post
Why would Indmar install the fuel pump in the boat? Wouldn't that be the boat manufacturer? Just like the manufacturer also installs the fuel tank and fuel lines into the boat? You certainly seem to have some anti-Indmar bias. If the boat is 1-week old and spraying fuel from a fuel pump mounted in the hull near the v-drive then that is the manufacturers fault, since they are supposed to water test every boat. How about you tell us who the manufacturer is?
The engines are GM, all of the marine add on's are Indmar. The manf said Indmar installed the pump.
I like Indmar but there was a mistake made for sure, you're right Sanger should have caught it.
The point I tried to make is a fuel injected gen III chevy should not smell of gas or leak. I have run them upside down, 14 times in one year, they don't die, they dont leak. If you smell gas find out why. Don't think it is normal and "just" run the blowers.
Old    Haugy            09-07-2012, 8:17 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by airbeast View Post
Maybe not but I think I'll safely claim being smarter than you.

What exactly do you do where you see diesel boats burning? I've yet to see any boat burn in person.

Unless you have a leak, there's no exposed fuel with direct injection. Different story with mpi and carbs especially. Also no ignition system. In any case, I'll take a diesel leak over a gas leak.

Bilge blowers are not even a requirement on diesel boats in most places.

That said, I run my blower the entire time.
You said you feel safe because of no exposed fuel and no gas altogether. I take that as you think your diesel fuel won't catch on fire. You said nothing about leaking or not leaking. Most of these fires from gas boats are a gas leak or some sort of fuel pump issue. Even seen fuel filters cause the problem. It's very rare to have a boat fire that wasn't the cause of excess gas somewhere creating vapor, thus, a leak.

So with that, diesel ranks right up there with flammable. Sure the fumes aren't as flammable as gas, but like I said, I've seen just as many diesels burn as gas. But you leak your diesel fuel down a hot exhaust manifold and watch what happens.

S&R 9 years, I've seen lots of boat fires. Claim all you want, but unless you clearly state your point, I'll continue to mock you.
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       09-07-2012, 8:46 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haugy View Post
You said you feel safe because of no exposed fuel and no gas altogether. I take that as you think your diesel fuel won't catch on fire. You said nothing about leaking or not leaking. Most of these fires from gas boats are a gas leak or some sort of fuel pump issue. Even seen fuel filters cause the problem. It's very rare to have a boat fire that wasn't the cause of excess gas somewhere creating vapor, thus, a leak.

So with that, diesel ranks right up there with flammable. Sure the fumes aren't as flammable as gas, but like I said, I've seen just as many diesels burn as gas. But you leak your diesel fuel down a hot exhaust manifold and watch what happens.

S&R 9 years, I've seen lots of boat fires. Claim all you want, but unless you clearly state your point, I'll continue to mock you.
Isn't diesel fuel a lot harder to ignite then gas? Sure it can burn otherwise it wouldn't work as a form of fuel for an internal combustion engine but there is a reason you don't need a marine approved alternator in a boat if the engine is diesel. My guess is most diesel boat fires are caused by electrical shorts more so then the fuel igniting. Sure the diesel may end up burning but it seems like it would ignite only after the boat is already burning and heating up. Plus the fumes are really what you are worried about and from what I can tell diesel fumes aren't explosive. Is this correct?
Old    Raf (Raf1985)      Join Date: Mar 2012       09-07-2012, 9:58 AM Reply   
Diesel fumes are not explosive and diesel will not ignite on a hot manifold. The most flammable fluid in a diesel is tranny fluid or power steering fluid.

If diesel ignites, it will burn like crazy and will be hard to put out. It will not explode though. It's quite unlikely that a spark will ignite the diesel though. It usually takes a nice open flame and a lot of compression to get it going. That's why diesel trucks have ~400psi compression vs a gas engine at 150-200psi.

Last edited by Raf1985; 09-07-2012 at 10:04 AM.
Old    Haugy            09-08-2012, 5:56 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raf1985 View Post
diesel will not ignite on a hot manifold.
Wanna bet? Go try it, let me know how it works out for ya. Go on, I'm dead serious. Go try it, put it on a manifold that has been running hot for a while in an enclosed engine bay so it's even hotter. Go on, try it.

You're right about everything else.
Old    Raf (Raf1985)      Join Date: Mar 2012       09-08-2012, 6:11 PM Reply   
Unless the manifold is glowing red, its highly unlikely that it will ignite. I have had diesel leaking onto a manifold, it sizzled but that's about it.
Old    Joe (ilikebeaverandboats)      Join Date: Jul 2007       09-09-2012, 8:40 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haugy View Post
Wanna bet? Go try it, let me know how it works out for ya. Go on, I'm dead serious. Go try it, put it on a manifold that has been running hot for a while in an enclosed engine bay so it's even hotter. Go on, try it.

You're right about everything else.
As long as your hot manifold is below 410F, nothings gonna happen. But diesel exhaust gets hot, a big limiting factor in high permanence diesel engines is keeping the Exhaust gas temps below 1350 deg F. So I think it would be safe to assume that diesel fuel could auto ignite if it somehow leaks all over the exhaust manifold....

But all your comment has proven is that if you get diesel on your hot manifold it will ignite....but so will gasoline; its auto ignition temp is right around 500F and I'd bet our exhaust manifolds are in that range.... so what is your point? Whether you run your blower or not, diesel or gasoline will auto ignite if spilled on the hot manifold. This is irrelevant. A negative for BOTH types of fuel.


The reason we have a blower, and we run it, is to evacuate the gas vapor that can potentially accumulate and ignite in the bilge if some type of spark is introduced. The gasoline vapor has a flashpoint of -45F...which means at -45F there is ENOUGH vapor above the surface to sustain a flame if an outside source (spark, flame) is supplied. This is at atmospheric pressure, which does not vary drastically with altitude, so we will ignore this factor....but the temperature is very much relevant. As the temperature increases, the amount of vapor will increase (im not sure on the linearity of this relationship). Lets imagine you're engine is cold, first start up, on a hot day, 100F, there will be more vapor that could find its way to your bilge through any leak in the system.

Comparatively, diesel 2's flashpoint is 125F.... This means that unless your fuel tank is above 125F it will contribute NO vapor....

There are always extreme cases, but I think in normal operation and especially in terms of starting a cold engine, diesel is safer.

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