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Old    John Noorlander (Jonoz)      Join Date: Nov 2010       12-01-2010, 12:33 AM Reply   
Are there any boat manufactures in the USA that are relativly small and only doing 60-100 units per year,I am in Australia and have been looking for something other than the big Brands,
In Australia we have quite a few small Manufacturers that do 50-70 boats per year.
So i was wondering if this was the case in your country?
One example is www.matrixmarine.com.au They build about 60-80 per year.
Old    Ian Brown (wakereviews)      Join Date: Sep 2006       12-01-2010, 5:19 AM Reply   
Svfara, Wakecraft, Standard, Chopper (if they are still around), Not sure how many boats Epic makes. Not sure if Gekko is still making boats or not either.
Old    Alan Slabaugh (alans)      Join Date: Aug 2005       12-01-2010, 5:45 AM Reply   
MB is not that small of a brand, but I know there are not a whole lot of them in Australia. There is a new distributor though.

http://www.mbboats.com.au/
Old    Jason (jason95gt)      Join Date: May 2006       12-01-2010, 6:52 AM Reply   
In some cases, these smaller boat companies just buy the hull design/completed hull from another bigger manufacturer and just add there own touches.
Old    Adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu)      Join Date: May 2004       12-01-2010, 8:18 AM Reply   
are gecko or Aztec still around?
Old    jkw (lakesurfer)      Join Date: Jul 2009       12-01-2010, 9:50 AM Reply   
Gekko is owned by Centurion. I believe they are still building boats.

http://www.gekkosports.com/
Old    North Point Watersports (north_point_watersports)      Join Date: Jun 2008       12-01-2010, 11:03 AM Reply   
Calabria is another to add to that list.
Old    SamIngram            12-01-2010, 11:21 AM Reply   
My favorite weird brand was Skipro Extreme, but they went out of business... that boat was crazy! It could literally leap out of the water and would pull your arms out their sockets at full throttle...
Old    Brett Yates (polarbill)      Join Date: Jun 2003       12-01-2010, 12:03 PM Reply   
Calabria(ridiculously spacios interior, low profile/shallow, purevert ballast, pretty decent wakemaking ability)
MB(the new ones are very spacious, deep, have lots of stock ballast with purevert, very good wakemaking ability)
Sanger(very well built, simple, lower profile(especially the V210), very good wake making capability)
Standard(very small, might as well save 20k and buy a nautique 2001)
Epic(huge, ugly(in my opinion), 4k in ballast, hardcore rider oriented, very good wakemaking ability)
Axis(has ties with Malibu, somewhat funky looks, very good wakemaking ability)
svfara(don't know anything about)
wakecraft(hidious, don't know much about other than Dan Dulong)

Last edited by polarbill; 12-01-2010 at 12:10 PM.
Old    D. Cooper (dcooper)      Join Date: Mar 2005       12-01-2010, 12:52 PM Reply   
Supreme still in business?
Old    WakePowell Chris (epic1)      Join Date: Oct 2006       12-01-2010, 1:39 PM Reply   
I like standard. Thats a core boat. Its like a 2001 but with out the stringer and floor root.
Old    Ben Wilcox (benjaminp)      Join Date: Nov 2008       12-01-2010, 2:03 PM Reply   
^Dont let Standard hear you say that.
Old    jkw (lakesurfer)      Join Date: Jul 2009       12-01-2010, 2:05 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcooper View Post
Supreme still in business?
yes, they have a new V226 that is focused on surfing
Old    Brett Burrows (Riteride)      Join Date: Sep 2010       12-01-2010, 2:41 PM Reply   
Ya Supreme is still in business! I was just down there yesterday!
Old    Wake UP And Ride (WakeUpandRide)      Join Date: Jul 2010       12-02-2010, 1:35 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by epic1 View Post
I like standard. Thats a core boat. Its like a 2001 but with out the stringer and floor root.
they really should offer a v-drive version.
Old    Cory D (cadunkle)      Join Date: Jul 2009       12-02-2010, 5:15 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by benjaminp View Post
^Dont let Standard hear you say that.
I think Standard has a good idea, bare bones wake boat. Problem is $30k is ridiculous. Save a lot and buy a 2001. Even if you get a 2001 dirst cheap and do stringers and floor you're still at a fraction of the cost. For well under $30k there are plenty of 2000-something Moombas out there that seem like decent boats with a lot more room and features than Standard. I'm curious how many units they sell each year.
Old    Tyler (lseghatch)      Join Date: Aug 2005       12-03-2010, 12:25 AM Reply   
Toyota Epic - no longer in business


Last edited by lseghatch; 12-03-2010 at 12:26 AM. Reason: pic
Old    Fred (fredlap)      Join Date: Jul 2008       12-03-2010, 4:07 AM Reply   
Session 22 si, but I think they ended all activities... sad, it's a great boat! Great wake (22mph, 2200lbs)
Attached Images
  
Old    Fred (fredlap)      Join Date: Jul 2008       12-03-2010, 4:08 AM Reply   
23mph... sorry!
Old    John Noorlander (Jonoz)      Join Date: Nov 2010       12-05-2010, 4:12 AM Reply   
Anyone know where the Molds ended up for the toyota and the session 22
Old    Fred (fredlap)      Join Date: Jul 2008       12-05-2010, 10:52 AM Reply   
I don't have any idea for Session and I Think Toyota Epic have been purchased by Epic Wake Boat!
Session was a great boat developped by Regal and sold to some guys. I think they produced boats for 3 years but i'm not sure. With no update on their website and no new boat since couple of years... it looks like a dead cie! This is bad! I rode behind this boat for 41/2 years and really loved it! The wake was somewhere between a 210 and a VLX. With 1100lbs of stock ballasts and 2100lbs of extra fat sacs, the wake was pretty awesome! Next year, I'll ride behind a brand new 2011 Epic 23v.... wouhou!
Attached Images
     
Old    WakePowell Chris (epic1)      Join Date: Oct 2006       12-05-2010, 11:55 AM Reply   
im not so sure Epic boats bought the toyota epic molds? they look nothing alike. The toyota hull was a ski hull. Thats like three steps back for a "wake Only" boat like session. Toyota does not seem like the company to sell their molds, ever. Is any one making boats out of toyotas boat plant in Japan?
Old    Brit Rider (brit_rider)      Join Date: May 2004       12-05-2010, 2:42 PM Reply   
Epic Wake Boats and Epic by Toyota have nothing to do with each other.

I love that years on, with no basis on fact at all people continue to just make this stuff up based on them having the same name.
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       12-05-2010, 4:28 PM Reply   
I have a little info on Session. I own a 2004 22si. I've owned a few ski boats and driven atleast 100 others, and this thing stacks up

Regal wanted to get into the Wakeboard market and went full tilt. They built a boat back in 2003, that was a really nice boat, but built some features that not everyone wanted (rear jump seats, swivel mounted observer seat and a TV mounted in the rear). It was funky, but the boat was very solid, and the wake was awesome, and compaired to anything out there at the time. Just diffrent
Regal set there sights on the big dogs, namely Nautique. This market is not built on taking on the big dogs. The boat was to out there, to progressive, and did not do well. This industry is very brand loyal, and going after a main manufacture for market doesn't work. You gotta build the brand from the bottom, like MB, Malibu or Sanger has down. Build down, undercut, then move up. Regal built high end boats, then priced them with the big boys hoping to compete.
They retooled for 2004, and built the 22si. It was a step in the right direction, but was still plagued by an infamilar trait, the walkthrough transom. The wake was still first rate, but buyers in the market want two things....either a brand they recognize, or something that looks and performs like that...at a lower price.
Regal did not provide that, and got sank. Without a price point, and no market base the brand went no where. Despite making a high end boat, the sales did not pan out. They scraped the brand for 2005.
The molds were taken buy some people connected to regal, and the boats continued on. They had big plans for a diesel version of the 22si, and a 20' version was also in the works. Were they went from here I don't know.

The boat has the driving feel of a Nautique. Very solid, easy to drive. The wake has been compared to the current Xstar, and it is at lower weights. Get it weighted down, not so much. Although, I understand the comparison, it is similar. The fit and finish isn't mind blowing, but its clean. Keep in mind was built by Regal. So it's not a Bayliner production or small builder type boat. They are very big, heavy boats, and tend to be saddled down by big weight.

If you are mid to high level, recerational rider, looking for a great boat to take the family out in you will not find a better boat for the price. 2004 22si is probably best, as it is still built by regal and carries a regal warranty. 22Xi if you don't mind the funky seating. I love mine, and won't sell it. Not worth it to sell. It serves me well.
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       12-05-2010, 4:34 PM Reply   
I was told that the president of regal wanted the keep the boat all market friendly, and over proped them. A reprop might help with the problems I had after 2000 Lbs. I don't need it and never tried. it does have great surf wake at 1000lbs dumped on the corner, and enough side to keep it afloat.
Old    Fred (fredlap)      Join Date: Jul 2008       12-05-2010, 4:46 PM Reply   
When I say ''I think'' , it means I'm not sure so it's possible I'm wrong... sorry for that Brit Rider!
Old    Duffy Mahoney (duffymahoney)      Join Date: Sep 2008       12-06-2010, 12:58 PM Reply   
Aztec boats. They always have some for sale in my area.

http://spokane.craigslist.org/boa/2098410549.html
Old    SamIngram            12-06-2010, 1:38 PM Reply   
Quote:
This industry is very brand loyal, and going after a main manufacture for market doesn't work. You gotta build the brand from the bottom, like MB, Malibu or Sanger has down. Build down, undercut, then move up. Regal built high end boats, then priced them with the big boys hoping to compete.
I have no idea what that means but Sanger has been around since the 50's and are the LAST of the major family owned boat manufacturers.

Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       12-06-2010, 3:53 PM Reply   
I meant Sanger builds there own boat, and doesn't aim at anything.
Old    AtTheLake (bmartin)      Join Date: Jan 2007       12-07-2010, 6:19 AM Reply   
If you want way out of the box, here are some designs on an Aluminum towboat by Pravati.

http://pavatimarine.com/wakeboard_an...ard_boats.html
Old    lakeski (lakeski)      Join Date: Dec 2006       12-07-2010, 5:01 PM Reply   
Yes, Toyota is still making boats in Japan:

http://www.toyota.co.jp/marine/

Also, over the years, I think a few people have made posts from Australia and NZ about Toyota Epics on www.epicmarine.com, so there must be some of them down under. Of the 600+ Toyota Epics built, I think 200+ are overseas, primarily in Asia.

Toyota made ski boats and wakeboats. The E21 is a D-Drive closed bow. The E22 is an open bow D-Drive. The X22 is a D-Drive with a tower (I don't recall if it has ballast). The S22 is a V-Drive. The SX22 is a V-Drive with a tower and ballast.

Toyota Epics are great boats with fabulous engines.

Last edited by lakeski; 12-07-2010 at 5:08 PM.
Old    Patrick (jetskiprosx)      Join Date: Aug 2004       12-07-2010, 5:12 PM Reply   
Anyone ever heard of a Marlin Skier? My buddy had one years ago. His was a late 80's if I remember correctly. Closed bow direct drive that looked like a PS190 or Malibu Skier. I have NEVER seen another one in my life. One time I was at a lake a few years ago and I thought I saw one, but it was my buddies old boat, but with a tower haha
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       12-07-2010, 5:36 PM Reply   
^^Yep, used to see a few on my lake back in the day, but haven't seen one in several years. There used to be a California Skier as well.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       12-07-2010, 7:04 PM Reply   
Lakeski, those Ponams look ssooooooo Japanese.
Old    Britt Hogland (bhog)      Join Date: Jul 2006       12-07-2010, 7:34 PM Reply   
I have never ridden behind a Sanger till this summer. My buddy bought an 07 230 and the wake is awesome. Im an old sante 210 guy and the sanger wake prob my favorite now. Its huge with extra weight.
Old    Neil Down (Wakestar)      Join Date: Dec 2010       12-16-2010, 2:29 PM Reply   
I have seen the Matrix boats in Aus when I went there a year ago, small, narrow and not very well finished compared to our US made counterparts. I stayed not too far from where they were made when I was in Adelaide for a week and heard that most of their shapes and ideas came from when they were a dealer for Mastercraft and they copied a lot of parts including the interior. By the look of a few boats I saw on the water they have very little wake and no interior room at all. If you has a lake that has restrictions it may well suffice but apart from that it doesn't look much. I feel sorry for the Aussies having no real large lakes like us and having to put up with small crappy boats.
Old    Bill K (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       12-16-2010, 3:01 PM Reply   
How about SkiPro's Extreme I/O made in McQueeny, TX?

As I recall it was the only AWSA certified I/O ever made. Used to be a huge favorite in the footin world. They had some pretty funky features including an electric telescoping pylon & boom. And they would build the boat with about any motor you wanted. At some point there was talk of a supercharged small block that did like 90 mph?!

I think they were right in the middle of that big flood in TX a year or so ago. Never heard how they did..... or even if they made it that far. Seems like Pat was due for retirement years ago. I drove one in like 2000 & the thing handled awesome.
Old    Tincho (patrricio)      Join Date: Mar 2006       12-17-2010, 3:17 AM Reply   
Here in Argentina we have this manufacture www.skywake.com.ar, nice boats.

http://www.skywake.com.ar/
Old    Steve Murphy (njwaterwarrior)      Join Date: Feb 2003       12-22-2010, 7:33 AM Reply   
patrricio,
Those argentina boats look very similar to the mid to late 90s Mastercraft Prostar's. Nice boats, do you guys get them cheap in country?
Old    paul. (imx)      Join Date: Jul 2009       12-23-2010, 7:00 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wakestar View Post
I have seen the Matrix boats in Aus when I went there a year ago, small, narrow and not very well finished compared to our US made counterparts. I stayed not too far from where they were made when I was in Adelaide for a week and heard that most of their shapes and ideas came from when they were a dealer for Mastercraft and they copied a lot of parts including the interior. By the look of a few boats I saw on the water they have very little wake and no interior room at all. If you has a lake that has restrictions it may well suffice but apart from that it doesn't look much. I feel sorry for the Aussies having no real large lakes like us and having to put up with small crappy boats.
Part of the reason they are narrow is the width restriction of 2.5m on our roads, go over that and you have to carry oversize permits,signs and flags. Bit funny really when you drive in the scrub, particularly up North, and come across multiple configuration road trains that can have as much as four or five trailers and weigh over 100 tons doing 100km/ph. Triples are very common out of the metro area and even overtaking them gets your full attention.

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