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Old    Cody Kauzlarich (codykauz)      Join Date: Jul 2007       10-24-2010, 8:32 AM Reply   
So I sold my '04 Chevy Avalanche with the intentions of purchasing an 07-08 Avalanche, but after doing some searching the Escalade EXT's aren't that much more for comparable years and miles. I am extremely happy with my Avalanche, I just ran so many miles up on it I was to that grey area of selling while it was worth what I owed on it, or drive it until it blew up. Is there any concerns I should have with the Escalade. Insurance really isn't any different, but I assume registration will be a couple hundred more each year.

Thanks Guys,
Cody
Old    Nate (norcalmalibu)      Join Date: Jun 2004       10-24-2010, 7:52 PM Reply   
I think its a no brainier bigger motor 6.2L and six speed transmission. I have a Denali and love it!
Old    Cody Kauzlarich (codykauz)      Join Date: Jul 2007       10-25-2010, 6:41 AM Reply   
That's kind of where I was at as well. I've heard that they are a gas hog, but what truck isn't. I also figure that when I upgrade to a 24ssv, which I hope is soon, it should do a little better towing. Not that the Avalanche ever had a problem, but more power/torque/gearing is always better.
Old    Bruizza (bruizza)      Join Date: May 2009       10-25-2010, 9:05 AM Reply   
The only reason I got an Avalanche instead of the EXT was because of the AWD on the EXT. I live in Colorado and go to the mountains all winter to snowboard and I wanted to be able to have the 4wd system and not the AWD system. Really wish you could get an EXT that wasn't AWD because I would have one, because like you said more power/torque/gearing would be really nice.
Old    Bill K (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-25-2010, 10:43 AM Reply   
I'm not much of a fan of a leather interior. I just find their cold & slick or hot, etc. When I bought my Av, I looked specifically for the cloth interior, which I don't believe is available in the EXT.
Love the truck otherwise. A bigger motor would be nice, I suppose. And the 4WD vs AWD debate might be an issue. My wife used to have an Escalade we towed my 205 with a few times & never found it to be a problem.
Old    Adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu)      Join Date: May 2004       10-25-2010, 12:40 PM Reply   
Bill, I think heated/a/c seats are standard on the ext?? Unless your buying new, cloth can get real nasty depending on who owned before you, leather is so much easier to keep clean and smeeling new.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       10-25-2010, 1:10 PM Reply   
+ 1 Adam, they only get hot or cold if you want them too. I love my Escalade, but my next truck will be an EXT(I need the bed).


And not being a mechanical guru, why would AWD be less attractive than 4wd?
Old    Bill K (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-25-2010, 1:37 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by acurtis_ttu View Post
Bill, I think heated/a/c seats are standard on the ext?? Unless your buying new, cloth can get real nasty depending on who owned before you, leather is so much easier to keep clean and smeeling new.
Yea, I've heard that before. But sitting on leather with shorts on, then peeling your legs off them, mmmm, great. And what happens when you get in the truck wet? Or have a dog on them?

I bought my Av with about 60k miles on it. Had the seats upgraded with heat for about $250. Now the truck has over 100k mikes. I get in it wet all the time, and have 3 dogs in & out of the truck quite a bit. Still no rips or tears in the seats at all. We clean the upholstery maybe once a year. And even my wife, who has a much more sensitive nose than I do, doesn't complain about it smelling. We did 2 long road trips in it this year & nobody said a thing about it.

Paul, apparently the 4WD is a better system than the AWD for a few reasons, mileage for one.
Old    Bruizza (bruizza)      Join Date: May 2009       10-25-2010, 2:17 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by psudy View Post
+ 1 Adam, they only get hot or cold if you want them too. I love my Escalade, but my next truck will be an EXT(I need the bed).


And not being a mechanical guru, why would AWD be less attractive than 4wd?
About 2 weeks before I bought my Avalanche I was headed up to Copper Mountain with a buddy. We were in his AWD Jeep Grand Cherokee. The snow was so bad they shut down the highway. We turned around to head back home and the jeep got stuck. I watched the AWD system spin one front wheel and one rear wheel. That was all I needed to see to make the choice I did not want an AWD system in my truck. So I bought the Avalanche instead of the EXT.
Old    Timmy! (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       10-25-2010, 3:04 PM Reply   
Did you call your insurance agent about the cost on the EXT? It's the #1 stolen vehicle. I think in '07 they started offering the 6.0L in the Avy 1500's so you might be able to find one of those as well. I think the 6.0 was standard in the 2500's from '07+ but I am not positive (the older ones had the optional 8.1L). The EXT is cool, I wouldn't be scared off by the AWD system at all. I drove a Silverado SS with AWD around Colorado in the winter with no problems, didn't feel any different than when my Av was in 4wd high.
Old    Cody Kauzlarich (codykauz)      Join Date: Jul 2007       10-25-2010, 11:44 PM Reply   
Insurance is looking like it will be $8 more a month for an EXT. I'm pretty certain they quit offering the 2500 in 07 but there is a 6.0 option and the newer Avalanches come with the 6-speed. I want leather, that's pretty much a requirement. That's also the reason why I'm comparing an Avalanche with the Escalade because I'll be looking in the direction of an LT 2/3 or LTZ. As far as the Jeep comment, it depends on the AWD setup of your vehicle and I'm not sure of what Cadillac's is. And having opposites spin, as in front-left, rear-right, is also very common in 4WD. Sometimes the AWD will have a 60/40 or 70/30 power split between rear and front wheels until the rears start to spin, it will then relocate power to the front to assist. As I said though, I'm not sure how Cadillac's is designed. But it is strange, I've heard people say they do/don't like the AWD but never really got any kind of an explanation. Maybe like Bruizza said, a bad experience with one and a good with another is all it takes sometimes.
Old    Adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu)      Join Date: May 2004       10-26-2010, 6:25 AM Reply   
Quote:
Yea, I've heard that before. But sitting on leather with shorts on, then peeling your legs off them, mmmm, great. And what happens when you get in the truck wet? Or have a dog on them?
buy longer shorts, lol. j/k. Just a differnece in opinion I guess.

when I get in wet ( i usually have a towel I sit on) but if not the leather dries out much quiker than cloth. I have 3- 50-70 pound boxers.....their area is the back of my tahoe, they ocassionaly jump up front, but I have yet to have anything happen to the leather...it's very puncture resitant. Not to mention a quick wipe with a towel gets every bit of dog hair off the seats.

My brother has a/c seats in his lexus....and living in houston they work great.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       10-26-2010, 7:25 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by bruizza View Post
About 2 weeks before I bought my Avalanche I was headed up to Copper Mountain with a buddy. We were in his AWD Jeep Grand Cherokee. The snow was so bad they shut down the highway. We turned around to head back home and the jeep got stuck. I watched the AWD system spin one front wheel and one rear wheel. That was all I needed to see to make the choice I did not want an AWD system in my truck. So I bought the Avalanche instead of the EXT.
Thats interesting. I thought 4wd worked opposite tires while AWD operated all of them.
Old    Bruizza (bruizza)      Join Date: May 2009       10-26-2010, 9:58 AM Reply   
Like Cody said it only took me the one bad experience with AWD to not want it. For all I know the system in the EXT is the best on the market. It just wasn't for me.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       10-26-2010, 10:21 AM Reply   
Paul, totally depends on the set-up. Theoretically a 4WD system will send 50/50 power to front and rear provided they both have traction. Generally if you lose traction at one end you can end up with one wheel on each axle spinning and having no drive to the wheels with grip. This is why a lot of rough weather or offroad vehicles come with locking rear axles. I've had locking axles on both my Ford and my past Chevy's. In theory now instead of having a minimum of two driving wheels you'll get three. The stock locking axles aren't very aggresive, though. If you really hammer on them they will not lock. If you're crawling out of a snowy driveway or up a muddy hill, then you can hear them clicking in/out of lock. They really work pretty well.

All wheel drive cars can be a different beast. They typically have a torque split. An Audi for instance has a general toque split of 60% front and 40% rear for the transverse motor models (A3) and 50/50 split for the standard models. The RS cars get a 60% rear bias to help with dry performance. It really doesn't work that different on slippery surfaces. If you're on ice and have very little traction you're screwed no matter what. Power will always go to the wheels that don't have grip. That's the downside of a standard differential.

Now, the old trick was to drag the brakes a bit on slipperly surfaces. That gave the differential artifical resistance and would then send some power away from the slipping tires and across the diff to the tires with traction. The new AWD vehicles are very cool. They will do this for you. Effectively they can apply brakes individually to the slipping wheels and transfer all power to wheels with traction. I'm not sure where GM is at with their AWD systems, but the Germans have a solid handle on this. Combine this with a good winter tire and you can go almost anywhere.

Alright..... That was my 4WD/AWD tutorial FWIW.

Personally.... unless you get the Avalanche with a 6.0, then it's Caddy all the way. The 5.3 is a dog. My brother has one. It drives nice, but tows lame.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       10-26-2010, 10:24 AM Reply   
Oh, incidently.... I left out that 4WD vehicles will generally have a low range (essentially super low gearing for offroad or heavy pulling) and you can disable the front drive for improved fuel economy.

I'm sure someone will add to this.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       10-26-2010, 11:52 AM Reply   
Thanks Evan. I believe my escalade has traction control although it is AWD. I would assume that is the same thing your last paragraph is talking about. I have had it in some pretty sticky situtations out hunting and it has never let me down. I would still take the ext over the 5.3.
Old    SamIngram            10-26-2010, 1:07 PM Reply   
Just get a set of ARB's and call it done... strongest locker out there... the only thing stronger is the full spool..
Old    Cody Kauzlarich (codykauz)      Join Date: Jul 2007       10-26-2010, 1:48 PM Reply   
Well, I think that's enough convincing for me. If I wasn't looking at a pretty loaded up Avalanche I wouldn't even consider this, but the price difference is surprisingly minor once you get all the goodies. I also love the woodtrim and how much better the console is integrated into the dash with the Escalade. Thanks for everyone's input.
Old    Trace (trace)      Join Date: Feb 2002       10-26-2010, 1:57 PM Reply   
4WD vehicles also have a true neutral, so they can be towed four-down.
Old    Bill K (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-26-2010, 2:52 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by guido View Post
Personally.... unless you get the Avalanche with a 6.0, then it's Caddy all the way. The 5.3 is a dog. My brother has one. It drives nice, but tows lame.
Interesting. We just towed a 5000+ lb boat plus 4 adults in the Av thru Hells Canyon without a problem. Maybe it's a gearing issue? I have the 5.3 with the 4.10s & it tows pretty good.
Old    Cody Kauzlarich (codykauz)      Join Date: Jul 2007       10-26-2010, 3:42 PM Reply   
I didn't ever have an issue towing with mine. Like I said, I was very happy with it. Towed a Mobius XLV, which isn't a huge boat, but sure isn't that small either.
Old    Bill K (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-26-2010, 4:53 PM Reply   
It's unreal how much these things depreciate too. My wife paid over $50k for her Escalade new. 2.5 yrs later we couldn't even get $19k for it.
Old    Adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu)      Join Date: May 2004       10-27-2010, 7:57 AM Reply   
^^^ Bill, don't know what year yours is, but I've been looking at 07, 08's ( escalades)...around 35-40k miles, they are selling used anywhere from 32-45k.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       10-27-2010, 10:15 AM Reply   
Yeah, if they change body styles the old ones go down quickly. I bought my '07 in early '08 when the gas prices where really high. I got a screaming deal on it.
Old    Bill K (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-27-2010, 10:30 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by acurtis_ttu View Post
^^^ Bill, don't know what year yours is, but I've been looking at 07, 08's ( escalades)...around 35-40k miles, they are selling used anywhere from 32-45k.
The wife's Escalade was a 2000. And not an EXT anyway.

Similar prices for the 07 - 08s around here too. Looks like the 09s go for well over $50k. So $10k a yr in depreciation. I bought my Av when it was 2 yrs old for less than 1/2 what it went for new. Just hard to swallow all that in my book.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       10-27-2010, 10:50 AM Reply   
Bill, I guess it depends on what you're looking for in a tow vehicle. I guess I'm spoiled by the big hp diesels and gassers these days. I want to be able to pull grades at the speed limit. The 6.0 Avalanche will tow our X-star without any issues holding speed. It'll turn 5k rpm's, but wont lose speed on grades. My diesel will haul the same boat without shifting out of overdrive. My old 5.3 tahoe and my brothers avalanche will get the job done, but will drop speed on grades. There are a few local grades where I couldn't hold more than 40-45 mph where the speed limit is 55. So, I guess it all depends what you're demanding of your vehicle. Yes it'll get the job done, but a 6.0 will get very similar mileage and will do a much better job. The 6.2 in the new Caddy is a monster. It's really a great motor.
Old    Bill K (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       10-27-2010, 11:36 AM Reply   
5k RPM??

I think there might be other things going on there. I just don't have the slow going issues your seeing. And I'm not turning more than about 3000 - 3500 RPM. And we're pulling over 2000' or 3000' passes.
Old    Paul (psudy)      Join Date: Dec 2003       10-27-2010, 11:45 AM Reply   
Well, I don't have hill issues, just long boring straightaways with backed up traffic. I like to hammer it and be able to pass 3 or 4 cars at a time. The old Tahoe(5.3) sucked at this.
Old    Bruizza (bruizza)      Join Date: May 2009       10-27-2010, 12:05 PM Reply   
Bill you don't have those issues because you have the 4.10 gears in yours. I have the 3.42 gears and the 5.3 in my avy. When we were heading to Powell I had to tow over loveland pass in Colorado and I couldn't go faster than 45mph just like Evan is saying. I was around 10k ft in elevation. I am sure it wouldn't have been an issue if I had 4.10 gears. Or at least not as much of an issue.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       10-27-2010, 12:18 PM Reply   
I had 3:73's in mine. Maybe the 4:10's would be better. Maybe it keeps it from downshifting into second like mine did.
Old    Bruizza (bruizza)      Join Date: May 2009       10-27-2010, 1:20 PM Reply   
I also had my 24s on it at the time so I know that didn't help.
Old    Mikeski (mikeski)      Join Date: Aug 2003       10-27-2010, 5:35 PM Reply   
5.3L + lift + big tires = destroyed tow vehicle

I run a set of the new 20" stock wheels from a Denali on my old Silverado, same diameter tire so no gearing change and no change in towing capabilities. Like I have posted in many other threads. The Chevy 5.3 powered trucks are a decent balance between a dedicated tow vehicle and commuter. I can easily get 18 MPG with my 5.3L and it was a cheap truck to begin with, pretty tough truck to beat from a $/use standpoint.

I'll also say that my previous 4.3L powered Silverado (that's right, a V6) did a surprising job when tasked to tow my boat up to Shasta the weekend after my Tahoe burned up a fuel pump rendering it unavailable to tow my boat to my houseboat trip. Hills were absolutely brutal but it made it. Once or twice it dropped all the way down to 1st gear. I just said F'it and floored it, it already had a junkyard motor in the truck as the previous owner sold it to me for a pittance with a bad rod knock. The junkyard 4.3's are a dime a dozen, cost for a complete 4.3L delivered to my driveway was only $500 bucks. One weekend of time investment and the truck was as good as new.

My next tow vehicle purchase will probably have a 6.0 or 6.2L motor. At some point I may also go the train route if I get a 5th wheel RV, in that case it would certainly be a diesel rig.
Old    Ryan Bush (ryanbush11)      Join Date: May 2003       11-01-2010, 1:15 PM Reply   
Just traded my 07 Avalanche LTZ with 3.73s for a 2011 Avalanche LTZ with 3.42s.

Because of the 6spd vs 4spd the new one seems to make a little more power, nothing crazy but definatly gets better fuel mileage at 75-80mph, Love the new a/c seats but really wish i could have got the 6.2

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