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Old    KDA (idaho_hillbilly)      Join Date: Jun 2009       07-27-2010, 3:16 PM Reply   
My kids are dieing to learn to surf, any suggestions on a board? I currently have two boards, one is a big bertha 5'11" board with huge fins that we have adults start with because it's so stable. My board is a smaller board that is pretty squirmy (5'0"). My kids are too small to ride the big board and not experienced enough to use the smaller board.

One is 13 and the other is 11. Which board should I look for.....oh yeah, price is a factor.

Thanks!
Old    Matt Laird (Matt)      Join Date: Mar 2010       07-27-2010, 4:09 PM Reply   
I'm interested in the same thing.. My girl is only 7...
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       07-27-2010, 4:50 PM Reply   
I am working on it. We had the grom, and just can't get any more.
Old    Karl De Looff (boarditup)      Join Date: Jan 2004       07-27-2010, 4:58 PM Reply   
Depends on weight. I like the Phase 5 boards. I just put on the deep fin for the beginners and they have a ball. They can use a moderate sized Phase 5 so they can grow into it a bit. They are a bit pricier, but you won't have to buy another board once they get good. Just put on the longer, smaller fin and they are ready to go. If you are near MI, I'll give you a pull.
Old    Matt Laird (Matt)      Join Date: Mar 2010       07-27-2010, 5:16 PM Reply   
http://oklahomacity.craigslist.org/boa/1851184157.html

would this phase 5 be a good buy? Where would I get a deep fin?
Old    KDA (idaho_hillbilly)      Join Date: Jun 2009       07-27-2010, 6:58 PM Reply   
Karl...Thanks for the offer for the pull, but Idaho is kind of a long trip.

What should I look for in this board? Deep fins? Wide board? Length?
Old    jkw (lakesurfer)      Join Date: Jul 2009       07-27-2010, 7:45 PM Reply   
Phase 5 Scamp is great for kids under 100lbs
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       07-27-2010, 9:39 PM Reply   
If its a wakesurf board, about 4.0, not to wide, or they can't edge, and thruster setup (3 fin) has worked great for us. We have taught LOTS of kids.
Old    KDA (idaho_hillbilly)      Join Date: Jun 2009       07-28-2010, 12:42 AM Reply   
Ragboy...thanks for the information! Any suggestion on a specific board?

BTW.....love the videos! The one with that little girl surfing is what motivated my kids to get riding!
Old    Karl De Looff (boarditup)      Join Date: Jan 2004       07-28-2010, 8:16 AM Reply   
The Phase 5 Prop can be ridden by riders as light at 80 lbs. The Icon can go as low as 60. Your kids are likely to outgrow a Scamp too soon.

Michigan is a long trip, but I have a great setup (www.placidwaters.com)
Old    KDA (idaho_hillbilly)      Join Date: Jun 2009       07-28-2010, 8:53 AM Reply   
Both kids are at least 80 lbs (80lbs and 95lbs),.....at the rate my 11 year old is growing she is going to be 6'8" by the time school starts.

Karl...WOW! That looks amazing! Maybe I need to take the family on a cross country road trip!
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       07-28-2010, 9:25 AM Reply   
I haven't tried the scamp, and our family is a surf style family for the most part. I don't have any issue with the scamp, just haven't used it. We use a TWP grom, and working on another. In the prototype stage. I can't get more Groms from TWP right now, so don't have a specific board to recommend, unfortunately.
Old     (RedRocket)      Join Date: Aug 2010       08-16-2010, 4:34 PM Reply   
Just thought I would throw out this suggestion. I do not have experience with wake surfing, just been looking into it a lot as I may be moving to a land-locked location in a year and want to get a boat for wake surfing. What I can bring to the table now is many years of ocean surfing though.

I saw this thread and was curious if anyone has looked into what is referred to as black-ball beater boards? These boards are generally used in the ocean in areas where black-ball flags have been placed which means no hard surfboards. These black-ball beater boards are soft like a boogie board with slick skin on the bottom. They can also be ordered with fiberglass bottoms too. I recently bought one, the 4'8" Blackball Beater slick-skinned from INT, http://www.intsoftboards.com/, for my kids to learn to ocean surf on. I also thought it might be perfect for them once I get a boat and we start wake surfing.

My thoughts behind getting a soft board for them is that when I taught myself to surf 30 years ago, I constantly would get hit by the board/fins which led to numerous cuts. I do not want that to happen to my kids hence the reason for the purchase. I believe the price was around $280 with $30 for shipping which puts it in a reasonable range...considering how much some of the dedicated wake surfboards I am seeing...$600+

Another manufacturer is Catch Surf, http://surfermag.com/buyers-guide/su...rfboards-1.htm
Old    Ricardo (gunz)      Join Date: Sep 2001       08-16-2010, 5:02 PM Reply   
TWP Grom,Lakewakes Grom.

RedRocket-I do like that idea and love the price.
Old     (RedRocket)      Join Date: Aug 2010       08-16-2010, 5:56 PM Reply   
If you are curious, I bought it from this place:

http://kennedysurfco.com/cart/surf-s...-c-53_124.html

It is still listed at $278. That shop shipped it out quickly and no problems.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-16-2010, 6:48 PM Reply   
We did try a soft board, that Jeff walker found. It was SLOW. Had my kids ride it, it was cheap, but slow.

The TWP grom works good, but can't get anymore. The Lakewakes grom IMHO is not ready yet. The first prototype we tested at the polar bear event, and this spring, it was slow, both maddie and thomas struggled with it. The latest we have seen was faster, but it pearled very easy, again, maddie and thomas really struggled. I know mark is working hard on it. We definitely are looking for a good kids board, that kids can learn, and then start to rip on. Just haven't found one. We get asked ALL the time. The TWP grom works, but like I said, can't get em.
Old    Jeff Walker (surfdad)      Join Date: Sep 2004       08-16-2010, 7:13 PM Reply   
Yeah I remember that board. $129 delivered to your house. Would NOT work for anyone over 100 pounds though. Thread from last year.

Judy, who is 4'10.5" and weighs around 100 pounds. It was a blast TRYING to make it work though. I think any of the grom ocean boards will have too much rocker.
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Old    Lakewakes Wakesurf Boards (brewkettle)      Join Date: Jan 2009       08-16-2010, 7:19 PM Reply   
If this one works then i will send it after labor day to Robert to test
Old     (RedRocket)      Join Date: Aug 2010       08-16-2010, 7:31 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ragboy View Post
We did try a soft board, that Jeff walker found. It was SLOW. Had my kids ride it, it was cheap, but slow.

The TWP grom works good, but can't get anymore. The Lakewakes grom IMHO is not ready yet. The first prototype we tested at the polar bear event, and this spring, it was slow, both maddie and thomas struggled with it. The latest we have seen was faster, but it pearled very easy, again, maddie and thomas really struggled. I know mark is working hard on it. We definitely are looking for a good kids board, that kids can learn, and then start to rip on. Just haven't found one. We get asked ALL the time. The TWP grom works, but like I said, can't get em.
So then, question for you. Do you remember which softtop board you tried? If not, do you remember then general dimensions or at least length? Keep in mind, the softtops I listed also are made with glassed bottoms which would be vastly different than one with a slick skin bottom so it should lend to a faster, stiffer board. As well, pro-surfers are starting to use these boards and finding out the boards are quite capable. There are some legacy softtop board manufacturers that have horrible designs. These new companies are changing softtops for the better.

Also, do ocean surf boards generally behave slower than purpose built wake surf boards on wake surf? Or does it usually come down to the board's shape and dimensions?
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-16-2010, 7:35 PM Reply   
Y, thats the one, I didn't remember it being that cheap, but I remember now. Thomas and maddie could ride it, but it was very slow for them.

It definitely was unique. Sure would be cool for kids to get a board under $200 to learn on, maybe unrealistic, but cool.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-16-2010, 7:36 PM Reply   
@redrocket, see Jeff's post above. That is the board in the pic, and he points to the thread.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-16-2010, 7:42 PM Reply   
@brewkettle, can't wait to try! So many people asking for one.
Old     (RedRocket)      Join Date: Aug 2010       08-16-2010, 7:54 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by ragboy View Post
@redrocket, see Jeff's post above. That is the board in the pic, and he points to the thread.
Yes but one softtop board does not = all softtops....hence my question about the differences on a wake between an ocean board and purpose built wake surf board. I am actually surprised at the board I bought for my kids. A little too small for me, but for a kid, perfect. But again, it may not work on a wake, I just do not know but am willing to try.

I am not trying to be an ***, just have questions.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-16-2010, 8:28 PM Reply   
no, that makes sense. That is the only experience with a soft top that I have for kids, so I offered it, someone may have more info.
Old    Jeff Walker (surfdad)      Join Date: Sep 2004       08-17-2010, 10:41 AM Reply   
I saw some of the INT softboards at Surf Expo a few years ago, this was before the change to the fiberglass bottoms when all of the softops were still using "slick" bottoms like boogyboards. Going from memory here, that INT black ball beater still had a ton of tail rocker and they aren't small boards - 4'11 and 20+ inches wide almost the full length, that is a lot of foam. The rocker, like in the board we had, I'd guess would make them slow behind the boat, but with that much wetted surface area, especially up front, I'd estimate would also mitigate that somewhat. Might prove to be a perfect combination for the groms.

I hate generalities, because there is ALWAYS an exception, but behind the boat we don't paddle in, paddle out or drop in so we don't need the same volume, length or pronounced rockers. We also don't have the same "ooomph" behind our wakes and things like a 4 inch nose rocker tend to create huge plows behind the boat. In the crappy little softtop that we got, it had a length of 4'2" and I think the width was something crazy like 16 inches It sank really well It also had a ton of rocker. In the picture of Judy you can see her riding basically in the middle of the board - nose and tail both out of the water. That's what I've always been struck with for boards specifically designed for the ocean. More volume than we need, The One is like 2.25" thick, more rocker than we need (read PLOWing effect) and in shortboards a tail that tends to be too narrow compared to performance wakesurfers.

If you get the chance to take it behind a boat, it would be great to have some direct feedback on it, especially with the kids.

Last edited by surfdad; 08-17-2010 at 10:43 AM.
Old    Trevor Gleadhill (trevorg7)      Join Date: Mar 2008       08-17-2010, 11:03 AM Reply   
I converted an old (early model) wakeboard. Took of the binding and added deck pad.

My boy who is 11 yrs and 65# could not flip up any boards I owned and this works perfect! Very stable with a big single fin.

T
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Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-17-2010, 11:28 AM Reply   
LOL, thats pretty cool. And he's goofy too, kid after my own heart. ;-)
Old     (bigcatpt)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-17-2010, 5:54 PM Reply   
I did exactly what Trevor did and it is now the go to board for teaching anyone under 135 lbs. They can sink it easy and with the 3 fins it is very stable and amazingly fast. I just pulled the bindings off an old skurfer and added surf traction. Even my 5 and 7 year old kids are learning on it.
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Old     (RedRocket)      Join Date: Aug 2010       08-17-2010, 7:31 PM Reply   
@ Jeff Walker (surfdad)

Thank you for the information. I would be happy to provide a response to this thread, maybe even some video, when I can get a chance to have kids try out the board on a wake. I am also curious of the rocker and will take a look at it when I get home Friday. May be a little while for a review though as a friend is in process of selling his older Ski Nautique for a dedicated wake surf board so I will need to wait until that process is completed.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-17-2010, 7:40 PM Reply   
If you need kids to try it out, I have the whole range, 6 kids, 5 at home 18 down to 5. If you want us to try anything we will take it out and take lots of pics and video and give honest feedback. We won't post any of it unless you wanted us to. But the kids love to test stuff and do it all the time.
Old     (RedRocket)      Join Date: Aug 2010       08-18-2010, 8:35 AM Reply   
^^ you must be one BUSY person. I can see how wake surfing could be a great family sport with lots of time spent together!

Thanks for the offer...only problem is that it would require me (my kids actually) to not have access to the board for probably at least a couple of weeks. My kids would be :unamused: since they use it in the ocean. Even as I was leaving for the airport yesterday, my son hit me up to go surfing but I had to remind him I was headed out for work.

I live on the north coast of Oregon, so if someone wanted to try it locally, where I could get it back the same day, I would be happy to hook up with them, Unfortunately weekends are best for me for something like this. Portland area and possibly Seattle area if time permits.

Last edited by RedRocket; 08-18-2010 at 8:37 AM.
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-18-2010, 9:52 AM Reply   
no problem. Getting choices in kids wakesurfers is very important to me, so don't hesitate to ask. Yeah, I am busy, but busy doing stuff that I love. I will sleep when I am dead. ;-)
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-18-2010, 9:53 AM Reply   
@trevor cool pics, and that is a pretty nice looking wake you got there.
Old    Trevor Gleadhill (trevorg7)      Join Date: Mar 2008       08-18-2010, 3:21 PM Reply   
@ragboy, thank you.

Only my kids ride goofy...hmm wait, maybe they are not my kids LOL. When they do, as in this pic, it is 750# in the locker, 250# center and people (500#) in my 07 Avy. It doesn't take much for these little guys...unlike me at 225!

T
Old    Robert Garcia (ragboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       08-19-2010, 2:25 AM Reply   
@trevor, its funny, even my adopted kids are goofy, I am the ONLY regular one in my family. Love those pics, especially of you in the water helping, I know the feeling. Keep that family surfing man. It doesn't get any better than that. People say you can't buy happiness, but you can buy memories, and they last a lifetime, or longer.
Old    Trevor Gleadhill (trevorg7)      Join Date: Mar 2008       08-19-2010, 7:30 AM Reply   
Thanks again. For the record, Some of those pics are of Bigcatpt; specifically the one where he is in the water helping. But again thanks and you are right...great way to keep the family together build good memories.

T

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