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Old    Rene Rioux (rene)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-09-2010, 11:49 AM Reply   
I almost ran my friend over once because I couldn't find the brake pedal in my X-Star.

I should have sued Mastercraft.
Old    Jesse Mitchell (jessemitchell)      Join Date: Feb 2009       04-09-2010, 11:58 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by rene View Post
I almost ran my friend over once because I couldn't find the brake pedal in my X-Star.

I should have sued Mastercraft.
lol there is no brake pedal, you should not be driving boats sir

good luck
Old    Kat Laird (wakekat15)      Join Date: Jul 2005       04-09-2010, 12:25 PM Reply   
For those not familiar with Lake Austin, the hydrilla is so thick in places that it will stop you while underway. It's not a lot of fun to swim under the boat to remove these acquatic weeds. It could be very challenging to navigate much of this particular lake with a guard installed. I can already see the next lawsuit against the prop guard manufacturer for the person that drowned while trying to remove the hydrilla from the backside of the guard.

Here's an interesting perspective....I have a man that works for me that lost his leg in a boating accident 20 years ago. It surprised me when he came in to my office this morning extremely upset about the verdict in this case.
Old    Matt (MattieK27)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-09-2010, 12:58 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by PGIC View Post
What if it actually cost less and did not impact the wake? Many are not aware several propeller safety devices beyond conventional guards have came on the scene in recent years. One very recent one, the Australian Environmental Safety Propeller, won ABC TV Australia's invention of the year contest in late 2009. It is a conventional propeller with slightly blunted edges and is said to provide similar performance and protection in both forward and reverse. If you have not yet seen videos of people sticking their hands and feet into one of them rotating, see our coverage at:
http://rbbi.com/pgic/ptech/safetypro...ypropeller.htm

The inventors recently showed it at a U.S. Coast Guard Propeller Accident Mitigation Meeting at the Miami International Boat Show.

The cost of this aftermarket propeller may actually be less than similar OEM propellers when it hits the market.

Some small companies, most notably MariTech Industries, have developed several propeller safety products using sensors that do not involve the use of a guard.
http://www.powerboatsafety.com

In addition, new versions of conventional guards with swing up rear screens (the drag from the prop wash pushes them out and up where they ride parallel to water flow when underway, then their weight makes them fall back down when the boat comes to rest) are coming to light. This significantly decreases drag. We have been promoting swing up guards since 2006 and notice one of them was used in the Brochtrup trial as an example of a means of guarding the propeller. The image below is from MyFox Austin coverage of the trial. It shows the guard end cap flipped up like it would be when underway. If falls back down when the boat slows.



Gary
Propeller Guard Information Center
Based on the signature, I'm going to say you might have some bias...

Guards will always reduce performance and shorten stern drive life, especially the hydrualic rams.

That prop does a great job at lower rpms, but at higher rpms it will still cause injury. The rounded edges prevent slicing, but they do nothing to lessen the force of the impact. (Simple math based on the rotation speed and the blade length, if there is no difference the force exerted during impact will be the same; it might not slice someone up but it will break limbs and cause large amounts of internal damage)

I still think we should hold people liable to reading the mandated placards at the transom of all I/O boats, and not throw the manufacturer under the bus for the result of poor human judgement. Just because a safety device exists, it is not the manufacturers responsibility to use it. Air bags were invented in the 70's, and it was not until the government stepped in during the 90's that auto makers made them standard equipment.

So should the government step in and mandate guards on props? Whats next, seat belts and air bags on boats? A "brake pedal" so people that have no clue how to drive a boat and have no business operating one know how to bring it to a stop? Its a slippery slope, and to me this case is a joke. Unless that boat jumped into reverse by itself, Sea Ray should not be held liable.
Old    Tom Southern (Showmethebutter)      Join Date: Mar 2010       04-09-2010, 1:01 PM Reply   
Jesse, really?

You cant be for real!
Old    Gary Polson (PGIC)      Join Date: Apr 2010       04-11-2010, 3:43 PM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattieK27 View Post
Guards will always reduce performance and shorten stern drive life, especially the hydrualic rams.

So should the government step in and mandate guards on props?
The point I was trying to make in my previous post was there are now an array of tools and propeller safety devices in addition to traditional propeller guards. There are also several types of boats and drives some of which modify propeller risks in certain situations (read water jets, pump jets, and inboard "ski" boats). Some of these tools/devices/approaches are more adaptable to certain situations/uses than others. Plus new devices continue to come on the scene.

Propeller Accident Risk Reduction Activities that can be undertaken by boaters tend to fall into one of five categories:

1. Propeller Injury Avoidance Devices (Conventional propeller guards are just one of many sub-categories of Propeller Injury Avoidance Devices).

2. Educational & Training (Such as taking a Boating Safety Course)

3. Behavioral Modifications (Eliminating your risky behaviors, for example: stop drinking and operating your boat, stay out of super wild boat party coves, operate the boat in a responsible manner, don't be jumping wakes on a PWC right behind a boat, stopping risky behaviors by others on your boat, etc.) Sometimes these types of behavioral changes are made as a result of heightened law enforcement presence (lots of smokeys on the water) or as a result of a recent high profile accident, like the one in the trial.

4. Alternative Propulsion Systems (move to a boat powered by water jets, pump jets, inboard drives, etc. as appropriate for the boating activities you participate in)

5. Warnings (decals, warnings in manuals, etc.) These are typically installed by the manufacturer. Boaters can make sure they are in place and make sure those coming on board are aware of them.

We are not saying everybody should do all of these, we are just saying people should evaluate their situation and take appropriate actions to protect themselves and those around them. We have been working on a tool to help boaters evaluate their situation, and identify which changes would best help them reduce their risk of propeller injuries based on their particular circumstances. We hope to complete it later this year..

Gary
Propeller Guard Information Center
Old    Jay Conrad (pwningjr)      Join Date: Apr 2007       04-11-2010, 7:35 PM Reply   
Introducing the new Mastercraft [government mandated] X-Jet! Because we're not allowed to make anything else anymore!

Sarcasm aside, I feel bad for the guy, but it's not Sea Ray's fault that the driver wasn't aware of what was going on around him. Plain and simple. I just hope it doesn't mean one more sticker to *take off*. (I hate those dang safety stickers. They're so ugly. Understanding that boating is inherently dangerous + explaining what you know to people who don't know this BEFORE they come on board + common sense + being aware of your environment = safe boating)
Old    Rich (dohboy)      Join Date: Aug 2007       04-11-2010, 8:10 PM Reply   
This is the stupid verdicts that hurt us all. People not taking personal responsibility for their actions. Then jurors that somehow hold a company that manufactures something that is safe for 99.99% of the users. This stuff drives me crazy- People hurt that want money or the lawyers that convince them to sue so the law firms make money.
Old    Jeremy (wake77)      Join Date: Jan 2009       04-11-2010, 8:18 PM Reply   
I think Jesse was being sarcastic.
Old    Rene Rioux (rene)      Join Date: Aug 2004       04-13-2010, 11:18 AM Reply   
Quote:
Originally Posted by dohboy View Post
This is the stupid verdicts that hurt us all. People not taking personal responsibility for their actions. Then jurors that somehow hold a company that manufactures something that is safe for 99.99% of the users. This stuff drives me crazy- People hurt that want money or the lawyers that convince them to sue so the law firms make money.
I concur! People not taking personal responsibility for their actions is lame.


Jesse, What do you mean there aren't brake pedals? My X-Star has one. It's right in between the gas pedal and the clutch pedal.
Old    C.I.E. J-Rod (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       04-13-2010, 1:55 PM Reply   
Rene! Whats up bro!?

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