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Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       02-01-2010, 12:31 PM Reply   
OMG.... Jimmy Zarin must be soooo pissed right now. His world is destroyed.

Ha, ha, ha.

All automakers have problems. Sometimes their stigma lasts a long time. Others not so long. Off the top of my head I can think of Audi's un-inteded acceleration (which was never truly proven) and Ford's 6.0 diesel motor. They all produce lots of vehicles. It's truly amazing that they're as trouble free as they are. We're all spoiled these days. You want to see some junk sent to market, look at our wakeboats.

Just to get it straight.... The Toyota thing has nothing to do with floor mats (though I'm amazed by the number of customer cars I get into with floormats jammed around the accelerator). They have a faulty throttle potentiometer in the throttle pedal assembly (FWIW, I'm working on a BMW right now with a faulty potentiometer also, but BMW in their engineering genious built a second potentiometer into the assembly as a back-up. If the numbers deviate it defaults to idle.. hmmm, nice). The pedals have a water intrusion problem.

On the topic of Unions. It's absurd what it costs to hire a Union employee. The days of Unions being necessary are over. Pay the employee more, eliminate the union dues. Allow them to carry 401k's or another retirement plan like the rest of the country. My step dad has a Union metal working shop. His $60k/yr employees cost him $90-$100k/yr after dues. They alway bitched because they didn't make enough money. He used to tell them to talk to their Union.
Old    Tallredrider (talltigeguy)      Join Date: Sep 2003       02-01-2010, 4:39 PM Reply   
'You want to see some junk sent to market, look at our wakeboats.'

ROTFLMAO! No doubt. With the thousands and thousands of cars out there, they almost all run without a hitch, but yet there are only a few boats that don't have problems. We think 300 hours would be a long time to go without a problem on a wakeboat. If that were a car going 50 MPH, it would be 15,000 miles. A car that breaks at less than 15,000 miles would be a lemon to most of us.
Old    Jim Zarin (jimmy_z)      Join Date: Jun 2009       02-01-2010, 9:18 PM Reply   
Not sure why my world would be destroyed from a Toyota recall???

Evan, for your future reference, ALL vehicles with a drive by wire throttle assy have two potentiometers in the accelerator pedal. You must be new to the technology. Its been around for a while now. Both sensor circuits on the accelerator pedal ALSO have their own vref, signal, and ground circuits. This is UNIVERSAL for all vehicles with this system.

Also try to get your facts straight.
Toyota has a problem with the pedal assy ITSELF sticking. Has nothing to do with the sensors. There has been no reported cases of death from a sticking pedal. NHTSA confirmed that five reported deaths were from floor mat entrapment.

(Message edited by jimmy_z on February 01, 2010)
Old    Peter_C (peter_c)      Join Date: Sep 2001       02-01-2010, 9:39 PM Reply   
This will be a huge blow to California's Bay Area in less than a couple of months.

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/08/27/breaking-toyota-reportedly-pulls-plug-on-nummi-plant/

"Toyota Motor Corp. has reportedly announced that it will end production at Fremont, California's New United Motor Manufacturing Inc., better known as NUMMI." "Toyota's board has voted to shutter the plant effective March 2010"

Another blow to the already hurting California economy. The guy I bought my Nautique from ran the trucking company that supplied the steel to Toyota. His father owned the steel company. I don't feel sorry for them as they made enough money, but the point is I know people it is effecting. Imagine the workers, and all of the local businesses that were supported by Toyota sales. The local deli's etc. are going to go out of business.
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       02-02-2010, 9:24 AM Reply   
Ironic that "floor mat entrapment" deaths were reported within a week of Toyota recalling sticking throttle pedals. Which problem caused the accident we'll never really know, will we?

Pedal assemblies themselves are sticking due to water intrusion. Not Toyota's problem really, as they didn't build the assemblies, but since they spec'd them it became their problem.

Jimmy,OK, you got me on the dual potentiometers. I should have gotten my facts straight before I spoke. I'm not new to the system. BMW was probably one of the first drive by wire cars. The system has been in production since the dual EML 750i's in the early 90's. I evidently gave up the fact that I don't work on japanese cars. I was purely amused since you spend soo much time bashing german vehicles, but didn't have much to say here. They've all got problems. Even the mighty Toyota.
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-02-2010, 11:26 AM Reply   
GM/F sales up in Jan, Toyota down:

the link is too long.... search it if you're interested. it's here:
http://finance.yahoo.com/




(Message edited by denverd1 on February 02, 2010)
Old    Jim Zarin (jimmy_z)      Join Date: Jun 2009       02-02-2010, 2:09 PM Reply   
"They've all got problems. Even the mighty Toyota."

Very true.

As for not having much to say, there really isnt much to say. The media has caused a frenzy and the problem really isnt that big of a deal.

It really points to the human characteristic that we like to "slay the giant" that has made this bigger than it really is.

If your throttle stuck im sure many of you would instinctively apply the brake. Your vehicle will come to a stop even at WOT. Even better to put it in neutral and apply the brakes to shorten your stopping distance.(some vehicles with push-button start make the task of turning the ignition key off slightly more of a challenge.)

The media makes it seem like its going to take off like a rocket at any moment and obliterate anything in its path. When in fact to get the pedal to stick you already pressed the accelerator down, its not like it just goes to WOT by itself.

I dont work for Toyota nor do I own one of their vehicles. Im sure they will be affected short term but this recall will have little impact(if any) in the long run. There is no denying that they make exceptional vehicles.
Old    Martin (hehateme)      Join Date: Sep 2008       02-02-2010, 6:01 PM Reply   
Floor mat entrapment is still a recall. No one said it wasnt floormat entrapment. The floor mat entrapment killed the off duty officer in a LEXUS. Lexus is not a part of the sticky pedal recall. This is a government scheme to slow down toyota and help governemnt motors. Remember, dont be so quick to dog Japanese built. The ONLY vehicles in this recall were NORTH AMERICAN BUILT ONLY. All Japanese built vehicles are straight, and available for sale.

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/driveon/post/2010/01/payback-time-are-obama-and-rust-belt-democrats-taking-downtoyota/1
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-02-2010, 8:23 PM Reply   
Toyota South Africa is affected

http://www.timeslive.co.za/business/article288998.ece

As far as "This is a government scheme to slow down toyota"

EXCELLENT! Japan kicked out GM and Ford back when they funded the startup of Toyota...and they've been funding them ever since, So I say screw them. It is time we are forced to support our US car makers(like your beloved Toyota is from their country).

(or would you rather we just kick out Toyota like they did to us?)




"If your throttle stuck im sure many of you would instinctively apply the brake. Your vehicle will come to a stop even at WOT."

I wouldn't be too sure of that.

http://www.lajollalight.com/news/261796-report--indicates-possible-throttle-problem-on-lexustoyota-cars

The officers brakes were on fire. Besides, what if you were coasting to a stop and some kids were in an intersection coming home from school with a crossing guard in the street and you plow through them. I guess you could just turbo boost over them?

Don't try to down play this. Toyota should and will suffer for this. Their halo has forever disappeared.
Old    Mattt (motorcitymatt)      Join Date: Feb 2007       02-04-2010, 2:19 PM Reply   
Damm the mighty "toy' on the verge of yet another recall! This time a software problem with the breaks... Not an easy or cheap fix.

Stock down twenty bucks this week

Market share drop. Up to four percent, some experts are saying.

I think when this is all said and done toyota will return to its number four spot in production.

Welcome back "Big Three"
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-04-2010, 2:34 PM Reply   

quote:

I think when this is all said and done toyota will return to its number four spot in production.




Maybe, maybe not. I think Toyota will resume building a better mousetrap. After all, it's a third party company they're getting the pedals from. quality control should improve as well.

You mean sales are down 4%. Market share doesn't move that drastically in a month.
Old    Mattt (motorcitymatt)      Join Date: Feb 2007       02-04-2010, 3:31 PM Reply   
^^^I meant to say market share is next... My bad :-)^^^

Generally speaking each percent of market share equals one assembly plant. If toyota loses 4-5% I wonder which assembly plants it will close? US plants or the one's in their back yard??
Old    Andrew Taft (taft)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-04-2010, 6:24 PM Reply   
Here's an article that puts things into perspective.

Forbes link 1

In regards to the recalls Toyota has made:
"So far, [it's] the sixth-biggest recall in U.S. history"

The biggest recalls in history have been made by Ford and GM, at 7.9 and 6.7 million cars respectively.

Here's another link, that visually shows you the 10 biggest recalls in US history.

Forbes link 2

In case you don't want to take a look, a quick summary of the 10 biggest recall manufacturers:
1. Ford
2. GM
3. GM
4. Ford
5. Ford
6. Toyota
7. Ford
8. GM
9. Volkswagen
10. Honda

(Message edited by taft on February 04, 2010)
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 8:28 AM Reply   
Talked to a guy at the tire shop today. His Tundra has 168000 miles on it. Nothing done to it other than regular maintenance.
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-05-2010, 11:09 AM Reply   
OK. So does my wife's Dodge minivan.

Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 11:20 AM Reply   
lol. yea right
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-05-2010, 11:36 AM Reply   
Ok - So you believe a "guy at the tire shop". That is about the funniest thing I've read in a while.


Believe what you want.
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 11:42 AM Reply   
Prove it. Go snap a pic of said minivan. And get one of the dash showing the mileage!
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-05-2010, 11:44 AM Reply   
U first
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 11:49 AM Reply   
wally L7. what an appropriate email address...

Well I happen to know the tire shop pretty well. Maybe they'll let me sneak a peak of his order sheet...

You better find you a beater ass minivan to snap one of!!!
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-05-2010, 11:59 AM Reply   
HAHA. Get a life, man. You are really reaching here.

And I certainly don't have anything to prove to you, Nacho
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 12:04 PM Reply   
Backpeddling are we!! you're a joke
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-05-2010, 12:15 PM Reply   
I love how you will post hearsay without any proof then demand proof from opposing views.

Keeps it fun, though. Thanks.
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 12:16 PM Reply   
Put your money where your mouth is. It's that easy.
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-05-2010, 12:22 PM Reply   
Seriously?!!

This is YOUR claim to prove. I was just pointing out that it wasn't that big of a deal.

Why do you feel your claims can go unanswered, but others have to prove them to you?

Perhaps a bit sensitive over this whole thing with Toyota?
Old                02-05-2010, 12:28 PM Reply   
How the heck do you drive a toyota and live in Palestine, TX.

It has to be rough driving a Jap car in small town east tx?
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 12:35 PM Reply   
You said it was BS. I'm saying I can back it up.

You're obviously completely full of shat!
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 12:38 PM Reply   
Murphy, seriously?? I just drive the Toyota when my horse isn't feeling up for a ride.
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 12:41 PM Reply   
talk about reaching!!!!
Old                02-05-2010, 1:06 PM Reply   
I was joking, you are wound a little to tight for a Friday.
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-05-2010, 1:13 PM Reply   
lol!!!
Old    TRDon (trdon)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-05-2010, 2:19 PM Reply   
I just dumped off my 03 tundra. i had 95K on it and replaced one O2 sensor. I must be completely full of shat!

I just bought a dodge ram because I thought I better be patriotic and support the american car maker that I now own because they cant make a vehicle anyone wants to buy. I dont want people to hate on what I drive to I bowed to peer pressure.

Gimme a break. I live in a country where I get to choose what I want and not be pushed into something I dont want. Nothing would be more unpatriotic than not being able to own what I really want because it isnt PC.

Seriously though, I just traded my tundra for a 2010 ram. I drove them all this week and ratings are about the same for reliability, so I bought which one I liked. I went to toyota first because of how good mine treated me. To bad they were too ugly for me to want to own for another 7 years.

I thought the hate comment about driving a toyota in TX was especilially hilarious considering Toyota has a plant building the drivelines for the tundra and sequoia there.
Old    Tim C (lifetimewarranty)      Join Date: Oct 2008       02-05-2010, 2:35 PM Reply   
You got a picture of that O2 sensor?
Old    TRDon (trdon)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-05-2010, 3:21 PM Reply   
I think I just threw it away. I can dig it out if you like
Old                02-05-2010, 9:29 PM Reply   
Let it go guys, let it go..
Old    Andy (michridr69)      Join Date: Dec 2008       02-06-2010, 9:14 AM Reply   
people are so dumb. Hey guys, how was the economy before toyota and honda took over sales in the U.S? O wait, perfect. And Andrew Taft, you're a tool, how many recalls from american car companies killed the people who drive them for no reason, just driving straight and then boom your 10 feet in a tree dead.
Old    Jim Zarin (jimmy_z)      Join Date: Jun 2009       02-06-2010, 10:04 AM Reply   
"how many recalls from american car companies killed the people who drive them for no reason"

Probably more than you would care to believe, Andy.

Why dont you ask Dolly Mohlis this question?

She cant answer you because she was killed when her Ford cruise control switch caught fire and burned her house down. She was unable to escape.

The only dumb people here are the uninformed. NHTSA has confirmed ONLY 5 deaths from Toyota and the were ALL investigated and proven to be from floor mat entrapment.

"just driving straight and then boom your 10 feet in a tree dead."

Statements like this prove you dont have a clue about the failure/sticking of the accelerator pedal.
Old    Sparky Jay (wake_upppp)      Join Date: Nov 2003       02-06-2010, 11:16 AM Reply   
Now Prius issues. And some manufacturers offering a grand extra incentive on Toyota trade-ins. Classic. Oh by the way I own a 1990 Dodge Dakota with 260k, still going strong, nothing done exept routine stuff. Even still has the original clutch! I'll walk on bloody kness before I'll ever drive an import!
Old    Andy (michridr69)      Join Date: Dec 2008       02-06-2010, 10:33 PM Reply   
Hey jim, the lady that just died recently had her floormates in the trunk, so get your facts right guy, it was a cover up. And o ya her car was 10 feet in a tree. Dumb ass

(Message edited by michridr69 on February 06, 2010)
Old    Sparky Jay (wake_upppp)      Join Date: Nov 2003       02-07-2010, 10:01 AM Reply   
...the news just was saying 20 deaths related now?? Wow
Old                02-07-2010, 10:55 AM Reply   
Just let the news and lawsuits unfold. We have barely scratched the surface on how many accidents, injuries and deaths have been caused by the acclerator sticking.

It is not going to be pretty.
Old    Jim Zarin (jimmy_z)      Join Date: Jun 2009       02-07-2010, 9:00 PM Reply   
"the lady that just died recently had her floormates in the trunk, so get your facts right guy, it was a cover up."

Care to show the NHTSA report for that?

If we are talking about the incident involving Guadalupe Alberto it was determined to be driver error. There was no evidence of the brake switch ever being depressed when investigating ecm data.

Unfortunately you are out of the loop Andy.

All you can rely on is inaccurate media reports.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       02-07-2010, 9:17 PM Reply   
Fact, there is no Toyota ever made that is capable of overpowering the brakes with a stuck accelerator. It might slow down the braking distance but being up in a tree is, at best, only partly related.
It seems to me that a smart guy would go out and buy a used Toyota in the next year. The recall will be fixed and the resale hit will be on the seller. I suspect that the resale value will go back up fairly quickly.

I had no problems with the Edsel Ranger I had, and yet it has a bad reputation. I bought it used as a beater in high school. I loved my Audi 5000 Quattro that I bought just after the "sudden acceleration" had come up. Best stock brakes of any sedan I ever drove. Cars are mechanical, like boats, and issues come up.
Old    Dave (daveronix199)      Join Date: Feb 2009       02-08-2010, 7:16 AM Reply   
This is all you need to see to understand how bad toyota trucks are .....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HoC-n9i9E0
Old    Andy (michridr69)      Join Date: Dec 2008       02-08-2010, 7:18 AM Reply   
JIM...................... WOWNHTSA THIS.. http://www.wvmetronews.com/index.cfm?func=displayfullstory&storyid=35079 NHTSA THIS..
Old    Andy (michridr69)      Join Date: Dec 2008       02-08-2010, 7:20 AM Reply   
paragraph 4 and 5, WEIRD, this isn't even the right death, and still didnt have her floor mats in her car.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-08-2010, 7:34 AM Reply   
reguardless of if the problem is all toyota, or it is a combo of floor mats/toyota/bad drivers it still is impressive to me toyota is doing something....

remember the ford triton engine block fiasco?? Ford never did a thing, which I heard was because if they would have it would have bankrupted them... long before bailouts were an option.

Do similar lexuses have the same problems?
Old    Kraig Kaiser (kraig)      Join Date: Dec 2002       02-08-2010, 10:37 AM Reply   
Come on Dave, a video made by Ford? That's your proof to show that Toyota trucks are bad? Really? Are you THAT naieve? I can respect your opinion if you think Ford is better and to hear about your experiences but to actually think that that video is not biased amazes me. Find me something that is NOT biased and I'll look at it.

I drive a 2001 Toyota Tundra for work. It just rolled 292,000 miles on it! ALL original. I use it for work so let's just say it get's 'used.' I used to pull Case skidsteers with it quite often. I have overloaded it more than I can count. I have had three things go out on it. 1. Rear axle seal due to me overloading it too much. My fault on that one. 2. Had to replace the emergency brake cable, it snapped. Why? Because I drive it every day to multiple job sites and everytime I get out I push the E-brake. That much use wore the cable. And 3. New fuel pump at 275,000 miles. That's it!!

The truck still drives great, almost like the day we got it. And to add, we bought two of these trucks and the other one just rolled 270,000 miles. The only thing that has been done to it is a rear axle seal due to it being overloaded too much. Pulling Case skidsteers and all. We have somewhat abused these trucks and they keep going.

Also, I used to own a 1997 Tacoma. I put 100,000 miles on it without one problem. It NEVER saw the dealership in the 9 years I owned it. NOT ONE problem or issue!!! Ok, there's three trucks that I would say have exceeded expectations.

At work we have a 1996 F-350. Biggest pile of crap I have ever dealt with. POS to the core. We keep wanting to bury it somewhere.

Just my experiences...... I'll stay with Toyota. And like someone above said concerning the sticking gas pedal "If you don't know how to take a vehicle out of drive then you have no business driving." I concur!

Has everyone forgotten about the Ford trucks/SUV's that would randomly start fire? And sometimes while the vehicle was in a garage causing the house to burn down? The list of recalls by the Big 3 is enormous! The recalls by Japanese auto makers pales in comparison. I always remembered looking at Auto magazines where in the back they would list all the recalls by all the manufacturers. And I would see pages and pages and pages of recalls by the Big 3 and then there would be a tiny section for ALL the Japanese automakers. That always stuck in my mind....
Old    David (colombiansurfer)      Join Date: Sep 2008       02-08-2010, 10:53 AM Reply   
WOW, all the more reason for me to stick with the MB GL 350. A little more $, but at least it is safe. But my second choice was the F-250. Gas mileage did it for me.
Old    Alan Slabaugh (alans)      Join Date: Aug 2005       02-08-2010, 12:16 PM Reply   
Listening to NPR this morning. Chances of being struck by lighting are 60 times greater than getting one of the sticky accelerator pedals in a Toyota.
Old    Nacho (denverd1)      Join Date: May 2004       02-08-2010, 12:19 PM Reply   
Anyone see the commercial after the super bowl? I thought it pretty much summed up the whole recall situation.
Old    Tallredrider (talltigeguy)      Join Date: Sep 2003       02-08-2010, 12:23 PM Reply   
Alan,

But now every doofus who rear ended someone else in the last 3 years is going to hire a lawyer to rewrite the story that the accelerator was stuck and it was Toyota's fault. We will never know for sure how many really stuck in a few years.

I am sure that a lot of lawyers are drooling about this. Sad, but true.
Old    Cody (loudontn)      Join Date: Feb 2005       02-18-2010, 11:16 AM Reply   
also, the best show on television did their own thorough test on how well built the Toyota's are:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kmfx2uNzss

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lEK0s3IOgQE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMVBcfdXdEw

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