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Old     (kimper)      Join Date: May 2008       06-22-2009, 7:03 AM Reply   
I want to retire my 19ft I/O and get a wakeboard boat and want some opinions!

Few requirements/considerations:
I can't really go over 21 feet, my boat slip at lake house is only 23 feet long.
I am basically an advanced beginner boarder looking to improve.
I would like a good wakeboard wake with factory setup/ballast, I really don't want to fool with weighting the boat. We may surf at some point so a good factory ready surf wake would be awesome if this exists..

Boats at the top of my list are:
1. Malibu VLX
2. Tige Z1
3. Super Air Nautique 210

Other brands I like, but know less about are: Sanger, Supra, Moomba

I don't really care for Mastercraft and I am not even sure why.. they seem sorta overpriced and blingy, but I would entertain any arguments for them.

Thanks for the help/opinions!
Old     (ericdizzzle)      Join Date: May 2009       06-22-2009, 7:10 AM Reply   
is money a factor? if it isn't, I'd say go with any three there
Old     (loudontn)      Join Date: Feb 2005       06-22-2009, 7:18 AM Reply   
Supra 24SSV Gravity Games (as long as you have the tow vehicle for it)

Tige RZ2 is a solid boat too, not huge on the interior, but one of the best driving boats I've drove.

I'm not a big fan of the new 210 Nautique, I think the seating is overly complicated. VLX is definitely a great choice.
Old     (kimper)      Join Date: May 2008       06-22-2009, 7:18 AM Reply   
Money is a consideration, but not a limitation really. I likely will get a slightly used (08, 09) model just to ease the new initial depreciation hit if I can find one I like..
Old     (jackeh)      Join Date: May 2008       06-22-2009, 7:57 AM Reply   
X-Star no question.
Old    star_star            06-22-2009, 8:17 AM Reply   
i have owned two current-style xstars and haven't found a wake yet that is as consistent and beefy. everybody who rides on our boat loves it. i haven't ridden on a malibu but have been behind a 22' and 24' tige. i have also ridden behind a 210 team edition and an older-style xstar. also an x30. all of them are good wake boats and they all need significant ballast to get a sizeable wake. my xstar has a decent wake with just factory ballast. i am not a good enough rider to fill the fly-high system for riding. we only use it for surfing. dont discount the xstar or the current x1 from the mc line. they are two extremely good wakeboats. good luck and let us know what you find and like.
Old     (ttuclint)      Join Date: Sep 2003       06-22-2009, 8:23 AM Reply   
VLX no question.
Old     (airrantz)      Join Date: Jun 2004       06-22-2009, 8:30 AM Reply   
SAN 230 or Malibu 247 and a new tow rig please.
Old     (loudontn)      Join Date: Feb 2005       06-22-2009, 8:34 AM Reply   
If you haven't ridden behind an X-Star, definitely try before buying. I have alot of friends who rave about the X-Star, and just as many who think it's overrated. I, personally, think the X-Star has too much transition for my preferences. I prefer a steep Supra wake or a good hybrid (a'la Malibu).
Old     (bill_airjunky)      Join Date: Apr 2002       06-22-2009, 8:52 AM Reply   
VLX is a sweet boat, great features, very sturdy tower but blingy as they get. MC tower is all looks & not sturdy enough in my book. Supra would be second on my list due to wake, ballast, & tower.

I think it would come down to the dealer support in the area between the Malibu & the Supra.
Old     (jarrod)      Join Date: May 2003       06-22-2009, 9:11 AM Reply   
X-star with an 8.1.
Old     (jhebert)      Join Date: May 2007       06-22-2009, 9:53 AM Reply   
why do you guys keep suggesting the bigger boats ?? he said he wanted something around 21 ft....24 ssv, san 230, bu 247, get real all of those boats are huge in comparison to what he is coming from, and new style x-star wake with stock ballast is tiny !!!!
Davis.....out of the boats youre looking at the malibu vlx will give you the best stock wake, as long as it has the 4 tank ballast setup and power wedge.....end of story.....and i own a san 210
Old     (bmartin)      Join Date: Jan 2007       06-22-2009, 10:09 AM Reply   
X-star with just the factory non-pro ballast always beefy . It's a great wake but needs some serious weight to crank up the Beefy factor IMO, more weight than most boats. +1 on the long transition, but it sure makes a wide landing zone which is a plus.

Back to 21' rides, Supra 21V and Nautique 210 is where I would look if I wasn't worried about $s and wanted to be in a 21 footer.
Old     (nsolis220)      Join Date: May 2007       06-22-2009, 10:11 AM Reply   
for a boat of that size I would say look at the VLX if you can afford it. Stock wake is beefy and solid. I would also look at a older SANTE 210 those require the least ballast to get a super kickin wake.

Other notables sanger 215 alothough not as roomy for a 21.6 ft boat and supra 21v
Old     (driverlost)      Join Date: Oct 2008       06-22-2009, 10:11 AM Reply   
Do yourself a favor and check out the MB 21' widebody. Meets your ballast specs. Stock surf wake is nice too . . .
Old     (loudontn)      Join Date: Feb 2005       06-22-2009, 10:14 AM Reply   
As far as short boats, the Supra 21v is probably the biggest wake I've ridden behind.

And I think people, such as myself, took his subject as literal despite the restricted parameteres with which we must make a judgement. This is why I chose a 24SSV.
Old     (dabell)      Join Date: Apr 2007       06-22-2009, 10:14 AM Reply   
I say test drive them all and possibly ride behind them. Figure out which dealer is going to support you better than the other. That list is a great starting point IMO.
Old     (wackbag)      Join Date: Feb 2009       06-22-2009, 10:17 AM Reply   
The Supra Launch 22 has recently gotten my attention. Problem is I'm not ready to buy until next season.
Old     (timmyb)      Join Date: Apr 2007       06-22-2009, 10:20 AM Reply   
The RZ2 is a 22' boat, bigger than he can fit in the slip. The Tige Z1 and VLX are nice boats for the money. Test drive all 3 and see which one you like the best, that's honestly the only way to figure out which boat works best for you.
Old     (airrantz)      Join Date: Jun 2004       06-22-2009, 11:39 AM Reply   
Whoops to be honest I just read the thread title and saw his list of 3 didn't even see he wanted 21' or under. If money was no object for 21' and under I'd go SAN 210, VLX, Sanger V215.
Old     (saceone)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-22-2009, 11:42 AM Reply   

#07 Byerly

saw #06 flying down the highway last night, oh yeah.
Old     (scottymc261)      Join Date: Mar 2009       06-22-2009, 11:47 AM Reply   
Look, you got to get a at least a 22' no matter what boat you get. (ZR2 is major bang 4 buck!) It'll FIT!
Old     (jtnz)      Join Date: Sep 2007       06-22-2009, 5:18 PM Reply   
Epic 23V or even the 23E, leading the pack in terms of function and innovation IMO. I doubt you'd have to add any ballast and they have a surf wake that doesn't suck from what I've seen.

Edit - Sorry didn't see the 21' rule, Sanger V210/215 in that case, bang for buck.

(Message edited by jtnz on June 22, 2009)
Old     (jackeh)      Join Date: May 2008       06-22-2009, 5:43 PM Reply   

SANTE 210 / 230

Epic 23V

Malibu VLX / 23 LSV

Supra GG 24SSV

not in any order.
Old     (deuce)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-22-2009, 5:55 PM Reply   
I think a Meridian 341 would be pretty cool....assuming I could get it from lake to lake. Which is a big assumption, I would probably just have to dry store it somewhere...

Being that I already have the best wakeboat ever built, I'd tie up next to my house on the lake and Summers would be GREAT!
Old     (tazz3069)      Join Date: Aug 2008       06-22-2009, 6:36 PM Reply   
Super Air Nautique 230 Hands Down. Test rode the boat in Arizona. All I can say is AWESOME
Old     (hatepain)      Join Date: Aug 2006       06-22-2009, 6:51 PM Reply   
OMG these are the dumbest most convoluted threads ever. Dude, you just need to spend some time with the boats and decide, cuz guess what they're all nice and it's tough to make a huge mistake. That is of course unless you don't just go check em out.
Old     (mattjj23)      Join Date: May 2008       06-22-2009, 7:16 PM Reply   
MB Team Widebody
Old     (mikeski)      Join Date: Aug 2003       06-22-2009, 7:20 PM Reply   
Bayliner or Wellcraft I/O!
Old     (jhebert)      Join Date: May 2007       06-22-2009, 7:22 PM Reply   
well, what the hell, go with the san 230 !!
Old     (wakeslife)      Join Date: Jul 2005       06-22-2009, 7:23 PM Reply   
If money is not a limitation at least get out and demo an Xstar. You will find that the stock ballast wake will more than suit a progressing beginner. Many people hate on the stock wake but I don't think its all that bad- coming from someone who regularly rides an X1 with 2000lbs.
Old     (ajholt7)      Join Date: Apr 2009       06-22-2009, 7:28 PM Reply   
Tige 20V
Old     (formfunction)      Join Date: Jun 2008       06-22-2009, 7:58 PM Reply   
Truth be told if I could have any boat I wanted it would be a Svfara SV2.There interior layout and build quality is astounding.
Old     (tanner)      Join Date: Oct 2005       06-22-2009, 8:22 PM Reply   
I gotta agree w/ you on that Brock. I loveee the SV2's layout. Man I wish there were a dealer nearby.

But Davis,

I'm really kind of shocked that you've got the Z1 in there w/ a VLX and the 210. Talk about apples and oranges.

Are you worried about your platform hanging out a bit past your slip?... as I don't think it'd be a problem w/ a 22 ft. boat, and might open up your options just a bit.
Old     (mb_kid)      Join Date: Jun 2009       06-22-2009, 9:03 PM Reply   
Do yourself a favor and at least ride behind the MB TWB or the 21 Tomcat. We just spent a week on Lake Shasta with our TWB and we didn't even miss any of the extra space our old 23' had.

Our stock wake (1800lbs) is every bit as good as my friends x-star with 3,000lbs of after-market ballast.(However, both wakes are shaped a little differently.)

A true wakeboard boat is a boat that you don't have to spend extra money on for ballast.

Bottom line; try everything out there, and decide which one you like the best. Don't just buy on brand name.
Old     (evadehickman)      Join Date: Apr 2008       06-22-2009, 10:47 PM Reply   
I'd start by sitting in a bunch of them, even before you test them on the water. Everybody has different reactions to the interior layout. Honestly, when you think about it, you spend some time riding, but a lot of time hanging out. You want to be comfortable! Then, after you have a feel, choose the ones you really felt good about and drive them on the water, as well as ride behind them. Test out all the features, esp. filling and emptying ballast. Get a few family members or friends to come along with you, so you can get a sense of what its like hanging out and also how a few extra people can affect the wake. I know on my boat, a few more bodies can really ramp it up. I have a Sanger V215, great bang for buck, solid company, etc. Money was definitely a factor for us, so we did not even check out some of the more pricey models you have listed, but all these boats are great and all slightly different. Anytime you are going to drop ducats like that, you should get to really try it out. Post your findings...
Old     (pc_sledge)      Join Date: Jan 2006       06-23-2009, 4:46 AM Reply   
MB Widebody best factory wake plus the roomiest in the 21 ft class.
Old     (extremeisaac)      Join Date: Aug 2005       06-23-2009, 8:19 AM Reply   
David is right by sitting in the boat first.. We were dead set on getting a Mastercraft X1 untill we sat in it. once we put 6 people in the cabin of the boat.. it felt kinda cramped..and before you know it.. our "dream" of owning a Mastercraft went out the door.. We ended up with a Sanger V210 and its soo comfortable and roomy.. a little low on the freeboard.. but everything else the boat does makes up for that. We absolutly love that boat..
Old     (kimper)      Join Date: May 2008       06-23-2009, 10:55 AM Reply   
Thanks for all the great input! Sorry if some think its a lame thread, but I always learn from others comments on these types of threads. I plan on demoing a VLX this weekend. Any great boarders in the Austin area who want to tag along send me a PM! I am not sure I am good enough to evaluate it properly....

So the Z1 isn't really a contender? Why?
And to clarify I am looking for a high bang/buck ratio. I just didn't want price to play a huge factor in the opinions.. I can always go a year model or 2 later and equal out the price. I wouldn't be willing to go much over 50k new or used.

(Message edited by kimper on June 23, 2009)
Old    K.B.C.            06-23-2009, 11:12 AM Reply   
"my xstar has a decent wake with just factory ballast."

haha, now THAT is comedy...
Old     (innov8)      Join Date: May 2005       06-23-2009, 11:16 AM Reply   
Hahahaha, that is funny, we run about 4000lbs to get a good wake in an X-Star, but it is nice with 4000lbs.

Nautique 210 is what you want to find a good deal on, cant go wrong with Nautique.
Old     (johnsvt)      Join Date: Dec 2006       06-23-2009, 11:18 AM Reply   
210 or VLX
Old     (tomfish)      Join Date: Apr 2003       06-23-2009, 11:20 AM Reply   
I went to the boat show with an open mind and wanted to try them all out to see what I might be missing. We have a family with some young children, we wakeboard and surf a lot, no tubeing or skiing. We camp out a lot, and sometimes sleep in our boat, We also drive around our lake a lot which is pretty long and sometimes choppy. We also hook up in the party cove and hang out quite a bit, sometimes with 8 or more people on our boat so we need a boat that does all that well. 1st it seemed that the SAN was an awsome boat very high quality, but extemley biased towards just being a wakeboard boat which is great if you are a die hard wakeboarder ALL the time, with no built in cooler that one was out. Next was Tige seemed nice but not really the one, next Mastercraft Awsome looking boat but when I got in an plopped down on the seats it was hard and not accomodating like I'm used to and not a lot of space for for a 3, 4, and 6 year old to run around in. Supras have always been liked by me but I started to just want to be home, so then we went to the Malibu display and climbed into a 23LSV like I have and sat down in the ultra comfy sectional type seating with huge floor space, and lifted up the seat to reveal the HUGE 3 30 pack holding built in cooler and looked over to my brother and said. You know I really tried to be open minded but this boat just truely IS better, FOR WHAT WE USE IT FOR. Others may prefer different things for different needs which is fine but the roominess, the style, the great wake, the sports car handling the Malibu does it for my family. If I had to knock anything it would be the wake. When ballasts are full and wedge down it puts out a nice wake but to truely get a huge kicker it needs extra weight but honestly I think just about every brand needs more weight to get the BIG KICKER. The best wake that I have ridden to date is my other buddies 23LSV with the bigblock motor and 1k of lead plates and a ton of stereo equip. That just puts out the biggest, cleanest wake I've ever hit. I think the key is to ask yourself what YOU use your boat for and get one that fits your style.
Old     (showmedonttellme)      Join Date: Mar 2008       06-23-2009, 11:21 AM Reply   
X-Star. No question.
Old     (wakereviews)      Join Date: Sep 2006       06-23-2009, 11:22 AM Reply   
My 2010 MB widebody is for sale... everyone who has ridden it so far thought the stock wake was incredible. With 500 in the nose it's even better!

Hate - selling b/c my season is over for 6 weeks due to the stupid toe injury so might as well get a jump on trying to sell the boat.
Old     (kimper)      Join Date: May 2008       06-23-2009, 12:12 PM Reply   
My closest MB dealer is a 5 hour drive away, and I hope to get a new enough boat that it is under factory warranty. I have to take that into consideration. And I could I guess go 22', but it is pushing it for our slip..

(Message edited by kimper on June 23, 2009)

(Message edited by kimper on June 23, 2009)
Old     (family_deckhand)      Join Date: May 2008       06-23-2009, 12:46 PM Reply   
This is not meant to say one is better or worse than the other but to say a mastercraft is more blingy than a Malibu VLX is a stretch. I guess I need to redefine what bling means! :-)

If money were no object you can't go wrong with the VLX or a Mastercraft.
Old     (nelson)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-23-2009, 2:02 PM Reply   
I run a VLX and a friend has the X-Star with the 8.1 and the Fly high system. The X-Star will make your knees hate you. The wake is a monster but well worth the money. They are my top 2 choices mine came down to the dealer.
Old     (shon_g)      Join Date: Apr 2007       06-23-2009, 3:20 PM Reply   
X-Star tops my list, but I could see myself in the New Axis boat as well.

(Message edited by shon_g on June 23, 2009)
Old     (volzalum)      Join Date: May 2009       06-23-2009, 5:21 PM Reply   
Centurion Enzo 220 ... I surf and wakeboard behind it with stock ballast and minimal passengers.
Old     (jcocci)      Join Date: Feb 2006       06-23-2009, 6:19 PM Reply   
That's easy - here is what I would want
Old     (kko13)      Join Date: Jul 2006       06-23-2009, 7:54 PM Reply   
VLX VS Z1 is tuff If your all about wakeboarding i would say the vlx is the better choice.If you wanna do a little of everything the Z1 is a better choice.The surf wake on the Z1 is AWSOME. If you would consider a bigger boat the 09 RZ2 is the one i would get hands down.Good luck in your search.Dont forget to test drive them all!

(Message edited by kko13 on June 23, 2009)
Old     (tanner)      Join Date: Oct 2005       06-23-2009, 9:45 PM Reply   

I didn't mean the Z1 wasn't a contender. But the Z1 is a entry level boat, while the VLX is BU's top of the line. That's like comparing a honda vs. a mercedez.

A fairer comparison is the Malibu Vride vs. the Z1... Correct Craft doesn't offer an entry level, so nothing to offer there. The RZ2, even the 22Ve vs. the VLX and 210, is more in line w/ the flagship comparison's. That's kind of why I asked if you could swing the extra foot.

My point is make sure you know your comparing an "entry level" boat vs. a top of the line when looking at the Z1 vs. the others.
Old     (wakeitnofakeit)      Join Date: Jan 2009       06-23-2009, 10:48 PM Reply   
ASCboards in Austin has a used Demo wakecraft for sale. I would recomend that you give it a look. It has the purevert 1650lbs of factory ballast included. I have had many riders behind mine and they love the wake. The best thing about them is they come with everything you will need. I am a dealer for them in the Northeast, but I use mine anytime I can.
Old     (poser007)      Join Date: Nov 2004       06-24-2009, 12:16 AM Reply   
For me it would be a toss up between the Malibu 247 or the Tige Z4 I think these two boats are th best looking boats in the industry.
Old     (formfunction)      Join Date: Jun 2008       06-24-2009, 6:40 AM Reply   
If owners goggles came with herpies everyone in this thread would be on antibiotics.
Old     (cwfunrider)      Join Date: Sep 2006       06-24-2009, 7:18 AM Reply   
I own no owners goggles here. I have done a fair amount of research and this is how I ended up. Unfortunately I have not been able to make it happen yet.

From a bang for your buck standpoint:

#1 MB
#2 Supra
#3 This ones tough but would probably be the 210 or the RZ2

All wake boats are over priced but I also think that Bu and MC are over over priced for nothing more than namesake.

Then again, like I said I own nothing so what the hell do I know.
Old     (wakeandmx)      Join Date: Apr 2009       06-24-2009, 8:12 AM Reply   
+1 for Martin

1. 230
2. 210
3. VLX
Old     (ixfe)      Join Date: Aug 2008       06-24-2009, 10:09 AM Reply   
Okay, I'll weigh in... I don't think this thread has enough opinions yet

Everybody knows I just bought an MB B52V Team Wide Body. I only did so after researching many 21' boats. I really felt like the MB offered the most for the best price.

However, that doesn't mean that I don't drool over other boats. So here is my list:

Boats I seriously considered:

1) MB B52V TWB (biggest interior in a 21' boat, more standard features, most stock ballast... and pure vert!).

2) Supra 21V (Also love the swept back tower on the Supra with the Z5 cargo rack. Didn't like the playpen bow initially; however, now I rarely take out my bow filler cushion. Go figure.)

3) Calabria - Liked this boat because my buddy has one. I also like that I could get one for very cheap. But didn't like the low freeboard. It's a very shallow boat.

Sweet boats that I never let myself get serious about due to sticker shock:

1) Mastercraft X15 (reminds me of the TWB in size... just too expensive for me. But I love the MC tower. It's just so sexy. However, I could never get excited about the MC interior... too hard and edgy. I wanted soft and comfortable).

2) Malibu Wakesetter VLX (Super sexy boat. Who doesn't love the Illusion XS tower? Honestly I love how they look and the interior is GREAT. However, they just cost too much, even in this market)

3) Super Air Nautique 210 - Every time I see one on the water I think, "Damn that's a sexy boat." But when I'd look closely at the boat show I could never get comforable with the inside... too many moving parts on the seats... like a pocket knife or something. Also, for some reason it really bothered me that it didn't have a built in cooler.

Other brands I didnt' really considered for no other reason than they just didn't grab me.

Old     (kimper)      Join Date: May 2008       06-28-2009, 9:46 PM Reply   
I demo'ed this one on Friday.

I really like the looks of this one they have.

First time I have ever boarded behind anything but a transom pull I/O, and holy hat!!! I was struggling to do wake-to-wake jumps behind our boat, but behind this thing it was super easy. I was scared but I felt like if I hit it hard like I do behind our boat I would just fly right up in the sky.
I liked most everything about the boat with a few exceptions.

1. The bow rise was a bit more than I expected.
2. Wife had a huge roller come over the nose with all ballasts full.
3. Price..
MSRP was 82k with trailer
But of course they will knock off 14k and gave me a good price for a trade-in, but when it starts so silly high its still a lot of cash even after the deductions...

So we will see. Trying a Tige next week. I would like to see the difference between the Z1 and the 22Ve..

I will keep you guys posted :-)
Old     (fman)      Join Date: Nov 2008       06-28-2009, 11:04 PM Reply   
I researched many boats before I purchased my Supra. I am going to throw a chime in for Supra here... I looked at MC X15, Malibu, Calabria, and MB boats. I test drove all of these boats.

I own an '08 Sunsport 22V, its basically identical hull design to the Launch 22V, but has a walk through bow and I have the loveseat that faces towards the wakeboarders. My wife and I really liked how they setup the boat so many people can be rear facing towards the action in the boat. The Z5 cargo rack is awesome, I can carry 4 wakeboards, 3 surfboards, and 2 kneeboards and yes even an inflated tube with the rack. It frees up a lot space for everyone to move around in boat, especially with three kids. The Wakeboard Pro PP is sweet, with 8 programmable riders you can individually program in. I upgraded to the 750 lb rear ballast sacs, for a total of 2000 lbs of ballast. Supra uses a soft ballast system which has pro's and con's. Its nice because you can change the size of the ballast sacs for little money and still have auto-fill and drain. However, there are no gauges, and with the 750's full I need to remove gear from the rear lockers. Not a huge deal, but a little inconvenience. Upholstry is top of the line, great stock stereo, and the Supra Tower in my opinion is rock solid and just looks bad ass. The adjustable wakeplate is real nice too, and the gauge console is well laid out. I have had this boat loaded with 10 people, and it still handles nicely and with the Indmar 340 HP motor and CNC 4 blade wakeboard prop pulls out real nice. We also liked the 100" beam width for a little more space. I would not go with any boat under 100" beam width after owning one. The pop out heaters are a must, we use them all the time, especially if you stay out late on the water, they work awesome. The wake behind this boat is very nice for wakeboarding, espeically with the 2000lb system.

The trailer is fully boxed in, 4 wheel disc brakes, with LED lights. This was another requirement for me, especially fully loaded up coming down a hill. The 4 wheel disc brakes are a must.

After owning this boat for 6 months, and having put 60 hours on it already, the only thing I dont care for is the ballast fill is slow and sometimes will not prime immediately. I do not have snap out carpet, which I would like to have. In '09 they redesigned the ballast fill (much quicker) and added snap out carpet for an option.

This is a great time to purchase a boat. If price was no object for me I would have heavily considered a Malibu LSV, they are very nice boats. However, they wanted around $70k for this boat with comparable upgrades to my Supra. I saved $30k from the Malibu and got what I feel is a good quality boat with a 5 year warranty.

Anyway, consider test driving a Supra, they are nice rides and have good value for what you are getting. Not trying to bash on any other boats, all on your list are good choices.
Old     (stxr_racer)      Join Date: Jun 2006       06-28-2009, 11:58 PM Reply   
My old one
Old     (kimper)      Join Date: May 2008       07-03-2009, 8:08 AM Reply   
Tige demo went well. I may post impressions/comparisons between it and vlx in another thread..
At you guys advice demoing X-Star Monday.
Then a SAN 210 Thursday!

Will try to keep you guys posted!


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