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Go Back   WakeWorld > >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive > Archive through July 28, 2009

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Old    Don (silverwake)      Join Date: May 2007       06-30-2009, 12:14 PM Reply   
I was wondering if anyone had a good theory as to why the latter two have such a larger market share than CC (I have not seen the most recent numbers, so I'm just assuming this statement still holds true; if not, the thread should be ignored). I don't own or represent any of the brands and am not looking to start a "my brand's better than yours thread." But I am curious. They're all well-made boats with very strong brand recognition and similar prices (at least in my area). Why does one lag the other two?
Old    Michael Hunter (mhunter)      Join Date: Mar 2008       06-30-2009, 12:21 PM Reply   
You sell more Chevy's than cadillacs.
Old    Tim (srock)      Join Date: Mar 2002       06-30-2009, 12:25 PM Reply   
Oh I love that.

HERE THIS, HERE THIS, Let the Rage begin!!!
Old    Don (silverwake)      Join Date: May 2007       06-30-2009, 12:39 PM Reply   
I may be missing the point of your comment Michael, but I'm not sure it's relevant. Chevy and Cadillac are clearly in different brand segments. One is a luxury brand; the other is not. Setting aside one's loyalty to its boat, clearly the three brands I mention are in the same brand segment. They are all high-end, performance tow-boats.
Old    corey king (snowboardcorey)      Join Date: Jan 2004       06-30-2009, 12:42 PM Reply   
Hard to say exactly why they lagged a bit in market share. My guess is their now defunct "distribution centers" were a part of the problem. Basically these centers didnt allow local dealers to compete on a level playing field which led to gaps in dealer distribution. It seems like CC is really strong where they are strong and really weak where they are weak demographically speaking. Their new management and new facotry should help alleviate some of these issues.
Old    Don (silverwake)      Join Date: May 2007       06-30-2009, 12:55 PM Reply   
Corey, that's a really great point. I've heard that CC had a "middleman" but I don't know a lot about it. Can you shed some more light on it? So, did all the manufacturer's units get run through their distribution centers? If so, do you know what the reasoning behind it was? It seems to me that it would just add another cost layer. You say that those centers are now defunct, so I assume the manufacturer sells its units direct to the dealers now? When did that happen? I wonder if CC's market share has been ticking up since the change.
Also, does anyone have any insight into their marketing strategies? Does CC spend a lot less in this area than the other two?
Old    Jason B (jason_b)      Join Date: Feb 2008       06-30-2009, 1:02 PM Reply   
^^^
That was going to be my guess as well. You don't see many around me. Pretty much ALL Malibu and MC.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       06-30-2009, 1:20 PM Reply   
It seems a lot like what corey is saying, even just in one state.

My part of Wisco all I see is malibu.... not wakesetters and stuff, but responses with towers. No one knows any better, its all weekend warriors... So someone with the "wakeboard" response will take a set on our boat (old 210 sacked out) and be like, "holy dealer totally lied to us, this wake is nuts....".... and its true. The only dealer in town is malibu.... so of course the majority is malibu.... I should also mention this dealer wears tiny jean shorts even through winter, has a mullet, wears oakley razorblades (from the 80's) and drinks PBR..... so its not malibu's fault, I blame him.

If I go down towards madison, I see a TON more CC and MC boats since there are MC and CC dealers there.... I think it comes down to where a person can buy a certain boat, but more importantly where they can get it serviced easily...... after that then comes loyalty which has been built off of the previous ownership
Old    Ryan D (ogopogo)      Join Date: May 2005       06-30-2009, 1:26 PM Reply   
whats wrong with PBR?
Old    David Williams (wakeworld)      Join Date: Jan 1997       06-30-2009, 1:27 PM Reply   
If I had to guess, I'd say it is probably because Correct Craft was a closely held, family-owned business for so long. Not sure what the ownership structure is now, but usually with that type of business, you tend to see slower growth due to the fact that they are financing everything themselves and keeping control within the "family." More aggressive companies might acquire capital for expansion by selling stock or bringing in investors, but this tends to dilute the ownership.

A good example of this is In N Out Burger. Arguably the best fast food available with a brilliant menu, marketing, etc. However, it's still a relatively small company because it's closely held and doesn't sell franchises or anything like that.
Old    Shredtastic (seth)      Join Date: Sep 2002       06-30-2009, 1:29 PM Reply   
Nick easy on the PBR! I mean come on the proof is right there on the can, Blue Ribbon Winner! My SAN is always stocked with a case of PBR's.
Old    Ian Brown (wakereviews)      Join Date: Sep 2006       06-30-2009, 1:30 PM Reply   
whoah whoah whoah, what the hell is wrong with PBR?
Old     (shredhead)      Join Date: Jun 2003       06-30-2009, 1:52 PM Reply   
Each distribution center was family owned, but by separate family members. They were conservative and sometimes they lacked a unified focus.
You also have to give a lot of credit to Malibu and MC. They put out a lot of boats when the market was good. I don't think we will ever see the numbers we were seeing a few years ago.
Old    corey king (snowboardcorey)      Join Date: Jan 2004       06-30-2009, 2:08 PM Reply   
I think David and Shredhead are on point. I think that a large part of CC was happy building the number of boats they built and didnt look at rapid growth as something that was needed, economically growth is not always good, running at full capacity is good, running over capacity can lead to higher costs and lower profitability.

In regards to the distribution centers I don't know the whole story, hopefully a CC dealer can chime in.

I would say it is safe to assume that a distribution center added a carrying cost onto the dealers. I've also heard distributors sometimes sold boats out from under dealers as they could essentially sell the boat for less money than a dealer (assuming dealer paid a markup) and still hold a margin of profit. In turn affected dealers either stocked fewer boats knowing they would be undercut or stopped stocking CC all together.
Old    Don (silverwake)      Join Date: May 2007       06-30-2009, 2:19 PM Reply   
More great info. Thank you for the responses. David, good point about the family ownership. I wonder if their lack of capital and therefore lack of ability to expand production really was one of the main factors. If CC couldn't keep up with production, then it means that demand outstripped supply (an enviable position for the manufacturer). If this were the case then basic economics would tell us that we should see at least two things: a higher price for their boats and also longer lead times. I wonder if any CC dealers can comment on whether or not those two things were common throughout the boom years. (BTW, I've heard that In N Out is a great place but haven't had the pleasure of ever running across one).
I'm still intrigued by the distribution centers. Does anyone know the current status of them? Do they still exist or did the Maloon family close them down?
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       06-30-2009, 2:48 PM Reply   
C'mon, we all know exactly what is wrong with PBR.
Old    muffintop (muffintop)      Join Date: Dec 2005       06-30-2009, 2:50 PM Reply   
Agreed- PBR rocks, and in general, CC is underrepresented by dealerships in large portions of the country. There have been 4 different CC dealers in W. Michigan alone in the past 4 years, and none currenlty to my knowledge. No dealer or service= no market share.

Mastercraft has over 60 boats on my lake, Malibu around 10, and the only nautiques are a couple early 1990 19' ski boats.

No offense to CC- this is my own opinion, but the wakeboard boats look boxy, and the racks were not as asthetically pleasing to me as MC and Bu. That being said, they seem like a really well, built quality boat...
Old    Lionel (lionel)      Join Date: Nov 2005       06-30-2009, 2:52 PM Reply   
I think Ford still has a lot of family ownership & they're not taking any government money!
Old    corey king (snowboardcorey)      Join Date: Jan 2004       06-30-2009, 3:53 PM Reply   
Whoop Whoop for my F-150!
Old    Jonathan Bay (john211)      Join Date: Aug 2008       06-30-2009, 4:49 PM Reply   
I’m a cc owner, somewhat by random, always liked Ski Nautique. So I bought the cross-over at the time (‘06 211) to ski and wake. Not a good ski wake. But a decent wake wake.

Nautiques in a way retain that quality of being throw-backs to another time and so I understand the allure of MC and Malibu. Every X-Star is smashing. Same with certain Malibu models but I’m not as sure of their model numbers.

Nautique probably hasn’t been as aggressive in promoting the ‘ornament’ quality of its boats. It can do so (no doubt) but I don’t see it often. In a tale of two cities, I visited both the Overland Park, KS boat show and the Rogers, AR boat show about four weeks apart last winter. Skiers Wharf Extreme from Osage Beach, LOTO, had a smashing 236 on display. Black rub-rail under-stripe and hull color with a mint green main panel in between, Z-5 Cargo rack, patterned graphics that ran up onto the top deck, patterned carpeting. And Joe there now also carries MC so it looked good next to an always dressed-up X-Star.

Then in Rogers, the dealer there had three cc’s in all white, with (brushed?) aluminum towers. The boats were drab, drab, drab ... as was the whole experience of the dealership’s display. The MC dealer carried another line (Tige ?) but anyway it had Andrew Adkinson standing there and being unbelievably personable notwithstanding his name.

This is the time of year I go down to the lake and see all the smart X-stars and Malibus, and, sometimes it makes me wince to see a drab old-school cc cruise by in the mix.

Looks aside, there is a real difference in wakes. Notice how much slower and shorter line-lengths cc owners (and perhaps some other not MC or Malibu brands) prefer.

http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/709305.html?1245992021

My one time experience behind a Malibu 247-something had me begging for higher than 25 mph. That speed felt the same as 21-22 behind my boat. I thought the calibrations must be different with the speedometers and so I’ve since carried GPS on my boat to measure it. (About a ½ mph slow, maybe).

Then of course, once you start with one brand – and like it – owner loyalty takes hold with a hard-to-shake grip. To go wakeboarding, I have to tow my boat down and then up US 65 between Springfield and Branson every trip. On the way I see a lot of things:– Tahoes, Bayliners, bass boats galore, pontoons, PWC’s, alum jon boats, you name it.

But once in a while, I see another inboard (rarely a cc) and I always feel a bit of kinship with it, all the same. Last weekend, I was returning back to town (an hour north of the lake), and was pulling off the highway, when I spotted a brand new 210 cruising down south. It was all white with the cc "peridona green" (oh ? ... light forest green) color mid-striping the hull.

Bland? ... yes or well yes and no ... but so cc ... yes definitely. It was like if a movie star had just passed by.
Old    shooter_08            06-30-2009, 5:30 PM Reply   
I will just chime in on my observations, so don’t flame me.

My local MC dealer has a TON of unsold boats in stock right now (much more than the local Malibu or CC dealer). Is a boat considered sold when a dealer purchases the boat or when it’s sold to the consumer because those numbers may be inflated?

I see mostly CC and Malibu boats in my area. I think of the Bu as the family boat and the CC as more of a core wake or ski boat although both can have good wakes and be family friendly.

I have noticed everyone on here gets very protective of “their boat manufacture”. Each boat tries to fill a “nitch” in the market and I would say some niches sell better.
Old    Brock Landers (formfunction)      Join Date: Jun 2008       06-30-2009, 6:22 PM Reply   
CC's are classic and timeless with roots starting in mohogany boats.How can you not have respect for a company that built such classics as the mustang and the Ski nautique.Unlike Malibu and Mastercraft CC has a customer base for life that won't buy anything else because thats what there parents grew up with.

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