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Go Back   WakeWorld > >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive > Archive through March 18, 2009

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Old    Chad (koop)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-19-2009, 9:57 PM Reply   
Love the look of epics.... Don't own a boat, but have been looking for about a year now....The thing that scares me is the 8.1L engine (I believe that's correct) Is this thing a hog to just cruise around and hangout in...I know it's probably compairable to other boats when riding.... but what about going from A to B... I live in Penticton and have seen them sitting in Summerland.... really sharp looking boats.... I have a young family, so although I love riding, just getting on the water and hanging out is going to be the primary use(for the first couple years).. Does buying an Epic make any sense or should a guy just put his money into a supra, malibu, moomba,or CC.
Old    Nick (bird_dog0347)      Join Date: Feb 2006       02-19-2009, 10:21 PM Reply   
while I can understand where you are coming from, I don't think fuel consumption should be a big concern when cruising around without ballast as it is a wake boat. Non of the core wake boats are designed to cruise around unweighted and get great GPH. They might do it well, but that was not a design requirement.

Demo the ones you like and you will find what fits you best. I would not worry about the 8.1 though, I don't think anyone ever accused their wake boat of having too much power.
Old    Mike (ponyh8r)      Join Date: Dec 2004       02-19-2009, 10:23 PM Reply   
Another thing to think about is that an Epic unweighted only weighs in at 3K pounds. That is pretty light. So it does have a big motor, but the weight of the boat is a lot less than any other wakeboat of its size. Shoot my Xstar is only 22 feet and tips the scales at like 4300lbs. You should be good.
Old    HeHateMe (hamkj)      Join Date: Apr 2002       02-19-2009, 11:13 PM Reply   
There shouldn't be anything left in Summerland. They shipped all of the Epic molds etc to California (Fineline) to be built. The 2 that are still left in Penticton were given to a local lawyer in town who took it for payment for services rendered and the other went to a group of guys in exchange for advertising services... both are Volvo powered (have been equipped with the new oil pan I believe) boats which they have since changed to Mercruiser because of the Volvo engine problems they were having.

After Katana lost the Epic contract... they bought Interior Fiberglass in Vernon who built Malibu/Liquid Ride...

Recently, I have heard Katana has laid everyone off and has sold the Malibu/Liquid Ride molds to a company in California...

I believe both of the buildings in Vernon and Summerland are for sale but I think the Katana molds will remain here and will be built again when the market picks up.

As for your question about a boat for crusing and hanging out on... the Epic is a WakeBoard machine...

If you are wanting to hang out and chill... you may want to look at the Mastercraft X55 or X45 or the Tige RZ2 or RZ4... Or Malibu WakeSetter... etc... just more creature comforts... more than just a wakeboard boat...

And better resale value if you look at some of the used ones for sale...

The Epics are approx $72,000... and I have seen some Brand New "Demos" for $50,000 or less... Thats a lot of depreciation in less than a year.
Old    Art (rallyart)      Join Date: Nov 2006       02-19-2009, 11:49 PM Reply   
Chad, the GPH on most boats is directly related to the horsepower used. That's another way of saying it doesn't matter how big the engine is. It takes X hp to go 25 MPH and a 4.3 liter engine mill be making the same power as an 8.1 at that speed. The Epic is light when empty and that means less fuel is needed to push it. The hull design is also important for drag but I don't know how the Epic compares to other wake boats. I know mine gets better mileage at 25 than my smaller I/O used to get.
In Penticton you can demo boats easily so take the time to try them on the water. How they drive and what they do for you is really important. You might keep loving the Epic, or you might find something else that suits you more.
Old    Andrew Taft (taft)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-20-2009, 1:04 AM Reply   
I went for a drive around Summerland last summer trying to track down those damn Epics. I wanted to get a up close look. I figured it was Katana that was doing them, but I couldn't see any there at that time.

They sound like a hell of a boat, but their interiors suck. Definitely doesn't match the price tag. If you're looking for something local, there is a really good Supra/Moomba dealer in Summerland. They're called Moomba Mobius. I'm heading back up in a couple weeks to test out some '09s he has.

If you're going to be using the boat to cruise, there is no need for an Epic. You're not going to keep your boat for years and years; upgrade when it's needed. It would be like buying a race car for your daily commute. Sure it'll look good but, if you're not gonna push it, why spend the extra money?

(Message edited by taft on February 20, 2009)
Old    C. R. (crushing76)      Join Date: Feb 2007       02-20-2009, 1:11 AM Reply   
Wouldn't worry about the fuel consumption for the reasons stated above...

If I were going to buy an Epic, Vs. any of the other boats you would listed based on PRICE ALONE, I would buy used FOR SURE. As hehateme stated, the resale value is crap. You can even find "brand new" demo boats for less that 40k American!!! I ALMOST bought one.

Lastly, if you are going to do quite a bit of lounging, it MIGHT not be the best boat for you... I have not sat in one for any great length of time, but there are more plush options out there.

If you are a hard core wakeboarder though, this might be the boat for you. From everything I've seen and heard, this boat will throw a MEAN wake.
Old    Chad (koop)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-20-2009, 9:03 PM Reply   
Thanks for all the feed back guys...Kinda solidifies what I already thought about a bigger motor...I've been looking for a boat for quite a while new or used still undecided....don't really care which brand either, I like a few manufactures and models supra 22 ssv, mastercraft x2, moomba lsv,malibu vtx,and epic.....Got cash for new but probably gunna go used...first boat,young family, beginner rider....Just wanna get something that looks good and has been taken care of....I know having no clear cut favorite manufacturer could create an up roar on this site...but I honestly just want something that I can get the family out on the water in and throw the odd set....Epic boats are pretty good looking units but I kinda fiqure getting one might be over kill....
Old    Nick (bird_dog0347)      Join Date: Feb 2006       02-21-2009, 8:24 AM Reply   
Just don't do what I did and get an entry boat just because you are new to the sport. I traded in after the first year and took a loss, get a core boat to start with cause you and your family will get hooked and want more in a year or two. Based on the list you wrote... I would scratch off the Moomba (I had one and upgraded to the supra). If you are already looking at the nicer boats (Malibu, Supra, MC) I would just find the one you like best out of those and make sure it is a core wake boat and not a crossover (unless you actually waterski).
Old    C.I.E..... Evan (guido)      Join Date: Jul 2002       02-21-2009, 10:16 AM Reply   
Yup.. What Nick said.

Go out and buy a real wake boat. Especially if you have kids. That way when you get hooked you wont have to sell the boat and upgrade.
Old    Jeff Baker (innov8)      Join Date: May 2005       02-21-2009, 10:52 AM Reply   
Demo, CC,MC,Malibu,Supra and then make a decision on what best suits your families needs.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       02-21-2009, 11:56 AM Reply   
Check around to see what kind of reputation your local dealer has then Demo any brand that has a good dealer in your area.

I can see why one might be skeptical about Epic since they are so new
Old    Chad (koop)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-21-2009, 8:51 PM Reply   
once again appreciate the comments....let's me know I'm on the right track....Nick what didn't you like about the moomba?....Seems to me the moomba is just a cheaper version of a supra(fit and finish)in fairness to supra i've never test drove one....I did test drive a moomba lsv, mastercraft x2, and malibu vtx... I always thought I wanted a mastercraft until I started comparing features and prices to other boats...In my opinion mastercrafts are over priced compared to other boats with similar features....You don't hear much about epic's pro's/con's(probably because there aren't as many owners as other brands)....They only thing I do know is they supposedly throw a stupid crazy wake, have ridiculous ballast, and look sharp in my opinion
Old    Mike (ponyh8r)      Join Date: Dec 2004       02-21-2009, 8:53 PM Reply   
With most things in life, you get what you pay for.
Old    Chad (koop)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-22-2009, 9:50 PM Reply   
Mike, I don't want to piss anyone off with my comments....Looking for my first boat and doing significant research(online & at dealerships)I have personally decided mastercraft is not worth the extra cash in my opinion....Sure your x star is a great boat and fit's your needs...Anyone got any epic feedback?
Old    Nick (bird_dog0347)      Join Date: Feb 2006       02-22-2009, 10:06 PM Reply   
Chad, I liked the Moomba a lot, it was just lacking in a few areas. First off, storage. It had 1250 lbs of factory ballast and it likes weight up front. This is a problem as it was not a playpen bow, so to add weight up front, you had sacs sitting out everywhere. The wake is sick when you sac it out, but I got tired of stepping on bags, emptying and filling them.

Second problem was the power, it only had the 325hp engine with a standard prop. I could have gotten away with a better prop alone, but when wake surfing I would get a head ache later that night from the fumes. My new boat as the 340 with the cats and the wakeboard prop. Even loaded down, it has no power problems and surfing is much better.

And as you mentioned, fit and finish. The Moomba is fantastic if that is all you can afford, but with your budget, go Supra. (or CC, MC, Bu)
Old    gangstar (joe_crawley)      Join Date: Jan 2007       02-22-2009, 11:08 PM Reply   
Get a used Epic and be done with it if it fits your taste, it'll be a steal for sure, and it has one of the sickest wakes you'll see. Don't write off MC or CC if you are looking for the goods though, Mike's comment was 100% on point- you simply won't find a better boat than a 210 or an X15.
Old    Kevin R Baugh (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       02-22-2009, 11:14 PM Reply   
I find the technology they are using to build the boats Very interesting
Resin-Infused All-Composite construction, Dual Rudder "Vector Steer System
I have never had a chance to drive/Ride one but I sure would like to
Old    HeHateMe (hamkj)      Join Date: Apr 2002       02-23-2009, 1:12 AM Reply   
Chad if you want some feedback on Epic... knock on the doors that are in your own backyard. There are two right here in Penticton. They will be able to give you LOTS of real life feedback. Beware though... you may not like all of the feedback... but they will let you know their first hand experiences.
Old    Chad (koop)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-24-2009, 7:01 PM Reply   
The thing that scares me about epic is this....Everyone talks about how great the wake is, that's all you hear about when epic is mentioned....If it throws such a sick wake then why don't people jump all over it when they are looking for a new boat?....If the wake is so much better stock then why don't malibu, mastercraft,CC, and so on owners jump on it when they upgrade or get a newer model....Kinda makes me curious?....Gotta be something there?
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-24-2009, 7:10 PM Reply   
its a plain jane boat besides the wake... most people who have the money to drop on a wakeboard boat have families/other things they want to do besides ride 100% of the time

(Message edited by sidekicknicholas on February 24, 2009)
Old    Nick (bird_dog0347)      Join Date: Feb 2006       02-24-2009, 7:31 PM Reply   
Honestly, I had the deal all lined up for the Epic. The wife did not like it, "it was ugly"... She loved the Supra (favorite color, seating, etc.) and I was just as happy either way. I am not a pro wakeboarder and the 24SSV wake is huge as it is. I also figured the resale of the Supra would be a little more dependable than the Epic as they did not have a proven resale value.
Old    Jos (jtnz)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-24-2009, 7:45 PM Reply   
People who have owned a CC, an MC or whatever like to stick with that brand. If they had a good experience the first time then it's a fairly safe bet they will go back. A lot of people don't seem to trust new companies, especially since the first bunch of boats with the Volvo motors blew up. Some of these other companies have been around 40, 50, 60 years or more.

I'd own one if there was one available that I could afford. Personally I couldn't care less about chrome, bling, carpeting and all the other bullsch#t. I like that they are a dedicated machine, I'm not out to impress anyone with how fancy my boat is, I'm out there to ride and I think Epic sums that up pretty well (apart from the price tag brand new, ouch.) Plus they come with closed cooling standard I think, big plus for the salt where I ride. I believe they changed from an option to standard to maximise fuel efficiency.

Talking about fuel consumption they do have the dropzone hull, but with such a light boat to begin with I think the difference would but pretty hard to notice. I hear (read) they will steer in reverse and out-handle just about anything when loaded due to the dual rudders.

(Message edited by jtnz on February 24, 2009)
Old    KEVIN (kko13)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-24-2009, 7:46 PM Reply   
i would not only look at the boats but the dealer who services them.I make know bones about it epic would be at the very bottom of my list. test drive them ALL. malibu mc tige moomba supra cc and get info on the dealer. used is fine i bought used but in todays market i would look for a 07 or 08 leftover brand new the dealer is looking to make a killer deal on. thats just MY 2 cents. good luck with your search.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-24-2009, 7:55 PM Reply   
I'm with Jos... if I had the $$$ to go buy whatever I wanted it would be an Epic, hands down.

No adding ballast, good sound system, big boat, it has everything I would want.
Old    David (colombiansurfer)      Join Date: Sep 2008       02-24-2009, 8:14 PM Reply   
Chad, look at Centurion Avalanche. Great on gas, great wake, great for surfing and a nice looking party boat in the cove. Best of all, it is easy on the pockets!
Old    Chad (koop)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-25-2009, 7:41 AM Reply   
David I looked a centurion..... The closest dealer to me(kelowna) wasn't very helpful....seemed I knew more about the boat than they did....Mastercraft in kelowna treated me like a tire kicker... Apparently I didn't come off as a guy who was ready to drop cash on a new boat....There is also an MB dealer in kelowna(New last year) they were basically reading the brochure to me(learning specs ect. as they went) seemed really weird....Malibu dealership is by far the best experience I've had in my quest to get on the water...Guys are very helpful and know there stuff, real pleasent experience....Moomba/Supra dealer out of summerland have also been very helpful....
Old    Nick (bird_dog0347)      Join Date: Feb 2006       02-25-2009, 7:48 AM Reply   
Chad... there is your answer. Either the Bu or the Supra, pick the one you like best and don't look back. Demo both, pick your colors, and enjoy your summer.
Old    Andrew Taft (taft)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-25-2009, 11:45 AM Reply   
I have a place on the bottom of the bluff that the Supra/Moomba dealer is on top of, so I've had a lot of experience with them. Great dealer, they've gone above and beyond since before we even bought a boat from them.

With boats, having a good reliable dealer close by is a huge advantage. I've had a day where my boat died on the water. 5min later the dealer was getting it running again... no more lost days on the water.

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