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Old    Johan BumboClat (hyule)      Join Date: Nov 2006       02-19-2008, 1:32 PM Reply   
Is there anybody out there that can actually state that in their experience flex boards generated better pop or better landings than traditional boards, even considering you have to edge more diligently?

What's the real deal?
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-19-2008, 2:22 PM Reply   
I loved the roam but it was a pain in anything but riding it in anything but butter was a pain... I am getting my slingshot setup tomorrow so hopefully that will similar, but with fins
i'll post up when I do
Old    Jeremy Byrom (wakerider111)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-19-2008, 2:53 PM Reply   
In my personal experience the slingshot boards do give me better pop and definitely softer landings. I used to think center spines were the ace of soft landings, but flex has taken that claim now. I wont ride anything other than a flex board (sure there are a few "traditional" boards out there that id like to try still but i am positive they will not make me doubt my conversion to flex.)

I am not sure if i would use the word "diligently" to describe the edge requirement, it seems to make me think of the words "correctly" and "harder." but maybe this is not your case in thinking, but for me I like to use the word "correctly." The board will reward you for good edge technique which will load the flex of the board, readying it to give you additional rebound energy to the pop energy you get at the release of the wake. I learned a lot from riding the slingshot, my best teacher yet;)

This is how I "PERSONALLY" would describe it. If and when you get the chance to ride one, give it at least 2-3 sets. The ride is very different (in a good way) and takes a while getting used to, but i bet you will also enjoy the journey as well as the destination of getting accustomed to its ride

P.S. if you want to know more about my personal thoughts, check the review i posted in the review section
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       02-19-2008, 3:01 PM Reply   
IMO a hybrid board that incorporates flex with bottom features would be bomb. Flex has advantages, but as it stands is not the "end all" of future board designs. We'll see what happens.
Old    Brandon Kee (trickyboarder08)      Join Date: Jul 2005       02-19-2008, 3:07 PM Reply   
I have an '08 slingshot that I can't wait 'till it warmer so can try it out. I'm not sure bottom feature on a flex board is really possible. But what do I know, anything is possible right?
Old    Jason Callen (westsidarider)      Join Date: Feb 2003       02-19-2008, 3:32 PM Reply   
i have been riding the roam ever since it first came out in late '04(the "05 model). it took a few seets to get used to edging properly and harder every time, but flex absolutely gives you more pop in my opinion. there are things that i would change. like someone said above, i think a hybrid will be more of the future of boards. i have been trying to get my thoughts across to hyperlite to create a board that is stiff, like a normal board, between the bindings, and flexible in the tip and tail. the byerly monarch is a step in this hybrid direction but still falls way short of where i think things will be a years to come. its going to take quite a bit of research and developement to get to a point where this will work and stand up to time. we will see. that is my opinion
Old    Cason Slaughter (caseman1322)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-21-2008, 8:31 AM Reply   
the Liquid Force Press. I think this board is the most advanced in the flex/hybrid category. it has the thicker more solid feel in the center but a good amount of flex in the tip and tail.
Old    Jerm I. Side (jermiside)      Join Date: Jun 2007       02-21-2008, 1:41 PM Reply   
too much flex is like kicking a half inflated soccer ball...you just dont get the punch you need. a correctly inflated soccer ball and you can boot that thing. same goes with boards, a real flexy board is a little to forgiving off the wake, great for soft landings but not for great pop off the wake.

boards do need some flex for producing good pop off the wake, but not flex like a snowboard. the companies that are using traditional board construction with tweaked tip and tail flex are leading the correct direction for better pop. the lf lyman and cwb absolute have some of that now.

you dont see the top pros riding flex boards unless they are hitting rails. parks never rode in a wake event with a flex board, shane didn't either. no top podium spot has even been earned by a rider on a flex board, ever. those guys live off riding "correctly" and they desgin boards with tradition construction for the best riding results.

those are my pennys on the topic.
Old    Eric Schermerhorn (fax_holiday)      Join Date: Feb 2008       02-21-2008, 3:16 PM Reply   
alright this might be a dumb question, but i'm curious...

do you guys ride flex boards larger or smaller, wider, or narrower than your previous boards... i'm just wondering if anyone has really tried out this technology and tried, and maybe noticed about, all the available variations to see what seems to work best and why? even if its to a personal standard...
Old    Small Light (stephan)      Join Date: Nov 2002       02-21-2008, 3:59 PM Reply   
I've ridden the 142 and 138 Slingshot Recoil. I'm 5'7" and weight about 150. I much preferred the 138. When it comes to riding a Slingshot or similar flex board you want to stick true to size, on a Roam i say go as big as possible.
Old    Chasin7 T (chaser)      Join Date: Sep 2006       02-21-2008, 5:40 PM Reply   
does slingshot have any pro riders on tour? If not, why?
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-21-2008, 5:47 PM Reply   
the say the company supports freeride...if i was sponsored and didn't have to ride comps i wouldn't either... slingshot is awesome, best customer service, nicest riders, amazing products -- I didn't have any fins for my Recoil and Jeff House hooked me up with some he had, no cost... told me where he lived and I picked them up, he is the man and their products are awesome
Old    wiz            02-21-2008, 7:14 PM Reply   
well......true wake2wake flexboards just made their debut in 07. jeff mckee, jeff house, aaron aubrey, travis propst, & rhett whatley all ride for slingshot. i think its a new direction that more manufacturers are going to go in. i rode a recoil setup all last season & have to say its the most fun i've had since i started riding. the pop is unlike any other board i've ever rode. the landings are unbelievable. i ditched my marius for the slingshot because the pop is much more and the landings are softer. i think that you'll see more riders switching to flexboards when their sponsor builds one. the lf flexboard is thicker & doesn't have as much flex as the slingshot, so i'm wondering if it's as poppy & has as soft landings. definitely demo before u form an opinion. give it a fair chance & ride it atleast 3 sets. i find it hard to believe that u wont like it. it's kinda like " i tried it, but dsl sucks. i'm sticking 2 dial up."
Old    Jeff Moore (jeff359)      Join Date: Jun 2005       02-21-2008, 9:42 PM Reply   
I was gonna say ask Callen, as I pulled him once on Jrod's boat and the guy kills it on a Roam. That to me will be the true first flex board. Jason, I still owe you and a few others pulls behind the Session sitting in my garage.
Old    Josh Weitekamp (da_kamp)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-21-2008, 9:53 PM Reply   
Jason, might i suggest the use of Carbon Fiber in between the bindings ? would lighten the board up and add the stiffness that would make a board thats flex everywhere else near perfect. Of course it would jack up the price, but if the board turned out legit, i'm sure it would sell.

btw if they like that idea, please give credit where it's due
Old    Jeremy Byrom (wakerider111)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-22-2008, 8:16 AM Reply   
Cason Slaughter (caseman1322)~
So have you ridden the LF Press? and slingshot? If so i am curious to hear more in depth opinions. This question applies to anyone else. too.

Flex is as different as continuous rocker is to three-stage rocker, MORE SO in fact! Just as it wouldn't be the best idea in the world to judge one rocker pattern over the other without even trying or even after the first wake jump for that matter so to would it be unfair (to yourself) to judge flex without giving it a try. And as already said. give it a "one-two-three strikes your out" test.

Another question and comment about Slingshot vs LF press. Isn't the press pretty much just a foam core? I know Slingshot is foam and wood hybrid (which i like the idea of A LOT). AND i know that Obrien's version comming out soon has an EVA core. I don't know too much about EVA, but maybe someone can enlighten that too? (or maybe i will wikipedia it ;P)
Old    Jerm I. Side (jermiside)      Join Date: Jun 2007       02-22-2008, 9:19 AM Reply   
chuck j, sounds like you have not demoed the lf press yet, as you are "wondering if it is as popppy or has soft landings?" but you have already formed your opinion on slingshot? interesting.

flex boards have been around since the roam was introduced..westsiderida has been on one since 04/05. yet no pro's on one in any event? interesting again...

how many wake videos do you buy a year? 2,3,4? less? well if you dont buy more than that you wont be able to see all of the great freriders..yes jeff house is cool. i met him at a pro tour event once...that would have never happend if i only bought a video? cool guy.

without pro tour events where would you get to meet your favorite rider? boatshow maybe. but not the same as watching them ride in person.

wakerider111 your an expert on core construction. what do you think of the SUB IV? it has a good amount of flex, very much the same as the recoil. you should do a comparison for us.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-22-2008, 9:34 AM Reply   
Either way I'm pretty sure that in the next two years or so that every company will have an extensive line of flexboards -- whether they been wake-2-wake ones, or rail ones...that is where the future of wakeboarding is going
Old    Jerm I. Side (jermiside)      Join Date: Jun 2007       02-22-2008, 9:56 AM Reply   
nah, im not under the same impression Nick with the direction of wakeboarding. it seems that the riders on here that are really pasionate about flex boards are some how associated with slingshot. dont shot me it just appears that way. anyone that really pushes flex boards pushes slingshot on here.

thats not a bad thing, good for them. but it just doesnt represent what wakeboarding is for everyone.

i doubt there will be a huge revolution in the wakeboarding with everyone making a huge line of flex boards. it might be grow to bigger than kneeboarding is tho.
Old    justinh            02-22-2008, 10:09 AM Reply   
Nick, I disagree. I think there is a future in flexboards, but it is not where all boards are going.

Pros, the ones riding at the highest levels, are seeking stiffer boards--PVC cores: Atomic, darkcore, DINE. I am really going to stick my neck out on this one, but it is really as simple as the harder your board resists the wake; the harder the wake will push back.

All boards flex. Less flex equals more pop (all other variables equal). Shop guys please test. To test: flip a slingshot and a PVC core board upside down and jump on them. Which "pops" you up higher.

I like flexboards and own a roam, but not for pop--for rails and butter.
Old    Nick Tomsyck (sidekicknicholas)      Join Date: Mar 2007       02-22-2008, 10:21 AM Reply   
my last board was an Ibex, which I thought had great pop, until I rode the recoil... it acts like a spring...it flexes and then snaps back way harder than the stiff ibex ever did... I'm not saying all boards will be flex, but each company will have a full-lineup of flex boards to go along with the convential boards
Old    Cason Slaughter (caseman1322)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-22-2008, 10:21 AM Reply   
I've only had one chance to ride a slingshot board and I would agree with the comment about too much flex can take away from the pop. I'm a very average rider so I'm no expert but to me it felt like the LF Press had more pop than the slingshot boards and the landings were just as soft. I think the best part about the Press is that because there are no channels or spines it forces you to edge properly. I ride the Lyman regularly but when I just feel like really getting in some good training I'll get on the press. Bad habits can be really hard to break and the press helps break them or keep them from forming, in a lot of areas of my riding. spines, fins and channels on your board are good but they can be a crutch. If you can stay balanced and controlled with a board like the Press that has a totally smooth bottom than once you get back on a board with them you will feel more in control than you ever realized
Old    Jeremy Byrom (wakerider111)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-22-2008, 2:45 PM Reply   
Jermicide~
I don't consider myself an expert on core construction, but i have a lot of interest and curiosities on wake tech.

Also, i personally am not associated with slingshot beyond that of a rider of their gear (f.y.i.) And i personally "push" slingshot because it is the only flex board i have tried so far. Knowing the core constructions (despite my lack of expertise) I also like the idea of wood and foam hybrid... i don't know, maybe i feel like i am riding "ol' skool" (wood) and "new school" foam at the same time... maybe it sounds like more workmanship went into it... and i like the USA made idea too. So for these reasons i support them more.

About the sub 6... i thought it was more "ridged" not flexy... am i wrong?



When i think of EVA the first thing comes to mind is foot beds and stuff, not wakeboard cores, so naturally i am very curios about that.

I for one have felt more pop on a slingshot than any board. granted i have not ridden a huge flury of boards, but i have ridden my share that i feel 100%confident about my opinion of slingshot pop (or flex lines in general)... for myself at least.

I see the example of jumping on boards upside down, ... but the rigged board will break after a few jumps (if not the first)... i have seen it done in the pointless films video that shane and the crew did. shane or some other rider does it to a board (granted it was propped on a fence i think and he rather stomped on it. Anyway, boards are not trampolines to jump on. Id like to think of them more as loaded springs like in a child's toy gun. boards such as slingshot will load like a spring and then launch at the release of the wake and then is where i feel like that bullet in the childs' gun... "WEEEeeeeee" I no longer think of "loading the line" alone anymore. I think also of "loading the board!"


FLEX FOREVER
Jeremy
Old    Jeremy Byrom (wakerider111)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-22-2008, 2:48 PM Reply   
ohh yea
and cason, thanx for the update and sharing.

maybe one day i will have a chance(to try the LF flex). Call me biased if you will, but for now i hold my reserves for slingshot all the way ;)
AND for their boots and base plate design too. LOVE IT! makes since to me
Old    Tyler Hildebrand (ty540)      Join Date: Nov 2001       02-22-2008, 3:10 PM Reply   
"yet no pro's on one in any event? interesting again..."

The roam underperforms for most riders in terms in pop, and the complete lack of features on the bottom of the board isn't conducive to contest riding, especially in rough water.

Also, there's no way that slingshot would be willing to pay the amount of money necessary to sign someone like Malinowski or Soven. Their contracts are ridiculous. Thus, saying that slingshot must not be as good because none of these guys ride them in contests just doesn't follow. After ONE YEAR we're already seeing multiple big companies introducing slingshot-style flex boards. I think this is indicative of a trend in the industry. Although they may never catch on for contest riding (but personally, I have no idea why you wouldn't expect them to), almost everyone agrees that they're a ton of fun and offer something different. That's a great thing in my book.
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       02-22-2008, 4:51 PM Reply   
Im not willing to try or buy a Slingshot...becasue no one in Michigan sells the dang thing. I need to know I have a pro shop near buy so I can test it buy it...and if I break it they will take care of me. I did the whole internet ordering thing......too much money tied up in shipping back and forth...and then there is the wait....ugh. I do like the fact that Slingshot is U.S.A made. Just wish they had a bigger and larger network set up. I think they will get there....even Performance has picked them up. Meanwhile I will be riding and continue loving my new 08 Murray board.....sweet!
Old    scott firman (mucktoerider)      Join Date: Jan 2007       02-22-2008, 6:27 PM Reply   
just realized the Byerly Monarch is a flex board. I have nothing but good things about this board. Everyone was raving about it at surfexpo. Plus it checks in at 6.5lbs. The bindings are super light too. Something to look into for sure.
Old    Sean (slax303)      Join Date: Oct 2005       02-22-2008, 6:30 PM Reply   
People need to stop putting the Roam and the Slingshot boards into the same category. Theyre not the same kind of boards. Roam is great for rails and butter, but the Slingshot board is far more than that.

IMO the style flexboards that slingshot has made and LF is beginning to create, could very well be the future. If you havent gotten out and ridden on one yet, do it! I have never taken a board out into the flats and had a softer landing on any board ive been on.

As for the pop, I switched between the Axis and the Recoil all last summer and both performed just about even as far as pop. I might give the Recoil a bit of an edge just because it seemed to pop a little more effortlessly off the lip. I dont know if thats due to the flex or not, its just how it felt. I love Liquid force and thats what I've always ridden, but if the press doesnt wow me when I get back out there, Im probably going to stick with slingshot this summer
Old    Jeremy Byrom (wakerider111)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-23-2008, 10:06 PM Reply   
I just came back from the utah boat show and got to see the press up close and personal.

as far as i could tell it looked and felt a lot as has been described- thicker than the slingshot and a little less flex, but that is just from feeling by hand on the floor. I still hold my reserves for slingshot(for reasons already stated), but i do like the press graphics a little better. given a chance to ride the press, i'll at least give it a chance ;)

note:
I was also a little surprised how Marine Products (biggest watersports dealer in utah) is still trashing on slingshot (and flex in general) when they sell the LF version. one of the reps had the nerve to diss on it to the point that he refused to call it a wakeboard. "hyperlite and other companies did tests on the board and proved that slingshots do exactly opposite of what they claim..." blah blah blah... MP reps crack me up. ;) jealous if you ask me... or maybe prideful... anyway. i am done "venting"
Old    123 (123)      Join Date: Aug 2007       02-24-2008, 7:16 AM Reply   
The monarch is not a flexboard.

It is a PVC Core (atomic core). And is easily one of the stiffest on the market.
Old    Jeremy Byrom (wakerider111)      Join Date: Jul 2006       02-24-2008, 10:39 AM Reply   
123 is right

ohh yea, i saw the monarch at the utah boat show too. Ive always loved byerly's gear and have been wanting to look at it. I don't think i can believe all the rumors of it having flex in the tip and tail anymore... i mean that is exactly what it has been, RUMORS. Giving it a look and a floor/ hand test it doesn't flex any more than some of the other traditional boards that i could tell.

The sub 6 is pretty solid too, though i thought i was able to flex it a bit more than the monarch, but i still would not even consider it in the flex category.

P.S. i am gona have to post some you tube videos of the Utah Boat Show and put links with stories in a thread. Keep a look out for it if your interested ;) hopefully i'll have it up by tonight
Old    wiz            02-24-2008, 3:21 PM Reply   
jermiside----i rode the recoil all year last season, that's how i was able to form my opinion on it. the roam isn't meant to be a w2w board. i have not had a chance to ride the press yet so i dont have an opinion on it. i'm a big fan of slingshot. i have a friend that had an opportunity to get one for free & passed it up for a traditional board setup. after riding mine he regrets his decision. i just suggest trying it out before someone drops cash on the same old thing. if u dont like it, that's cool. if u do, that's cool too. i wasnt trying to piss u off.

(Message edited by wake eater on February 24, 2008)

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