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Old     (tj_in_kc)      Join Date: Jan 2008       01-27-2008, 11:03 AM Reply   
So you may remember a month or so back I was asking for opinions and help before heading to the boat show in deciding between the Malibu vRide, the Moomba Outback V and the Crownline 19SS. Iíve made a purchase, and I wanted to say thanks for all the info and share my research and learning for anyone else that might be interested in comparing contrasting the Outback V and the vRide.

Crownline 19SS
Because I want to wake surf, and the lack of ballast I excluded this boat early. It is a nice well-built boat in my opinion though. I would recommend one to my parents.

My Moomba Outback V Experience

A nice, entry level wakeboarding boat. This boat would get the job done, and if you never had a chance to see and sit in a Malibu vRide this would likely be the boat of your dreams.

After seeing the competition and looking at this boat again a number of things stood out. Firstly, the height of the gunnels is too low. This forces them to set the seating height too low so when you are sitting down your knees have to go somewhere, either stick up in air or forces you to push your feet out farther and stretch your legs. Awkward seating. The seats are also not as soft, supportive, or as thick vinyl material wise.

Technology. When compared to the competition the technology on the Outback V looks about a decade out of date. Now, there is nothing wrong with analog dials. But it is certainly not state of the art by any means.

The Tower. The tower is fine; in fact itís just like everyone elseís and all the aftermarket ones. But itís too heavy and too awkward for one person to take up and down without help in my opinion. Because I have a lift and a standard height dock roof I will be taking the tower up and down every time I come and go. Thatís the only reason I took this so seriously. If you donít have a dock and trailer your boat everywhere, this probably makes no difference, other than which one looks better to you.

The Ballast. This is fine, there are plenty of options. The bags are soft rubber/plastic bags, just like all the after market ones.

The Rear Storage Compartment. This is okay, and again just like most other boats you would see. Doesnít lock.

Price. My idea going in was the Outback V was similar to the vRide, but thousands cheaper. That sounded very appealing to me. Going in I was leaning towards the vRide because I liked the tower, but I didnít think I could get one for what I wanted to spend and would probably end up with the Outback V. Well to make a long story short, that was not what I experienced. I see the ďbest boat show incentivesĒ post on the board here. Thought Iíd point something out on the Moomba pick 4. I thought this was AWESOME. I used their website (which is very neat btw.) to build my own 2008 Outback V. Used the pick 4. Took that with me to the boat show. Well what you may not know is that if you build a boat, and use the pick 4 you are going to pay the MSRP on the build a boat from the site. Those 4 options are your negotiations. They quoted me exactly what the MSRP was on the boat, and wouldnít come down off that if I used the pick 4. I donít know anyone that pays MSRP for a new boat. So, just throwing this out there for your information. With or without the pick 4 youíd probably get about the same deal. Most people I know expect around 10% off the MSRP price or more on a new boat.

The Dealer. The salesman I worked with was nice enough, and very knowledgeable about the boat and about wakeboarding. When I was ready to start talking pricing, a sales manager basically took over. He was okay, but I kind of felt like he was treating me like a child that knew nothing. The way he answered my questions made me feel stupid. Well, I am not that young these days, 27. I have my Bachelor and Masterís degree in Computer Science. I do very well financially. Nuff said.

They also mentioned several times that the building they were in was for sale, and theyíd be moving soon. Where? Well LIKELY out east of Kansas City. I know they were saying this to let me know theyíd be closer to me. Which is cool. But honestly, it made me nervous. I donít like instability in my boat dealer. I want to know the dealer is going to be around forever, and moving around, especially with no answers of exactly where your moving to makes me nervous. The other dealers in KC --Crownline, Malibu, Ebbtide all three of those dealers have been in the same place for like 30 or 40 years. Maybe it makes no difference to most people. But stability makes me feel good about the dealer.

Doug Ė I didnít get to work with Rick, he wasnít there the first time I was talking with them, I spoke with him briefly the second time I went to the boat show, but that was as after Iíd shown my wife and our friends the Moomba, and we were walking away towards the Malibu booth. Iíd already pretty much decided against the Moomba at this point.

Donít take this post the wrong way. Iím Not saying that they arenít a great dealership. I just didnít get that far with them. Thatís all.

My Malibu vRide Experience

The vRide is the other boat I was looking at. Another entry level wakeboarding boat. About the same length/size as the Moomba. In looking at the vRide after spending an hour or so sitting in the Outback V I believe itís a superior boat, really a level higher than the Outback V. Hereís why.

Construction: All around better. Point to anything on the boat. Compare it to the Outback V, and it will be constructed better hands down. Seating is higher, more comfortable, and thicker/higher quality material.

Technology: Absolutely state of the art. Compare it to any other boat on the market, itís as high tech as there is. Everything is computer controlled, computer controlled throttle, more advanced stereo with 1 gig memory, completely digital dash, with tons of computer options to view information about your boat.

Tower: Itís a very neat design, with counter-weighted pulley system. Pull two pins and it comes down. This can be taken up and down by one person. Itís not awkward, itís weight is not unbearable because the pulleys bear much of the weight.

The Ballast: Completely automated just like the competitors. But the ballast is in hard heavy-duty tanks not plastic bags. Tanks have shutoff valves too. Very clean design. Looks professional because the tanks are all covered with carpet and concealed in the rear compartment.

Rear Storage Compartment: About the same as the Outback V. BUT more solid construction. Take a look at the big welded metal framework, itís amazing when compared to the Outback V. The covers have an aluminum honeycomb core which gives them a much more solid feel. Also, the rear compartments LOCK. That is nice when I head into the Marina or Toad Cove to have a drink everything can be locked up.

The wedge: I got the backing plate, but not the actual wedge. Itís not allowed on my lake so it would only get me into trouble. If I want to use it when I head off to another lake I can buy the wedge part for $500 from the dealer, and it installs with 2 bolts. Easy on easy off. As someone with an engineering background Iím not a big fan of it though. Iím sure it works well, but I donít like the idea of 1000+ lbs of stress on my fiberglass transom.

Price: Much more willing to negotiate price. In the end a vRide might only cost you a thousand or two more than the Outback V. It was worth it to me.

The Dealer: Of course it depends on where you live. In my situation (Kansas City, MO) the Malibu dealer has been in business and working in the same building for like 30 or 40 years. Throughout the transaction they always treated me with the up-most respect and like I was a part of the family. I canít say too much more because our relationship is just starting but so far I have been impressed.

Anyways, wanted to provide an update, and hopefully help other newbies looking to get into an entry level wakeboarding boat.

(Message edited by tj_in_kc on January 27, 2008)

(Message edited by tj_in_kc on January 27, 2008)
Old     (greg2)      Join Date: May 2002       01-27-2008, 6:05 PM Reply   
Hope you enjoy the Bu. The V-ride hull was Malibu's flagship wake hull until 2005. You won't be disappointed with the wake.
Old     (westsidarider)      Join Date: Feb 2003       01-27-2008, 6:28 PM Reply   
congrats. excellent choice. you cant go wronf when buying a malibu. im sure you will have many years of enjoyment from that boat.
Old     (tpj)      Join Date: Sep 2007       01-27-2008, 6:28 PM Reply   
thanks for the great's very informative and should help people narrowing down their options on a new boat.

and congrats...thats a sweet boat
Old     (hamkj)      Join Date: Apr 2002       01-27-2008, 8:53 PM Reply   
I would have gone with Moomba LSV with Gravity Games Ballast.

vRide... great boat!
Old     (sanger)      Join Date: May 2002       01-27-2008, 9:07 PM Reply   
Great experience, thanks.
Old     (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       01-27-2008, 10:45 PM Reply   
"I would have gone with Moomba LSV with Gravity Games Ballast. "

One of the alltime greatest posts I've seen. Thanks for that
Old     (tj_in_kc)      Join Date: Jan 2008       01-28-2008, 10:54 AM Reply   
LSV wasn't an option for me. Neither was MC or Tige. Their boats are too big, and too heavy for my private lake.

21ft max
3100lb max
Old     (houdini)      Join Date: Aug 2005       01-28-2008, 11:45 AM Reply   
you will be very pleased with the vride - i had the same type of situation a year ago. i decided on the vride and the thing rides, looks and handles like a dream. i have no regrets about it!
Good Choice!!
Old     (jbarber3orange)      Join Date: Aug 2007       01-28-2008, 1:25 PM Reply   
Is the backing plate like a wake plate / trim tab? We're looking at Malibu's and I don't like the idea of the wedge either.
Old     (tj_in_kc)      Join Date: Jan 2008       01-28-2008, 1:32 PM Reply   

No, it's not like a wake plate. It's not an adjustable thing. It's just a stainless steel plating that the wedge attaches too. If you disconnect the wedge, there is nothing hanging down, just the stainless/chrome looking plate on the back.

The wedge from Malibu is the only device of it's kind; from what i understand it does a heck of a job creating a larger wake. If you are that good and you need a wake that big it's probably worth it. I'm NOT that good, so i don't need the extra wake. And i don't like the idea of that much pressure/stress on the structural integrity of the boat.

i have not seen any research to back this up. Just my thoughts....
Old     (wakeboardnut)      Join Date: Jul 2006       01-28-2008, 4:35 PM Reply   
hey TJ,

sent you an private msg, just checking to see if you got it?


Old     (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-28-2008, 5:33 PM Reply   
"The wedge from Malibu is the only device of it's kind"
Not so much

The Switch blade is an option on Centurions
Old     (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       01-28-2008, 5:42 PM Reply   
Every good invention has it's imitators.

I like how they are going like 12mph when they have the "switchblade" deployed to show the big wake...
Old     (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-28-2008, 5:49 PM Reply   
I agree the Power wedge is a great imitator of the Switchblade.
12 MPH where did you get that
Old     (wakeboardnut)      Join Date: Jul 2006       01-28-2008, 5:55 PM Reply   
lol, knock it off guys. that isn't what this thread is about
Old     (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       01-28-2008, 5:57 PM Reply   
That's just what it looks like to me. There is definetely a noticeable speed difference there watch it again.

Yes sir chase
Old     (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-28-2008, 5:59 PM Reply   
Ok your right Party pooper

tj (tj_in_kc) Nice post on your experience!
Old     (steedracer)      Join Date: Jul 2007       01-28-2008, 6:00 PM Reply   
TJ, out of curiosity, did you check out the new Centurion Falcon V? I'm not sure if Centurion has a dealer in KC, but the boat is priced right, has a lot of what you were looking for and has a lot of features that blow the Moomba away. Just curious, that's all. V-ride has always been a great boarder's boat.

Regarding the switchblade, did I read where they are working on a newer, smaller model?
Old     (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       01-28-2008, 6:01 PM Reply   
to funny...
Old     (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-28-2008, 6:10 PM Reply   
I have been in Several Centurions with the Switchblade that is exactlly how it looks when you adjust them speed was 22 or so MPH

Ok Ok This is my last post I can't help myself

(Message edited by krbaugh on January 28, 2008)
Old     (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       01-28-2008, 6:18 PM Reply   
Right Kevin and the wake was curling right behind the swim platform. Ok put down the magic coolaid...
Old     (wakeboardnut)      Join Date: Jul 2006       01-28-2008, 6:22 PM Reply   
lol it does start out slow, but it speeds up
Old     (krbaugh)      Join Date: Mar 2002       01-28-2008, 6:26 PM Reply   
So you have not been in many Centurions with the Switchblade but that ok
Sorry that is what happens even when the boat is unbalanced the more the Swichblade is deployed the more it balances the wake. Plus when it is set to Negative it is lifting the back of the boat and pushing down the nose.

(Message edited by krbaugh on January 28, 2008)
Old     (tj_in_kc)      Join Date: Jan 2008       01-28-2008, 6:50 PM Reply   

You are right the Falcon V does look pretty awesome. I did consider this, yet only briefly as it's weight is 3700lbs+

Max dry weight on my private lake is 3100lbs.

ALSO -- Don't ever take what i say as being expert opinion. I am a fairly educated person, but certainly not any kind of wakeboard expert. I had never heard of the Switchblade before this. It was my understanding that Malibu had a patent on the wedge type technology, but obviously i was wrong....
Old     (tj_in_kc)      Join Date: Jan 2008       01-28-2008, 6:52 PM Reply   
Chase, I replied to your email, using the address on your profile...
Old     (wakeboardnut)      Join Date: Jul 2006       01-28-2008, 8:17 PM Reply   
thanks TJ, but im not sure if it went through as i havent recieved an email with it yet.

did you use the private messsage?
Old     (kingfish2wkbrd)      Join Date: Dec 2006       02-05-2008, 9:09 AM Reply   
As a former Malibu owner and now Supra owner (same company makes both Moomba and Supra) I couldnít help but respond. As Iím reading through your reasons for buying the Malibu it seems to me that you are trying to justify your purchase. You are naming similarities as reasons for buying the Malibu over the Moomba. For example, both boats use similar construction techniques including honeycomb aluminum rear decking, heavy weight vinyl, digital throttle control, etc.

You mentioned the towerÖ anyone know of a cable assist inside the tower on the Illusion X? I canít find this feature anywhere on the Malibu web site. TJ, I would make sure the dealer shows you how to use it vs. the standard towerÖ sounds like a marketing gimmick to me, or a flat out fib by the dealer.

You also pointed out how much you liked the Moomba L4 warranty, but went with an inferior Malibu warranty. Iím confused on that logic.

Finally, you mentioned the dealer. Iím not in to bashing on people, as I have helped the local Malibu dealer at shows, etc. in the past. Iíll just say this and let you draw your own conclusionsÖ I had a Malibu VLX on order in 2005, but by the time it was all doneÖ I bought a Supra. It was and still is the dealer that made the difference. Oh, did I mention I live in Smithville.

Malibu has an older building and a location thatís not convenient to any lake other than Smithville, remember I live there. They have a 4 bay shop which is why they have such long lead times on repairs. It took me like 6 weeks to get the fins on the bottom of my boat reattached (I didnít hit anything, and there was a pool of oil in the bottom of the boat. Malibu had always done the service, HMM?) Oh, believe me you will need something fixed this summer.

Xtreme Marine is currently in a large building with double the service bays. They have a large well lit showroom so you can pick through a boat in plain view. Will Xtreme Marine be movingÖ probably. Is it because of stability, no. Is it because they want to provide the best most convenient customer experience, yes. Will they be moving closer to you, yes.

Iím not sure who you spoke with at Xtreme Marine, but Iím sure they didnít intend to treat you as anything less than a smart person, as evidenced by your numerous degrees and financial standing.

Facts are facts, if you want an entry level towboat get a Moomba. You can option one up as much as you want or can afford. If you want a loaded boat, buy a Supra.

If you didnít buy a Moomba because the gunwales are a few inches shorter and the seats sit lower I get that. But youíre kinda bashing on my dealer, Xtreme Marine, even though you said you arenít. Dollar for dollar the Moomba is the best boat for the money.

Have fun this summer in your new boat. Hopefully we will cross paths and do some surfing together.

Good Luck
Old     (curtisco24)      Join Date: Dec 2005       02-05-2008, 9:21 AM Reply   
the malibu does have a cable system in the illusion.
Old     (kingfish2wkbrd)      Join Date: Dec 2006       02-05-2008, 9:23 AM Reply   
how does it work? Is it functional or just a gimmic?
Old     (dan_k)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-05-2008, 9:58 AM Reply   
TK i have the illusion x and it does have a cable in it but it doesnt help the weight of still takes two people to take down which sucks because i was told that its spring loaded when we bought it. can anyone explain this?
Old     (tj_in_kc)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-05-2008, 12:31 PM Reply   
Tim. I know you work at Moomba; you were the salesman i was working with. Believe me the decision had nothing to do with you, you were great. I mention how knowledgeable you were in the post.

As for the rest of your post, just read mine again man. I'm not bashing your dealership. I don't mention the name or say a single thing that's not a direct result of my personal experience.

You guys did mention you were moving several times. Where? Didn't say; only that it would be out by me (East of KC). I'm not accusing your dealership of anything. Closing a dealership, changing owners and making statements that your current location is for sale and you will be moving is less than stability to me. Again, Iím not making any implications as to why you are doing this or assuming anything. I didnít say you werenít financially stable. No, I said stable as in some one that stays in the same place and does things the same way for a long period of time. A guy that is in a relationship with the same girl for a long time is stable. A guy that has a different smoking hot girl every few months is not stable. Not saying ones right, ones not. I prefer stability in my dealership. Most of the other dealers in my area (Malibu, Ebbtide, and Crownline) have been in the same location for 30+ years. At the boat show nothing more was shared with me other than you were going to be moving in the near future.

The rest of the post is what it is; a comparison between the two boats. I narrowed my choices to those two boats. I went to the boat show and spent and hour or more in each boat.

Iím not trying to justify anything. They both had a 50-50 shot going into the boat show. I outlined what made me pick the Malibu over the Moomba.

I'm not an expert on boats; this is my first one in fact. If i made a statement about a certain component on the Malibu being better than the Moomba, when in fact that component is the same that means the Malibu dealer explained it to me and the Moomba dealer did not. There is no malicious intent to my post.

Remember this post is my personal experience. I am not in the boating industry; I am in no way affiliated with anyone that is. This is my personal experience buying my first boat.

The topic title is comparing and contrasting the three models, that's exactly what it is based on my experience, nothing more nothing less.
Old     (05mobiuslsv)      Join Date: Apr 2006       02-05-2008, 1:16 PM Reply   
Tj don't worry your posts have been fine, nothing more than your own experience and very unbiased. You chose the boat you liked the best and that's all that matters. Tk yes the illusion tower has a spring loaded cable assist to help with lowering that heavy @ss tower. I will say however that loaded up the illusion is still easier to lower than the one on my old Moomba that is a fact.
Old     (mikerod29)      Join Date: Dec 2002       02-05-2008, 1:26 PM Reply   
I was told when I was looking, and also was shown how to, that you can crank down the spring a little to increase tension and offset some of the added weight from stuff installed on the tower. And TJ don't worry about it, your posts have all been great, and super positive. It is most likely a very informative post for somebody who is looking at similar or the same boats.
Old     (kingfish2wkbrd)      Join Date: Dec 2006       02-05-2008, 1:30 PM Reply   
Illusion Tower - the Supra/Moomba tower isn't easy until you make a support to hold it up while you detach the legs, or have a second set of hands. Let's face it... any tower with speakers, light, racks, etc. is gonna be rough at best to get down.

TJ the beauty of these types of message boards is we all get to interpret and respond as we feel necessary within the rules and hopefully our own ethics. I can only account for my own buying experience in '05. Such a positive one from Xtreme Marine that when asked to come work for them I did. As a matter of fact, one owner is a customer and the others have worked here for quite sometime. It really make this a nice family atmosphere.

Hopefully we can assist you with other needs in the future... new surf board!! Rope!! Seriously though, congrats.
Old     (dan_k)      Join Date: Sep 2007       02-05-2008, 2:53 PM Reply   
thanks alot ill look at the tower next time and see what i can do .
Old     (tj_in_kc)      Join Date: Jan 2008       02-05-2008, 3:41 PM Reply   

Here is an article from WakeWorld on the tower discussing the adjustable tension system. Text is next to the 4th picture down on the page.


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