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-   -   Beginner Riders & Advanced Boards (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=794925)

lseghatch 08-06-2012 1:12 PM

Beginner Riders & Advanced Boards
 
I ride with some local guys one of whom is a beginner rider and was previously riding a Hyperlite Era board and progressing quite well. Just last month he decided to purchase a CWB DB9 due to it having good pop and figured it would make him ride better.

Fast forward to past couple weeks and he's been riding worse and not been able to get the edging down on the new deck. He ends every ride pissed off but won't just go back to his old Era because he see's it as "admitting defeat".

When I started riding I went from a beginner board, to intermediate, to my ss recoil. I told him he should do the same but is dead set on this board improving his riding when it's clear it is hindering is progression.

Anyone else encounter beginners believing an advanced board will help them get better?

TheHebrewHammer 08-06-2012 1:18 PM

I think the problem is that the DB9 is different, not that it's harder. It isn't a particularly aggressive shape and it's not difficult to ride. Lots of people think a better board will make them ride better. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't. But "advanced" boards aren't necessarily harder to ride.

boardjnky4 08-06-2012 1:18 PM

As a beginner who rides a more advanced board, I'll give my point of view. When I purchased my board, I didn't buy it because I thought it would make me better.

I hadn't really owned any serious board prior to buying the LF Deluxe Hybrid.

It definitely took one or two sets to get used to edging on the flex board, but I don't/didn't really see it as a big deal. I feel that my riding has improved since getting the new board, but I don't attribute that to the board but to my natural learning progression.

There is a lot of value to learning how to edge correctly on a loose board. A lot of boards do the work for you, but it's definitely a little bit of a crutch.

JoLo_Si 08-06-2012 2:08 PM

I had a really hard time trying to go from a CWB Kink to the Ronix One but I wanted the board sooo bad. Then I forgot it and rode a friends LF Witness, which I would consider intermediate even though many pros still ride it (Benny G obviously, as well as Amber Wing but she calls it the Jet).

I learned my lesson quickly, demo = happy rider because no matter what they call the board it mostly boils down to the rider style. I eventually learned to ride the One just fine but I like my Witness better.

wakerider111 08-06-2012 3:11 PM

The DB9 is just a fancier core of the faction which is a board designed for most everyone (skill wise but maybe not style wise)

the hyperlite era used to be Eric Ruck's board of choice, so in a sense it is, was a pro model board.

Also, many of the "beginner boards" are previous pro model boards from within the last 5 years or so.

As has been suggested the problem is more that the board is just different... almost opposite in every significant determining way even!
1.) Rocker is different: Hyperlite era has a three stage rocker and the DB9 a continuous
2.) Bottom features are different: Hyperlite Era has some fairly pronounced bottom features. there are the molded in fins, center channel running the length of the board. The DB9 has a very clean bottom with only a large center spine.
3.) Rails are different: Hyperlite Era i believe has sharper overal rails than the DB9 which has quite an exaggerated bevel between the feet in comparison. the rail at the tips for each of the boards is very different too. Edging will be very different from board to board. the center spine on the CWB DB9 will give the board different edge feel because it creates kind of a pivot point under the board
4.) Core is different: in this case the core is not a flex core, so it wont be an opposite scenario here, but still different
5.) Fins: 2 bolt on fins and 4 molded fins on the Era vs 4 bolt on fins on the DB9. if your friend was using the center bolt on fins on the era previously then this will be a big change.

Your friend is going to have to just get used to it, or admit that the style is too different and move on. True, "it is the carpenter and not the tools" however, every carpenter has a preference and certain tools help to to emphasize their style.

SOME THINGS TO CHECK AND TRY:
1.) Check the binding bolts and setup. assuming the boots are the same check to make sure the stance is the same as before. check to make sure the bolts are snug to the binding plate and there is no movement. switching boots to a different board sometimes requires washers because the bolt depths don't match up.
2.) Check the fins that they are tight. you would be amazed how a slightly loose slightly wobbly fin will totally screw up your ride. I had a day once where riding was terrible. and when the person in the boat grabbed my board to pull it in they noticed the fin moved when they grabbed the board from it to pull it into the boat. The DB9 has 4 bolt on fins and it will be even more crucial to ensure the fins are ready to go than with the Era.
3.) Maybe try different sized fins if available. I am willing to bet that the DB9 is looser board than the Era so you might try larger fins.
4.) Maybe try riding a set where your friend just carves around and surfs the wake just play around with the edging of the board and experiment, but make it fun... or just whatever feels good. find something he likes about the board and build on that. if the board is indeed much looser than expected then try doing some power slides and butter slides to take advantage of that.
5.) maybe reviewing some fundamentals is in order, go back to the basics... this can be done with 4.) above

dezul 08-06-2012 4:04 PM

I completely agree with the post above.

lseghatch 08-06-2012 4:49 PM

Thanks guys I'll relay the suggestions. I can attest to the riding style aspect as I used to ride a LF Lyman. I took it out one day after riding my Recoil for 3 years and I could not ride the Lyman to save my life yet was my favorite board when I used to ride it back in the day. Will never go back to molded fins and zero flex.

axeman 08-06-2012 6:18 PM

I started out with an 07 Hyperlite State 140 back in 09. That is a beginner board no matter which way you look at it. Within the first couple of times out I took out the center fins (it has molded fins). This year I upgraded to the Ronix One. World of a difference. I was able to ride it and feel comfortable first time out. I don't necessarily think it was the board though. I grew up surfing (not wakesurfing) and I think the State was too grippy. The One has a looser feel to it and it makes me feel right at home!

nickdakoolkat 08-06-2012 6:40 PM

I am by no means an advanced rider, I'd love to be able to push myself but I need my body for work, I digress from my point. I used to jump on a new promodel every year when I was younger. Some of them I liked, some I rode like **** on (ie parks promodel, byerly hammerhead looking board). I rode a Watson eventually and thought I loved it, until I rode a slingshot recoil...I don't know if it's "advanced" or not but I've been riding the same board for 3 years and I feel as comfortable as I have ever felt on a board. I think the important thing to realize is the board will not make you a better rider, but certain boards will make you more comfortable depending on your size, style, and abilities. There no shame in going back to a board you love. I do know it sucks to spend a lot of hard earned money on a piece of equipment that you expect to love, but it ends up not suiting you very well. I actually sold two boards on here when I didn't like them and recouped a lot of my money so no harm done.

baitkiller 08-06-2012 8:31 PM

The first board I ever rode was an '09 Transcend. I still own it and love the way it rides. My progression has been fairly steady for a senior citizen. Many would call it advanced. i found it easy to ride right out of the crate. I have been studying that Slingshot thread though in the evenings as I ice my knee. Softer landings they all claim.

Readyaimfire 08-07-2012 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baitkiller (Post 1773957)
The first board I ever rode was an '09 Transcend. I still own it and love the way it rides. My progression has been fairly steady for a senior citizen. Many would call it advanced. i found it easy to ride right out of the crate. I have been studying that Slingshot thread though in the evenings as I ice my knee. Softer landings they all claim.

As far as the slingshots go, fun boards, but way overhyped as far as the soft landings go. They land nice, but it's not that different in my opinion.

kristian 08-07-2012 12:42 AM

Axel: I love the state! The 2005 145 is still one of my fave boards. Learned 7's and a whole bunch of other stuff on it..... but never got along with the One..... example of the "beginner" stamp isn't always the case.

I've ridden most boards on the market and even helped design a few (taken a couple years off now to sort out my body so haven't ridden the newest shapes), but some pro's want features in their boards that work really well with the majority of beginners and some want something that takes better foundations skills to make the most of it.

You should never give up on a board (or features of a board) that work with your riding style just because someone has deemed it "beginner". Always experiment and demo and pick what's best for you .........and branding should be taken with a grain of salt. (take that from the guy who currently works part time for a branding agent)

Personally I ride a Ronix pheonix with no fins, even behind the boat, and it works for me.

Tyler, don't think anyone could state it better than Jeremy but the Era and DB9 are just so different! If you're friend wants a "Pro-Model" look for something with similar features, the Era seems to work for him. If you want to stick with CWB maybe look at Adkinsons board?

HighWater 08-07-2012 8:35 AM

I rode an ERA last year, got off that tank and jumped on Ronix Bill this year. Ronix boards are feather light. Just keep a pack of extra fins if you run the .8 as they break easily.

tahoeguy7 08-07-2012 10:30 AM

If you don't have a chance to demo boards, buying a new stick can be frustrating. I was riding a 2006 Premier a couple of years ago and thought the Byerly Assault would be a good upgrade. However, I could never get comfortable on it so I ended up getting rid of it.

I don't think it really matters if a board is considered "pro" or "advanced." It is all about how that board fits your riding style.

The Era is a great shape, and it was around for a long time in the Hyperlite line. The basic shape started out as the 2002 Premier, which was Danny Harf's pro model.

axeman 08-07-2012 1:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kristian (Post 1773980)
Axel: I love the state! The 2005 145 is still one of my fave boards. Learned 7's and a whole bunch of other stuff on it..... but never got along with the One..... example of the "beginner" stamp isn't always the case.

Let me be more clear in my statement. It is a beginner board in the fact that it is meant to edge fairly easily and tracks really well. That isn't a good thing or a bad thing. Just a matter of personal preference. IMO, a looser board tends to be more forgiving (coming from a true surf background). I also like my One a lot more as it is a lot lighter than the State. Another thing to keep in mind are bindings. My Ronix One bindings make me feel way more connected to my board than my CWB Factions ever did.

wakerider111 08-07-2012 2:06 PM

isn't the hyperlite state a asymmetrical board too? i have never been a fan of the idea of those boards... at least not for more than one season. just don't like the idea of someone getting used to a board that responds differently toe vs. heel. but i know they work for some people to get them started wakeboarding quicker... so what do i know

icantride 08-08-2012 7:14 AM

When I first started riding, I was on a Hyperlite Premier, and thought that if I bot new more advanced board my pop would improve so I bot a Hyperlite Parks (this was a long time ago). When riding the Parks board my pop def improved, but, then if i rode any other board my pop sucked. Turned out I was not ready for the parks board, because I really didn't know how to edge properly! My pop on the Parks board was better because of the aggressive 3-stage rocker. I sold the Parks and went back to the Premier and learned how to edge properly!!

Readyaimfire 08-08-2012 3:21 PM

I still ride a hyperlite motive 144 about 50% of the time. I have multiple spins and inverts under my belt. Don't get caught up in the marketing hype. Just ride what you ride best on.

dezul 08-08-2012 5:27 PM

I agree. Sometimes it is good to upgrade, but others just progress on what you got. I have had the same snowboard for years and still love it. Everytime I try another board, it makes me love my board more.

I did however get a chance to try some newer wakeboards this year compared to my 07 Vault, I prefer the newer ones. They were the Watson Classic (my favorite) and the Shane Hybrid (fun to play on). I really think it comes down to what you like.

rplogue7 08-08-2012 7:32 PM

I do have a friend who rode a beginner board and switched to a ronix parks... He has been going bigger since he got that board


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