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-   -   Looking at a 2013 F21 and the A22 (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=794176)

seangriswold 06-27-2012 5:38 PM

Looking at a 2013 F21 and the A22
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I am opening up a can of worms here.. and I have viewed some older posts comparing the F21 to the A22 but figured I would throw this out there... I have an 06 MB B52 23 that I got new in 06 and have been thrilled with the boat! I have been considering selling mine or trading it in on a new boat since rates are good and the market for a used V-drive is not too shabby!

I demo'd a 21tomcat and have been riding behind a freinds 2010 A22. I checked out the new A22's at the dealer and the fit and finish has definitely gotten much better...not that it was ever bad. IMO these are both great boats. My debate is that perhaps my riding style fits the rampier wake of an Axis a little better than it does my MB.. With that being said I do think the F21 has a rampier wake when compared to my 06 B52...

The first pic posted is with full ballast quarter tank of gas and 2 people in the boat at 22.5. The second is at 19.5 and little to no ballast.

Thoughts on the variation of the wakes? I am aware of the pros and cons of both boats. At this point the A22 looks to be more expensive. I also run into the issue of selling my boat on my own or trading it in. In the past I have gone with the trade because it is much easier than trying to set up demo's and sell a boat on my own... Anyway I am done rambling on and I appreaciate all the thoughts and experiences everyone has had with these whips!

downfortheride 06-27-2012 8:49 PM

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My wake (MB F21) seems to have a great transition to a sick ass lip to throw ya off the top... Here's full ballast with 450 in the nose, 1/2 tank of gas, and 5 adults...
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imondi 06-27-2012 10:33 PM

I own an a22 and was lucky enough to ride 2 different f21s this last weekend! Thanks again Dftr josh and Dustin! I can honestly say one boat is not better than the other, but they are very different! The axis is much more rampy and the mb is steeper. The gravity feed ballast system on the mb is faster, but the PnP makes it easy to add a TON of weight if that's what you want. The mb interior feels more plush and the axis has more of a raw feel. The trim plate makes getting on plane in the mb much faster, but the wedge gives the option for a steeper wake.

You will not be disappointed in either boat! You are going to land the same tricks you already have behind either boat. I LOVE my A22 and I LOVED the F21s. I did the same run behind both boats.

Demo both and pick a favorite! Or just pick whichever boat you get a better deal on! If you get one of these 2 boats, you win either way!

If you have questions about specifics, just ask!

diamonddad 06-27-2012 11:42 PM

Awesome post Victor!

chattwake 06-28-2012 6:51 AM

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I have no experience with the mb, but I love my A22. I've owned a bunch of boats and ridden behind a bunch of boats, and I can say that I like the wake behind the A22 the best out of any boat I've ridden behind. By that, I mean the wake suits my riding style the best - I like a wake with a nice transition to give my old knees some cushion on landings and a firm lip to huck me up instead of out into the flats - and the wake is not finiky at all. In slight wind chop, it doesn't wash, at slow speeds (19-21mph) it doesn't wash, if someone grabs a beer out of the cooler, it doesn't wash. My previous boat had a wake that was tempermental when extra ballast was added and we didn't speed way up.

Here are some pictures of the wake behind my old A22 with 3 people in the boat, wedge down, about 700lbs in each rear hatch, factory ballast and the front pnp bag full (I've ridden with about 1k in each hatch and a 900lb bow sac in the nose in addition to this setup and the wake just gets bigger):

chattwake 06-28-2012 6:59 AM

Oh, and my boat came with the high flow ballast setup that will be offered on the new '13 axis boats, and I can tell you it made a world of difference in terms of filling and dumping all of the weight I put in my boat. No, it's not nearly as fast as pure vert, but I can add weight to the front of my boat without having to pull out the external pumps.

chattwake 06-28-2012 7:00 AM

PS, in the third shot the wake on the landing looks washy, becase we were riding doubles at the time. You can see the spray from the other rider as he is cutting out on the non-landing side. The wake usually stays 100% clean on both sides, even when the boat is slammed with weight.

chattwake 06-28-2012 7:04 AM

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With the new platform, the A22 also produces a surf wake that is pretty dang nice. Here's a shot from last weekend behind my A22. We just dropped the wedge, filled the front sac about 70%, and the surf side rear+ plug n play bag. We only had a few folks on the boat at the time. With extra weight, the wave gets even bigger. Notice that this picture was taken by me while driving straight, from inside the boat, so there's no funny angle making the wave look ginormous or anything.

ScottR 06-28-2012 8:43 AM

Time to drop the rope! You really can't go wrong with those boats...have a great time deciding!

downfortheride 06-28-2012 8:57 AM

Chat is the right person to post up also... Seems he has his boat dialed and man I want a taste of that wake. My only ride behind the Axis was stock with the wedge and of course it wasn't for me as with my MB I do like a little more than stock weight. Good work on the pics Chat!
I agree with Scott... Have a good time deciding!

chattwake 06-28-2012 9:11 AM

Haha, that's my friend blake. He had just gotten up. I'm finally getting consistent throwing 3's w/o the rope with that big board. I love riding that monster. I've ridden w/o the rope with a girl on my shoulders, with a girl standing on the front of the board, with my kid sitting on the board, etc.

seangriswold 06-28-2012 9:14 AM

Great posts! Chat the wake looks sick and I like to idea of a soft landing because it seems my knees ache more and more each year! It will probably come down to where I can get the best deal. They are both really great boats.

ScottR 06-28-2012 9:16 AM

Chatt - Girl on shoulders....interesting, depending on which way she was sitting!! I do that (surf) with my kids all the time, they love it. With my MB Widebody (shameful plug I know) we have ridden this year without the rope with my 6 year old niece, my 6 year old daughter and my 4 year old son. Just sit back there cruisin on the wake. So much fun. May tell my wife to try the shoulder thing, but only if she is facing backwards...HA

seangriswold 06-28-2012 9:16 AM

p.s. It is nice to know we can still have civilized threads on WW :) Guys who love the sport with tons of knowledge and experience to share with all!

501s 06-28-2012 9:37 AM

Its civilized cause its an Axis/MB thread....kidding. Both boats are awesome. I am looking forward to riding an A22 this year, and there is a nice Vandall edition on my lake now so I will have to make friends! I don't know if I will get a chance to ride an MB though. My buddy was looking at both of these boats too (along with a Mojo) and he ended up with the Mojo mostly because of the dealer. I think any of these boats will be everything an owner could want/need.

chattwake 06-28-2012 9:44 AM


<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/gszNwDXd3UE" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

TParke 06-28-2012 10:25 AM


Originally Posted by seangriswold (Post 1763543)
Great posts! Chat the wake looks sick and I like to idea of a soft landing because it seems my knees ache more and more each year! It will probably come down to where I can get the best deal. They are both really great boats.

I also have the same problem with getting older every year. A few weeks ago my buddy picked up a new Slingshot Reflex. The board has been heaven. I can not believe how soft it lands. My wife is not very happy though I just bought the Harley and now I am always riding his board. We had the decision to make last year also and decided to go with the Axis. All I can say is I don't regret it. Today we went out. I have 3 Boys who like to ride ages 6,8,10. I can pull my youngest at 17.0 With a clean lip on one side if I keep a slight turn in. The other two ride at 19.0 and 19.6 with the wedge down and it is perfect for them. It is easy to change the wake with the wedge back in forth. The few little problems we have had the service and warranty were awesome.

chattwake 06-28-2012 11:17 AM

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Chatt - Girl on shoulders....interesting, depending on which way she was sitting!!
Hahaha - well, considering this was my friend's girlfriend, and not my wife, she was sitting the on my shoulders. I know it's the worst photo ever, but pics or it didn't happen, right?

chattwake 06-28-2012 11:20 AM

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Double surfing, double beer chugging!

ScottR 06-28-2012 11:22 AM

Impressive !! Try it the other way next time....harder for you cuz you can't see, more fun for her! aaahhhhhh I tease, I kid!!! No way I could do that with someone up there, very very impressive my friend.

ScottR 06-28-2012 11:23 AM

Hyperlite landlock? That is what we do double surfing on....large board and my 6 year old is tiny anyway.

chattwake 06-28-2012 11:41 AM

Liquid Force venture 5'6

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