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-   -   Sanger V215 Questions... (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=775395)

ryanw209 02-16-2010 10:42 PM

Picked up a 2006 Sanger V215 last summer as my first boat and I have a few questions. I need to change the water impeller and don't really want to pay $250 for my local shop to change it. It has the Black Scorpion 5.7L(I think) 330hp engine. Is there any good how-to write ups on this anywhere? Part numbers? Any advice will be greatly appreciated. <BR> <BR>Also wondering if anyone is running the Fly-high 50x20x20 750's in the rear. I would like to upgrade but these seem a little big for the back compartments and I haven't been able to get out to my boat to measure. <BR> <BR>Thanks!! <BR>Ryan

justintime 02-17-2010 12:19 AM

You will need a 9/16 long socket to make life e-z and a 10mm for the water pump bolts <BR> <BR>You remove the fuel filter bracket with 1/2" sockets <BR>when that drops out of the way, remove the 2 cooling hose clamps <BR> <BR>then drop the serpentine belt, a 5/8 and 9/16 nut and lag <BR> <BR>then remove the 9/16 bracket bolts <BR> <BR>if you have the air drain system, thats another fun thing to do <BR> <BR>if you need the manual, just email me i have them <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/775406.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/775407.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/775408.jpg" alt="Upload">

justcoz5 02-17-2010 12:21 AM

Changed my impeller once, was a pain in the ass because it is in a tough position. I know people on here know how to explain it better, I will say it is worth the pain in the ass to save $250. I paid the first time, and will never again.

justintime 02-17-2010 12:33 AM

yes very tight <BR> <BR>try doing it on avalanches with the ballast tanks!! <BR> <BR>thats why they charge 250! <BR> <BR>post the serial number of motor and i can post up merc numbers for you

ryanw209 02-17-2010 6:19 AM

That will help a ton Just-in-time! I'll get the serial number for you on saturday when I take it out. Do I need to get new gaskets for putting it all back together or just the impeller?

rio_sanger 02-17-2010 6:37 AM

The gasket usually comes with a new impeller kit.

h20king 02-17-2010 6:38 AM

don't remember what year mercruiser changed from a plastic pump housing to a metal one but if the boat has the plastic pump I highly recommend a change to the jabsco brass pump housing the plastic ones are junk and become brittle and crack over time.also to drop the belt you need a 5/8 and a 5/16 I have never had to remove the fuel filter bracket.once belt is dropped remove hose and un bolt pump from bracket and remove.also a trick I use when assembling pump is coat inside of pump with white lithium grease before installing impeller also use some emblem glue to hold o ring in place in the grove.if you install a sea strainer between the water intake and v drive and change impeller every two years need it or not you will never have a problem

dave27 02-17-2010 7:44 AM

<a href="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/774585.html?1266372538" target="_blank">http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/774585.html?1266372538</a> <BR> <BR>Ryan, Look at my thread here. I am currently changing over my hard tanks to the 750lbs bags <BR> <BR>Dave

justintime 02-17-2010 11:27 AM

you get the impeller o ring with the kit <BR> <BR>no grease on the impeller!!! <BR> <BR>use just soap <BR> <BR>I drop the fuel bracket so i can e-z pull the pump out <BR> <BR>some mufflers get in the way on some boats

ryanw209 02-17-2010 11:29 AM

What kind of soap? Dishsoap? Do I just coat the inside of the pump housing? <BR>Thanks Dave. I'll follow your thread so I can see the outcome! <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>(Message edited by ryanw209 on February 17, 2010)

stephan 02-17-2010 11:50 AM

It is a bitch of a project, they are tight but it is totally worth doing yourself. Once you do it the first time it gets easier. One recommendation, buy a second impeller and keep it in the glove box with the tools to change it out on the water. Our Mastercraft shreds the impellers and we been stuck in the middle of a lonely winter lake and having that saved me from a very crappy day.

02-17-2010 12:36 PM

Hey JUST-IN-TIME do you have the service manual and parts manual for Tow sports 5.7MPI OW696691 <BR>and the Walter V Drive RV26D

justintime 02-17-2010 5:09 PM

most of them are on iboats.com, under sterndrive, then under the adults only link <BR> <BR><a href="http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=288430" target="_blank">http://forums.iboats.com/showthread.php?t=288430</a>

ottog1979 02-17-2010 5:58 PM

C, <BR> <BR>I have both manuals. PM me and I'll e-mail them to you. <BR> <BR>Andy

h20king 02-17-2010 6:41 PM

just in time i have all the manuals as well .why do you say no grease white lithium is water soluble and since this is wake world most mufflers are mounted above the pump guess we could go back and forth all day as we don't agree on a lot of things <a href="http://www.gonyeasmarine.com" target="_blank">www.gonyeasmarine.com</a>

mrbigwake 02-18-2010 7:38 PM

The manufactures give you a broken down GLYCERIN <BR>formula with a lot of new impellers(makes it a lot easier!). <BR>Glycerin is the main substance in ky jelly... hence the misconception that petroleum jelly would work,but there not the same. Vaseline does break down rubber, specifically latex. (not sure how much latex in the impeller?) other rubbers not so much. (hence some peoples harsh feelings on using it) but I am thinking that you would need to change your impeller (according to your maintenance schedule) prior to seeing any actual side effects from the Vaseline.

rio_sanger 02-18-2010 8:14 PM

A little saliva seems to work fine for me...

baitkiller 02-19-2010 6:49 AM

I always use dish soap for impellers. <BR> <BR>Amsoil full synthetic grease is OK to use as well. I use it on O rings for assembly with no deterioration. <BR> <BR>But for impellers I use only dish soap. <BR> <BR>Never seize is fine in sweet water. Get near my sea water boats with it and I'll give you a nasty bruise. <BR> <BR>For water proof grease like stern drive shafts nothing is better than good old OMC Triple Guard. <BR> <BR>On a side note when installing a new complete pump it is a good idea to open it up and check the impeller. Sometimes parts sit on shelves for years. Just because it's new doesn't mean didly squat.

black_ops_09 02-20-2010 10:25 AM

Thats good on the impeller I am looking to do mine here soon. I have a 2009 V215, it should be about the same right? Just in time good info. any manuals on that engine?

ghostrider_2 02-20-2010 1:49 PM

never paid more than $80 a year to have mine done every year. So until I see a price change its not worth my time.

ryanw209 02-20-2010 5:58 PM

Where do you get yours done kenny? I might be willing to tow it to Manteca to save me the hassle

rio_sanger 02-20-2010 6:16 PM

It's about a one hour job for me. The impeller costs around $30.00, I'd rather spend the saved $50.00 on beer

ghostrider_2 02-20-2010 8:56 PM

That I what paid in Sac ad Whidbey Island,not in Manteca.

ryanw209 02-21-2010 4:34 PM

Does anybody have a part number or a link to the right impeller so I can pick one up before I start pulling the engine apart?

justintime 02-21-2010 4:52 PM

ryan <BR> <BR>i emailed you the part number already

black_ops_09 02-22-2010 10:33 AM

Kenny, <BR> So are you going to trailer your boat to Sac and have that done? <BR> <BR>What is the permatex for? You need it when changing the impeller?

ghostrider_2 02-22-2010 8:10 PM

Jason that was on my first tour of recruiting duty, but now I am moving back to sac this summer because I just took over the South Sacramento recruiting office.

mendo247 02-24-2010 7:41 AM

Where you guys buying your impellers from? I was looking for a place online.

Walt 02-24-2010 11:46 AM

Coop, <BR>I can get one for you.

ryanw209 02-24-2010 10:17 PM

Coop- how do you weight you boat? That thing is slammed!!

justintime 02-25-2010 12:45 PM

i heard skidim is a great place

tre 02-25-2010 1:19 PM

I think you guys that paid $80 have an Indmar engine. I have always had indmar engines and the impeller is super easy to change. This mercruiser engine is clearly way more of a pain because the raw water pump is so burried by other components. Heck, I've never had to remove anything to do an impeller change other then the 4 screws holding the cover and gasket on the raw water pump. It is about a 15 min. job on an Indmar.

helman 02-25-2010 5:00 PM

RE: impeller install <BR> <BR>I used dish soap on my sanger (same motor)- also used a zip tie to compress the vanes in the right direction. Get half the impeller in the housing and then cut the tie. Slides right in- took me about an hour start to finish (regular breaks taken for cold beverage consumption).

ryanw209 02-25-2010 8:06 PM

Thanks for the tip Paul! I hope it only takes me an hour...

wake_upppp 02-25-2010 8:47 PM

I am an ASE Master Mechanic and have looked at mine (06 Sanger V210 Black Scorp) and would be very suprised/happy to accomplish it in an hour!

helman 02-25-2010 11:01 PM

It looks a bit tougher than it is... <BR> <BR>Take tension off the serp, unbolt the fuel filter assembly. Couple wrenches and a universal joint on your socket will get the pump out. <BR> <BR>Toughest part for me was getting the old impeller out (used a paint can openner to get behind it to pull out of the housing) and then to get the new vanes compressed and all going in the right direction to easily fit back in the pump housing (used zip tie around the middle to hold it all together). Reassemble and your back on the water. <BR> <BR>Granted, my other hobby is restoring old Broncos so I have seen a wrench or two.... <BR> <BR>Good luck Ryan!

wake_upppp 02-26-2010 9:14 AM

Nice Paul. You're right, it does look a bit tougher than you describe. Thanks for the info.

ryanw209 03-09-2010 10:16 PM

Just-in-time did you get my email? I emailed you my serial number. you can email me at snowboarder4_15@hotmail.com

Walt 03-10-2010 5:59 AM

1 Attachment(s)
I ended up having to change mine out last weekend. I guess it fused to the housing while being laid up for a few moths and having all the water drained out for the winter. Good thing I fired it up at home before I went to the lake. Not to bad of a job at all.

My mechanic told me it's not a bad idea to prime it with water from one of the water hoses after its been winterized.

If your doing this job make sure you take a look at the plastic housing. If it's scored at all replace it.

baitkiller 03-10-2010 6:11 AM

Soap vs grease
 
Finally remembered why I never use grease on impellers and it has nothing to do with deteriorating the rubber.

On many inboard engines, gassers and diesel the pump seal is a ceramic seal, like a PSS shaft log, not a lip seal. A little drop of oil or grease in the seal and it will leak like Niagara Falls.

The Mercruiser stuff is all lip seals I'm pretty sure. Watch out for Volvos, Cat and Cummins.

You know she is pumping water when all the soap bubbles come up behind the boat :)

ryanw209 03-10-2010 8:03 AM

Walt-do you have a V215 with the black scorpion? Can you help me out with what size/type impeller I need to get?

Walt 03-10-2010 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryanw209 (Post 1560491)
Walt-do you have a V215 with the black scorpion? Can you help me out with what size/type impeller I need to get?

I have a 210 but I would guess they are the same if yours is a Merc too. I don't know the part number because My friend/mechanic new it off of the top of his head and just handed it to me.

FreeRider209 03-11-2010 2:48 PM

Ryan I can hook you up on the impeller. We have em in stock. If you don't wanna squeze that 750 fly high has the 550 that is 16x16x42 that is specifically desinged for the rear v drive lockers.

ryanw209 03-11-2010 9:25 PM

Thanks Joe! I think I'll take you up on that! When do you work next? I want the 750's mainly so I have plenty of weight for surfing. I debated getting the 550's but I think my boat needs all the weight I can get for a good wave.

FreeRider209 03-12-2010 9:11 AM

Cool man sounds good. I work today and tomorrow. We have tickets for the boat show also so you'll just have to pay for parking. Let me know.

ryanw209 03-12-2010 2:37 PM

Do you work Friday next week? That's the next day I will have time to swing by

FreeRider209 03-12-2010 3:21 PM

Yup Wed thru Sat every week.

ryanw209 03-12-2010 9:34 PM

alright I'll come by friday afternoon. See ya then!

ryanw209 03-19-2010 9:59 PM

5 Attachment(s)
Finally changed my impeller on my 2006 Sanger V215 with the black scorpion 5.7L 330hp engine. For anybody else that reads this forum the impeller I got was make by Quicksilver and the part number was 47-862232A 2. I had heard that the housing might be plastic and luckily mine was brass. The install was pretty straight forward and if you check out the manual snapshots that Just-In-Time posted at the top of this forum you shouldn't have a problem. There was a few extra bolts that the manual didn't show but they are easy to spot. Here is some quick pictures I took. Sorry for the bad quality i had to take them with my phone.

ryanw209 03-22-2010 9:57 AM

3 Attachment(s)
Here is how mine was setup. Basically the same but a few different bolts and nuts:

mendo247 03-22-2010 10:04 AM

Nice work!

camassanger 03-22-2010 10:57 AM

Thanks for putting this together Ryan. Much appreciated! I suspect we will all be going thru this at some point...

ottog1979 03-22-2010 11:09 AM

Tightening the Belt
 
1 Attachment(s)
Seeing the schematic above prompted an unanswered question of mine. I have had to change my belt once and also loosen it to free the water pump & change the impeller. I've had trouble getting enough leverage on the small bolt that pulls the belt tight to get it as tight as I like it. The only way I've been able to is just pulling on it with a socket wrench straight by hand (with no leverage). Any helpful hints on how to do this?

The bolt I'm speaking of is highlighted here:

ryanw209 03-22-2010 2:37 PM

Andy- I'm not very mechanically inclined when it comes to engines so it took me about 20 minutes to figure out how to tighten the belt up, but is what you need to do is loosen the front nut(#16) enough to be able to crank the bolt(#23) to the desired tightness. I just used a small wrench on the bolt(#23) and was able to get it tight enough. If you are pushing down on the bolt(#23) as hard as you can and it still isn't enough pressure then you need to loosen up the front nut(#16) a few more turns and you should be able to get it tighter. Then you have to hold the tension on the bolt shaft(#23) with one wrench and at the same time use another wrech to tighten the nut(#16). Also make sure the grooves on back of the bolt are inside the grooves on the mounting bracket when you are tightening the nut.

I hope that makes sense.

ottog1979 03-22-2010 3:40 PM

I see now. The "gearing" should turn it tighter. I think I had 16 too loose and was just pulling 23 up by hand rather than cranking it. Thanks.

ryanw209 03-22-2010 5:28 PM

Exactly! Don't worry... I spent a lot of time trying to hold it up with my hand and tighen it down also before I finally figured it out.:confused:

justintime 03-24-2010 12:29 PM

who ever's impeller came out in pieces

better back flush, and pull the oil cooler water line and clear them out

ottog1979 03-24-2010 12:57 PM

Yeah, Ryan. I feel like a dumbass now. Duh! Thanks for the easy tip.

espritv8 03-27-2010 12:40 PM

How do you know you have the right tension on the belt when it's put back in place?

Very complete walktrough, very helpfull. Thanks!!

mendo247 04-03-2010 5:31 PM

Did my impeller this afternoon. Wasnt half as bad as I thought. Took about 1.5 hrs start to finish. Thats with acouple short breaks. After watching this thread so close it was almost like I had done it before lol

Seriuosly, I'd rather change my impeller than my oil. Not sure who keeps getting in my boat and cranking my oil filter so tight lol I hate that damn thing.

ccripps 04-03-2010 7:34 PM

I also just completed my Impeller change thanks to this thread, I wasn't as fast Richard proably took 2.5 hours and the hardest part was trying to get the new impeller in. Proably the best peice of advice was from Ryan WATCH OUT FOR SMALL WASHER HERE, I would have never seen that washer.

Also completed the Oil Change today the only things left to change are the tranny and V-Drive oil.

Thanks for everyones input

ryanw209 04-04-2010 6:52 PM

Yea chris I didn't see that washer either and spent 30 minutes lookIng for it after it fell under the engine lol. Do a write up on the tranny and vdrive oil if u can. I still need to do these. How often does everyone change the tranny and vdrive oil anyway?

Jonathan- I just felt how tight it was before I took it off so i knew how tight to get it. I pushed down in the middle of the belt on the top and had about 1/2 inch of play.

wake_upppp 04-04-2010 7:56 PM

I do oil engine oil every 25 and trans and vdrive every other oil change. 50 on engine oil and 100 on trans and vdrive would be fine though.

espritv8 04-04-2010 7:57 PM

Thanks, one last thing, did you undo the fuel lines? They look like they are in the way...

ryanw209 04-04-2010 8:20 PM

No you don't need to undo the fuel lines. If fact you don't even need to take off the fuel filter mounting bracket either. It just makes life a little easier and gives you some more room to work in. When you undo the bracket you can push the whole thing around or lay it over and leave the lines connected.

Sparky- what tranny oil and v-drive oil do you use? I just hit the 100 hr mark so I guess I should get in that before summer gets here.

wake_upppp 04-04-2010 8:25 PM

Ryan, 30w non-detergent (yes it must be non-detergent) engine oil for the vdrive and Dextron III for the trans

ryanw209 04-04-2010 8:32 PM

any idea on how many quarts for each fluid? Thanks!

wake_upppp 04-04-2010 9:10 PM

Yeah like around a quart for vdrive and around twice that for the trans give or take depending on how much you are able to get out. Raise the trailer to close to level. Check the level of each before you drain/draw the oil out, this will be your reference point Fill back to that point, then re-check next time out. Levels are supposed to be checked on the water with boat at rest/stopped. Fluids need to be warmed up prior to checking because ATF will expand as it gets warm. Dont overfill.

evadehickman 04-11-2010 8:11 AM

Video of Procedure
 
This thread was fantastic and allowed me to gather the stones needed to try this. Thanks to Sparky Jay for taking the lead and putting his skills into play. If it is useful to folks, this link below shows the video of the entire process. Thanks to everybody who posted on this thread and shared their knowledge. This is exactly why I love wakeworld!


Step by Step Video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWzqRE96Zts

ryanw209 04-12-2010 4:56 AM

Wow great video David! Thanks for the contribution!!!


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