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-   -   Nomex as a sandwich skin - test panel (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=739716)

surfdad 10-07-2009 9:09 PM

I have two sections of nomex honeycomb. It's a 2 pound density "paper" covered in phenolic resin. It's amazing stiff for being mostly air. <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR>I intend to bag a layer of 4 oz Zylon on the bottom and intentionally leave the resulting dimples, but I want the deck to be smooth. <BR> <BR>The only way that I can think to do that is to prefab the first layer of deck lamination and the bag an external layer over that. <BR> <BR>This is 6 oz FG in epoxy. Don't let anyone tell you that epoxy is super stiff <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> It's a medium soft plastic, but is stiffer and stronger than polyester. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739717.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-07-2009 9:11 PM

A small section of the nomex honeycomb. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739720.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-07-2009 9:14 PM

My test panel, is an attempt to glue the nomex to the prefab skin and mold it around an old mixing bucket. Hopefully tomorrow it will pop off and retain the shape. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739724.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739725.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 5:50 AM

The Nomex glued up easily, although the panel didn't fully retain the molded shaped. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739896.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 5:51 AM

View of the honeycomb <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739899.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 5:56 AM

The panel is still failrly flexible, I was afraid it wouldn't be, so rather than have two layers of resin I think that I can create a skin with a very lightweight facing on one side and then bend it enough to conform to the compound curves of the board. I'll just wet out a section of cloth and lay it out on some PE, then place the Nomex on top of that, apply some pressure and the next morning it will be ready to trim and glue up. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739903.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 6:00 AM

I was impressed with the rigidity of the stuff. I stood on this small test panel, placing all my weight on one foot - think balerina <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> and there was no deformation of the nomex. That could be used as a core material. <BR> <BR>I've been trying to source aluminum HC for the skins, but it must be exceptionally expensive because so far no one publishes a price for the 1/4" x 4' x 8' sheets. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739907.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739908.jpg" alt="Upload">

notsobueno 10-08-2009 11:36 AM

New shoes?

surfdad 10-08-2009 11:55 AM

<img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/rofl.gif" border=0> Amazing attention to detail! <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> I swear I am the ONLY person in existence with "shoe scrutiny" in an online forum!!! <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR>If I do this sort of test any more, I think I'll need to invest in Pointe shoes. I wonder if they come with a velcro closure? <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0>

notsobueno 10-08-2009 12:18 PM

I'd like to see you in some black and white wing tips for sure. Or maybe a nice tall pair of UGGS or cowboy boots too. <BR> <BR>The possibilities are as endless as the waves we ride. <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0>

surfdad 10-08-2009 12:59 PM

I am SOOOOOO done with the shoe conversation! <BR> <BR>Cut away of a sailboard - Nomex used as a skin to create a hollow board. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/739994.jpg" alt="Upload">

hawaj 10-08-2009 1:48 PM

oh yea new shoes!!! <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0> <BR> <BR>btw Jeff I love all that blured macrophotos where you can see all the details <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/lol.gif" border=0>

surfdad 10-08-2009 1:58 PM

ARRRRGGGH! More shoe grief! <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> Impressed with my photographic skill set, Petr? Following Jon's <a href="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/736809.html?1255015717" target="_blank">advice</a>, if I get lost on the art path, photography is NEXT on the list! <BR> <BR>You know what's funny Petr? I typically take two shots, in case one get's blurry or whatever and the pictures, above, are the ones I selected as being the better ones!! <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/rofl.gif" border=0> NO! WAIT! It's impressionistic art, you need to "feel" the composition of the construction. <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0>

hawaj 10-08-2009 1:58 PM

ok, I always wondered how they glue honeycomb with outer material (glass etc) so they dont fill up whole honeycomb cells with unwanted resin.

hawaj 10-08-2009 2:04 PM

it's ok Jeff I started to like it <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/lol.gif" border=0> <BR> <BR>btw look at your camera manual - most of them dont take sharp photos at less than 1 meter or 60cm from lens. SOme of them has macro setting. Thats all. And you can alway zoom it on back LCD after shoot

notsobueno 10-08-2009 2:05 PM

WE call it 'art' too when we get blurry photos at weddings. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/lol.gif" border=0>

surfdad 10-08-2009 2:09 PM

I do believe that if the facing is fiberglass, it would be possible to wet out the glass and then place the honeycomb on it. The fiberglass still needs to be impregnated with resin. I've seen aluminum facings and I'd bet the HC is probably dipped in a shallow bath or is painted with the resin and then placed on the facing material as it cures. <BR> <BR>RE Photo @ Petr - the camera comes with a manual? <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR>@ dtw - YES! See?! I told you it was art! <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0>

hawaj 10-08-2009 2:19 PM

yep Jeff usually I buy them with operating manual

brewkettle 10-08-2009 2:25 PM

Damb , someone already beat me to the shoe investigation, <BR>@ SD if you use the lay up table &amp; pan set up i use then you can wear your flips and shorts and dont worry about getting resin on your lam shoes

surfdad 10-08-2009 3:10 PM

I can't believe you guys! I kept thinking, what would cause so much attention to my shoes and then it struck me, JEALOUSY! <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/740051.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 3:13 PM

Listen, do yourself a favor and just get over it! Some folks just have nicer shoes than you and that's JUST the way it is. The sooner you come to grips with this reality, the easier your life will become. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/740060.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 3:27 PM

OK OK OK, I was a little harsh, I apologize. I don't mean to belittle your choices in footwear. It's just that when you are as accustomed to fine footwear, as I am, it's tedious when others attempt to drag me down to their level. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/740063.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 3:30 PM

So, what do you say, you try and keep your shoe jealousy under control and I'll pretend to be amused. OK? <BR> <BR>Too funny! I'm liking these green shoes for the shop. <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/740066.jpg" alt="Upload">

surfdad 10-08-2009 3:48 PM

I always like it when disagreements can be resolved like this. Reaching consensus always feels better, especially in gold shoes. <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/740069.jpg" alt="Upload">

notsobueno 10-08-2009 3:51 PM

I recommend these: <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/87668/740072.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR> <BR>^for keeping the foam off your shoes, but make them more masculine looking.

hawaj 10-09-2009 6:10 PM

he he he its so much fun here <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0>

cowwboy 10-13-2009 1:05 PM

I had talked to a guy in my MC and he is deep into composites. I remember asking him about the hc he had in the shop (Nomex) and he said that if it contacted watre it would fall apart. I know we all think that glass/composities are water proof but some will be through eventually. <BR>Have you tested some to see how it does in that enviroment?

surfdad 10-13-2009 1:22 PM

Yep - just like your friend said - turns to mush <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> It's just paper with some glue on the outside. However, it really requires a puncture, there isn't any seepage through paint/hotcoat/lamcoat matrix. <BR> <BR>The sailboard guys used to use nomex and they'd hit a rock or the beach and put a hole in the board, then next thing they knew it was wet cardboard <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR>I'd like to try it with some aluminum honeycomb, but I can't seem to source any, plus I am thinking I'd have to mortgage the house to get a sheet! <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR>Thanks for following along Daniel, and bringing that concern to my attention.

cowwboy 10-18-2009 9:26 PM

He's doctoring up a busted salt water board I was given, so I'll see if he has any info on getting any other honeycomb material.

surfdad 10-19-2009 3:33 PM

Thanks daniel, I appreciate that. There are tons of "floppy" honeycomb, like nidacore and that polyethelene stuff. I was interested in the aluminum for it's rigidity. I'd like to try that.

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