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-   Archive through June 28, 2009 (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=711910)
-   -   Calling all stereo Gurus (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=710228)

mikejones 06-25-2009 10:37 AM

I'm about to upgrade the stock stereo system in my new Mastercraft and need some advice from the high end stereo junkies.. Boat is an X-45, equipment is as follows... <BR> <BR>Stock mids/highs, only upgrading the subs for now. <BR> <BR>I'm planning to install the following: <BR>(2) JL Audio Slash 1000/1 amps <BR>(2) JL Audio 13W7 subs in a custom box made for the compartment under the observer seat. <BR>(1) Kinetik 600 installed as a capacitor <BR> <BR>My questions include....How can I stabilize the power supply system and batteries so that it wont drain my batteries? What all must I do to allow the system to be played for extended times with the engine off? More Batteries? How should I wire them? My current setup has one starting battery, one battery for the accessories. The alternator charges both, even while the switch is on battery #1 (starter). Also, I'm wondering what is the best way to keep these amps cool? Should I install a few fans to blow on the amps since this is going to be in a closed location. I will vent the area when I'm not running by opening one of the seats. So, for you guys who know your stuff, how would you set this equipment up? <BR> <BR>Thanks!

biggris79 06-25-2009 11:28 AM

With the jl slash 1000/1 amp its going to drain your batteries quick im running a boston acoustic on a 12w7 and its pleanty of power and dont use as much power as the slash i wouldnt use the slash in a boat even look at the alpine pdx 1000 or jl hd 750/1 this will help u with the battery from draining as quick

biggris79 06-25-2009 11:30 AM

boston acoustic Gt-28

johnny_jr 06-25-2009 11:38 AM

The JL slash are power hungry you'll need at least a Kinetik 2400 to support the 2 amps, and that's just to keep voltage to them, that's not going to run them long at all with the motor off. <BR> <BR>There is a post on Battery suggestions, I posted a link to a battery running life calculator. See if that helps you get the right set up.

david_e_m 06-25-2009 11:40 AM

Michael, <BR> <BR>With that type of power you're going to need lots of good batteries. <BR> <BR>You're going to need a method for isolating multiple discharged stereo batteries from your alternator for the preservation of your alternator. <BR> <BR>An upgrade alternator wouldn't be a bad idea. <BR> <BR>And, you're going to be very dependent on shore power AC charging with a big smart charger like a Kinetik. <BR> <BR>David <BR>Earmark Marine

acurtis_ttu 06-25-2009 11:49 AM

I'm with Robert. That 1000/1 is a current hog. Guys who run them usually have multiple batteries and a beefed up charging system. <BR>With some of the newer amp technologies out today that are specifically designed to manage current draw there are much better options than the JL slash series amps. Nice amp, but there are better options for marine applications.

murphy_smith 06-25-2009 12:06 PM

Don't be that guy in party cove that has to start his boat in the middle of the day to keep his stereo going. <BR> <BR>Get enough batteries to get you through the day. <BR> <BR>I am running 4 optimas...never had to crank it over once. Running 2000 watts of Arc Audio KS power to Wetsounds and JL 12w6v2 sub.

mikejones 06-25-2009 12:14 PM

Yeah, I considered the JL audio HD amps, but got such a good deal on the two slash amps, plus a bit more power from them than the 750/1 that I couldnt pass it up. <BR> <BR>Johnny - So, two Kinetik 2400's to replace the starting and house batteries? Or one to replace the starting battery, and two to replace the single house battery, totalling 3... how would I wire the 3rd? Is this going to effect my existing 95 amp alternator? Kinetik's manual from their website says "Adding a Kinetik High Current Power Cell to your system will not overload the alternator. The internal resistance of our power cells is very low and does not significantly increase the overall load on the electrical system. Of course replacing your existing wet cell battery with a Kinetik Power Cell and adding additional Kinetik Power Cells is always recommended over mixing battery technologies in the same vehicle. Power cells with the same ESR values and technology will charge evenly and supply balanced power to your system for maximum life and performance." <BR> <BR>David - Depending on the answer to the question above, how does one isolate stereo/accessory batteries? Also, my intent is to charge the batteries after every outing so I have them fresh for the next outing. Question there is, do I need to isolate the batteries from the system while charging, or can they be hooked up to the stock switch/relay/system while charging.

airrantz 06-25-2009 12:15 PM

I'll agree with everyone here and go one step further and suggest a bigger amp for the 13W7. I have a 1000/1 running a 10W7 as these subs are power hungry and will pound with more power. If I recall correctly the 13W7 is dual voice coil so you can wire at 1.5ohm. Find an amp that can put out 1200-1500 watts at 1.5ohm. Or better yet get this in a 2ohm x 2200 watts version and let me know how it sounds <a href="http://www.zapco.com/prod/comp_prods/c2k4kwFrame.htm" target="_blank">http://www.zapco.com/prod/comp_prods/c2k4kwFrame.htm</a>. Kidding on the Zapco although I've always wanted to see one of those installed. Rockford power T1500 is a good amp but if I recall they are power hungry as well <a href="http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/products/product_details.asp?cat_id=2&amp;series_id=104&amp ;family_id=105&amp;item_id=107999&amp;locale=en_US &amp;p_status=" target="_blank">http://www.rockfordfosgate.com/products/product_details.asp?cat_id=2&amp;series_id=104&amp ;family_id=105&amp;item_id=107999&amp;locale=en_US &amp;p_status=</a>. With two 13W7s you're gonna want a separate battery bank with isolator and a beefed up alternator probably too no matter what amp you get.

mikejones 06-25-2009 12:18 PM

Murph - thats what I'm trying to avoid. I know a bit about installing stereo systems, not so much about vehicle/boat electrical systems to support them. <BR> <BR>How do I add batteries to the system, just tie them into the house/accessory battery in parallel?

airrantz 06-25-2009 12:18 PM

Whoops didn't see you had already bought the amps before I posted. The 1000/1s will get the job done but the sub could handle more power. Don't know anything about the Kinetik Power Cells but I do like my Hellroaring isolator/combiner for separating the house batteries from the starting batteries if you're worried about your alternator.

murphy_smith 06-25-2009 12:18 PM

The HD 750/1 IMO may be a bit light for the 13w7...I think that JL is going to be rolling out an HD 1200/1 soon. <BR> <BR>It is a solid amp and could be one of the most efficient monoblocks on the market. <BR> <BR>Also why 2 subwoofers...1 will hammer that boat apart.

mikejones 06-25-2009 12:22 PM

Okay, am I understanding this right?.... A separate battery (or batterys) for the stereo system, isolated from the starter battery, and charge the stereo battery bank after each outing? If im out on the boat all day (8-10 hours) will they last?

airrantz 06-25-2009 12:25 PM

Depends on how much of that time the engine is running and how many batteries you want to add. If you're spending most of your time on the beach with the engine off and system blasting I say add 4 optimas or their equivalent in Kinetiks or what not and separate that from your starting battery with an isolator or switch.

jv210 06-25-2009 12:27 PM

Murphy, get a 13W7 and watch your batteries drain in a couple hours. The 13W7 is power hungry along with those JL amps. I'm running 4 kinetic 2400's and only 1 13W7 and I can play for a while, but not all day. <BR> <BR>Michael, Get as many batteries as you can afford and fit in your boat. Those amps and subs will drain them quick.

mikejones 06-25-2009 12:27 PM

I'd say 1-2 hrs running, 4-5 hrs at the sanbar with engine off, 1-2 running hours after. This of course is not the typical outing, most time is spent with the engine running while boarding.

murphy_smith 06-25-2009 12:37 PM

BINGO...that is why I did not get a 13w7. <BR> <BR>I prefer to go for hours upon hours <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/wink.gif" border=0> <BR> <BR>(Message edited by Murphy_Smith on June 25, 2009)

ponyh8r 06-25-2009 12:59 PM

Mike, <BR> <BR>I currently run the following for comparison. 1 JL 1000/1 on a 12W7, 2 300/2's on the Wetsound Pro 485's, 2 300/2 on two JL marine interior subs, 1 450/4 on the interior speakers. <BR> <BR>To run this I use 4 Kinetic 2400's on a battery bank. They are isolated and are not part of my starting system. I still have two batteries used to start the boat hooked up to a Perco, one to start, one in case. I have upgraded the alternator as well and fun cooling fans on the amps. Additionally, i have a kinetic on board charger. This is the key i think. When my boat is in storage, it is plugged in at all times. The charger will shut itself off when done charging. That way, every single time i take it out, it is charged up. I can generally play for 5-6 hrs at near full tilt before it starts to go. Batteries are going to be your best friend in accomplishing what you want to. Next best buddy will be the on board charger.

murphy_smith 06-25-2009 1:04 PM

Mike you are dead on. Leaving your batteries on a good charger is key and needs to be done ASAP every time. It will also makes you batteries last a long time. <BR> <BR>I have a Dual Pro charger, btw...nice system!

mikejones 06-25-2009 1:17 PM

Nice setup Mike. And good clear concice advice. I'm curious as to how the batteries and on board charger are wired. Can you write a few statements, i.e. 4 batteries in parallel, distribution blocks for the power/ground wires, how is the charger connected to 4 batts? etc. <BR> <BR>Thanks.

acurtis_ttu 06-25-2009 1:32 PM

^^^ <BR>Hooked in parallel, the charger sees one "big" 12 volt battery. Just pick one battery and hook the charger to +/- terminal. the same for the distro blocks.

mikejones 06-25-2009 1:42 PM

Mike - Whats the model number of your kinetik on board charger?

mikejones 06-25-2009 1:45 PM

Thanks guys....

nautiquesonly 06-25-2009 5:22 PM

If you hook pos to pos and negative to negative isn't that a series and not parallel

05mobiuslsv 06-25-2009 5:36 PM

Nope it's parallel.

nautiquesonly 06-25-2009 6:32 PM

thanks nu bu thats how I did mine

ponyh8r 06-28-2009 2:59 AM

Mike, Murphy, <BR> <BR>I would like to act like i know about this stuff, haha, but honestly all the work was done at a local stereo shop back in Texas. I would run out and look but I'm currently tied up in Iraq. I like the Kinetic batteries by the way and I think they have a bunch to do with how well the system stays charged. They are a bit expensive, but I think they have been worth it.


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