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-   -   Analyze my HS Front Flip (VID) (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=693620)

lyle 05-06-2009 1:20 PM

I tried this trick a few trips ago and got it. I am just not pleased with my pop. I sometimes get great pop and really gets me around, but most times I end up shorting it, and butt check it. Not to mention that it looks really ugly. Other than the first one, the rest were taken the first day I got it. So I know Im not holding the handle in on them. I think it is how I am hitting the wake. I think that maybe when I am shorting it, that I am keeping too hard of an edge through the wake, and missing my pop. Yesterday, I got to try it a time or two, and seemed as when I got more over my board at the wake, I was able to get a little more height and rotation. Check it out, and give me some input, thanks... <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.blackwaterrydas.com/video/heelfronts.zip" target="_blank">www.blackwaterrydas.com/video/heelfronts.zip</a>

lyle 05-06-2009 1:26 PM

I feel like I am having to work way to hard to make this trick happen, so I am pretty sure I am not getting the correct pop. The few times that I have, it has really booted me

dizzyj 05-06-2009 1:41 PM

how about hosting at vimo?

lyle 05-06-2009 1:43 PM

The more I watch it, the more I am sure that I am leaving way too early.. <BR> <BR>Dj, Ill see if i can throw it up there

bflat53212 05-06-2009 1:46 PM

Wow! How the hell are you getting around on this trick? I wouldn't think it would work the way the first few are thrown, but oh well. <BR> <BR>Fist off keep in mind I've never even tried this trick, but feel I know enough about it to at least comment. <BR> <BR>Go back to your approach on this trick. It needs to be progressive. You are coming screaming in and then flattening off about 10 feet before the wake and flat out hucking this trick. Now that you are comfortable with the rotation, go back and start a nice progressive edge. You want your edge to be it's greatest at the wake. This is why the ones you don't come screaming in on, you get more pop, because you are at least holding a constant edge. So if anything at least hold a constant edge to keep line tension. The line tension will help you get the pop you are looking for and also help you get around quicker and cleaner. <BR> <BR>Next thing, glue that handle to your hips. Meaning keep the handle in close, think about rotating around the handle similar to a backroll, just the other direction of rotation. Don't let that handle get above your head. <BR> <BR>You're already landing the trick, but I think if you follow these two words of advice, you will clean this trick up quite a bit. If you have access to a trampoline, it will help with muscle memory for handle placement to practice this trick. Good luck man and keep us posted. Nice work!

lyle 05-06-2009 1:50 PM

Skubz, thanks for the input man.. Ya I know, I can tell I am working WAY to hard to make this trick happen.. Guess I got all caught up in the balls to the wall approach, that I think I am having trouble getting my body in the right position at the wake..

lyle 05-06-2009 1:58 PM

Vimeo <a href="http://www.vimeo.com/4517790" target="_blank">http://www.vimeo.com/4517790</a>

eubanks01 05-06-2009 2:12 PM

It looks like you're opening up your chest too much and throwing it more like a tantrum. I think the more progressive edge Skubz talked about will help because letting off your edge is make you square up too much. <BR> <BR>The last one looked to be the best. Even though you still went flat before the wake your rotation was much more tip over tail like a front should be. <BR> <BR>At least you're landing them so far!

eubanks01 05-06-2009 2:14 PM

Oh, and one other thing I noticed. Don't get your heels back to your butt. Just bring your front knee up to your chest and keep the board more underneath you. <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3184/693635.jpg" alt="Upload">

dizzyj 05-06-2009 3:19 PM

Thanks for putting it up there. <BR> <BR>ya, totally a frantrum, a 2 handed tantrum.(not that I can do these, but I was watching the book last night ;) ) <BR> <BR>take a shorter progressive cut, and dont open your chest to the sky. throw the trick kinda towards the boat. <BR> <BR>you will get it definitely. just needs some tweeking.

lyle 05-07-2009 7:19 AM

Thanks guys.. Man, sure didnt think I was doing the frant... I knew it was incorrect form, but really didnt think I was doing that. Guess Ill try to work on my edge, and waiting longer.. Not to mention trying to control my handle a little better. I think I have had a hard time controlling the handle because I am having to huck it so hard to get it around.

bflat53212 05-07-2009 8:22 AM

"I think I have had a hard time controlling the handle because I am having to huck it so hard to get it around." <BR> <BR>Yeah, I agree with you there. If you keep the line tension, by not flattening off, it will help in this regard.

dan_k 05-07-2009 2:02 PM

your not doing a frantrum your edging off a bit before you hit the wake then your hands go way above your head slowing down the rotation concentrate on edging the whole way through the wake while keeping your handle right in at your hip and if you feel your landing sideways push the handle down and towards your leading hip

lyle 05-08-2009 7:10 AM

Thanks Dan, that makes me feel better. <BR> <BR>I went out yesterday with a group of guys so I didnt get to ride but just a second. I did give it one shot though. I focused on cuttting through the wake, and think that part looks better, however, still need alot of work on my body and handle position. Ill post up a vid of it in a bit.

lyle 05-08-2009 7:44 AM

Okay, here is the one I did from yesterday. I did better with my edge through the wake, still left a little early, but that part was better. Still work needs to be done on body and handle position. You will have to download this one from my site, I cant upload another to vimeo for a week. <BR> <BR><a href="http://www.blackwaterrydas.com/heelfront2.mov" target="_blank">http://www.blackwaterrydas.com/heelfront2.mov</a> <BR> <BR>Right Click save target as

eubanks01 05-08-2009 1:27 PM

Hey, I still think you're flattening out a lot. Do you have video of a load and release trick or just a HS progressive edge video? Your handle could definitley be lower to your hips, but I think getting your edge right can make this thing much easier for you.

lyle 05-08-2009 1:41 PM

Eubanks, I think you may be right, but I also have about decided that I am just leaving too early. Im pretty sure that you have to initiate this trick extremely late, like leaving the wake. And if that is the case, then I am definitely not doing that. <BR>I dont have any video of a prog edge through the wake on this machine. Heres a link to our recent vid, Im the second rider, if you can get anything from it. <a href="http://vimeo.com/4201807" target="_blank">http://vimeo.com/4201807</a>

mbsteez 05-09-2009 2:10 PM

are there any tricks you should initiate before leaving the wake???

lyle 05-09-2009 10:20 PM

Steve, most trip tricks, fr, sc, tant, etc. Are initiated at the very top of the wake.. This one seems almost to be initiated right after leaving the wake <BR> <BR>(Message edited by Lyle on May 09, 2009)

lyle 05-11-2009 8:09 AM

I got the second one on vimeo now as well. .. <a href="http://vimeo.com/4592031" target="_blank">http://vimeo.com/4592031</a>

bflat53212 05-11-2009 8:43 AM

Interesting flyghigh, you said: <BR> <BR>"most trip tricks, fr, sc, tant, etc. Are initiated at the very top of the wake.. This one seems almost to be initiated right after leaving the wake" <BR> <BR>This is not a trip trick. Maybe that understanding will help. This is a progressive edge trick.

lyle 05-11-2009 9:15 AM

Thanks Skubz, but I know the difference. My response was to "are there <b>any</b>tricks you should initiate before leaving the wake??"

bflat53212 05-11-2009 10:53 AM

ahhh...sorry about that.

eubanks01 05-11-2009 11:17 AM

Nice riding in that video! I remember seeing that posted a few weeks back. <BR> <BR>I still think you could have a bit more of a progessive edge, but you said it right in that it looks like you're throwing it early. <BR> <BR>Maybe you can really focus on getting your right knee up off the wake BEFORE you throw your right shoulder down towards the water. Maybe that will help you wait a bit to throw it. <BR> <BR>Anyway, it is looking good and it seems like you're close to cleaning it up.

dan_k 05-11-2009 11:23 AM

thats better edge, now you need to push off your front foot and really concentrate on keeping the handle at your hip its still going way high but getting better

lyle 05-11-2009 11:53 AM

Thanks guys, One thing I really see in that last vid is how far I am leaning over my front foot when I hitting the wake. <BR> <BR>Eubanks, Thanks Bra, and Thats a good tip on getting my knee up before throwing my shoulder. Ill try that next time out. Hopefully if the weather permits, tomorrow. <BR> <BR>Dan, I agree man, I think that whenever I start feeling the full pop I wont have to try to huck it so hard, therefore helping me keep the handle in. Gonna work on it tomorrow. Thanks man

jenk2board 08-17-2010 6:39 PM

1 Attachment(s)
I agree with all of the above. Your hardest edge should definately be at the wake. You have a really aggressive edge at first, then you lay off at the wake. Conentrate on cutting all the way through the wake, pop, suck your front knee up, then lean forward over your front shoulder for the roatation. You can see in this picture, how far along I am in the trick, and just getting into my rotation. This is one of my favorite tricks because when you edge correctly, it really boosts you. Hope this helps.

cwb4me 08-17-2010 7:40 PM

i agree with brady. if you watch mike mclin on learnwake.com he has progressive edge pushes through the wake while letting his lead knee up to his chest then initiates the rotation at the peak of his height. your rotation is almost a tantrum.you may be throwing you head to the right instead of throwing your head down towards your right hip.try a more progressive edge instead of your raley approach.good luck

alanp 08-18-2010 5:19 PM

didnt read the comments. probably already been mentioned but if not. youre opening your left shoulder. it needs to stay closed and in line with your board. also weight your toes more. all of your weight is out the back on your heels and butt. this is actually a super easy trick and you can probably clean yours up with just a few tries.

wakeandsnow27 08-26-2010 2:13 PM

^ I agree...your shoulder is opening up bigtime...forcing you to lay out a little.

Here's mine: http://vimeo.com/14460376

I always focus on sucking my forward knee up into my chest, getting pleanty of pop, and rotating over my led shoulder, but not behind it.
I'd also suggest slowing down a little and trying to get a little more pop, rather than such a hard and fast charge

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