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-   -   Centurion not much talked about (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=527641)

freefly70 12-14-2007 1:43 PM

Hey guys I don't hear much from Centurion owners on here. I ran across some used ones in my search for boats and curious peoples opinions and if there is something I should look for. They are both 05's one is a 2005 Centurion Cyclone C4 and the other is 2005 Avalanche C4 and will be first boat as well.

cyclonesurfer 12-14-2007 1:55 PM

I have a 2005 Cyclone c4 and I love it. Ive owned many boats in the past but this is my first inboard wakeboat. Its never had any problems and performs great especially for surfing.

epic_peachland 12-14-2007 2:01 PM

I would definetly recommend them. I have an elite V C4 great value. Good wake and great surf wake once you add a bit of weight.

lovin_the_wake 12-14-2007 2:16 PM

I've never heard anything bad about them

mobv 12-14-2007 2:59 PM

I had a 2005 Avalanche C4, excellent wakeboard boat, solid, vertical wake with great pop. No problems with boat, very solid ride, best rough water boat I've ever ridden in. Including Moomba, Supra, Malibu, Mastercraft, Nautique.

sailing216 12-14-2007 3:21 PM

I just picked up a demo Avalanche and only rode a few times, but good rough water boat, great wake for boarding, very good surf, gotta love the snap out carpet--will love it even more when the kids get in with muddy feet. Haven't heard anything bad on older boats, but Big Surf Ed will probably tell you the older lightning hull that is a bit stepped at the rear has to have alot of weight for surfing. Elite V and Avy don't have that problem. I found it was the best value considering the seats are part of the molded deck unlike Malibu, Supra, Moomba. And Centurions have a great trailer too. <BR>The only downer was most have a Mercruiser engine. Good that you can find a mechanic anywhere, but I'd rather have an indmar. A trusty mechanic can help. <BR>It was a long buying process and I ended with a Centurion over Malibu and Supra. MC was out of the price range. I didn't consider Nautique cause I'd just buck up at that point and get a MC. Dealer/Mechanic is very important part of your search for any boat. Good luck.

peterc4 12-14-2007 3:23 PM

We've had a elite v c4 for 3 years now and haven't had any problems.

polarbill 12-14-2007 4:13 PM

I would definately go with Avalanche over the Cyclone unless you have some sort of size restrictions. They are very similar just one is bigger than the other. The Avalanche will ride better in rough water because it is bigger and heavier. It surfs better from what I have heard. Centurion makes a very good family oriented midlevel boat. The wakeboard wake is really touchy though. Both boats have deeper V's than most wakeboard boats and they don't really have a reverse outer chine so they are really sensitive to weight. You will find that if the boat is loaded unevenly at all it is going to wash out one side of the wake. As a simple fix just get a few pop bags(lead) and move it around as necessary. Some people mentioned the elite-V which is basically the same boat as both just in between both on size. I believe the cyclone and Elite-V C4 have a 93" beam and the Avalanche has a 100". I use to sell Centurions and I like driving the Avalanche a lot more than the Elite-V. The Elite-V C4 is the same as the lightning. the regular elite-v before 2007 was a different hull. It was the one that had a false transom. I believe the storm series of this boat was called the hurricane.

rio_sanger 12-14-2007 6:14 PM

Beer Good,if you read the "wakesurfing" threads, you'll see that Centurion is talked about quite often. <BR> <BR>Joe B, Why Do you think Mercruiser is a "downer"? <BR> I've got 550 hrs on my current boat and put over 600 on my previous boat without ONE problem on either... (both Mercruisers) <BR> I'm guessing they build more marine engines than Indmar and PCM put together, (both good engines)

bigshow 12-14-2007 9:14 PM

I guess I'm big surf Ed<IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR>I've got a Centurion Lightning, the older hull. The hull is a ski boat hull. The hull has spray pockets and a hull extension and I think itís designed for lift. Now all of the Centurion hulls are new Ė no old molds. That means that the wakeboard hulls meant for just that, wakeboarding. The 220 Enzos are supposed to be cross over hulls. I think they are fairly flat compared to other Centurion hulls. I think the Falcons hulls are similar to the 220 Enzo hull. <BR> <BR>My Lightningís wakeboard wake with stock ballast is about perfect. OK, other boat brand guys donít get in a dander. I mean that the best wake on this boat is with stock ballast. IMO Adding more weight really doesnít help that much. With all of the ballast I run the wake can get pretty big. Last year I impressed or freighted a few riders when I her sacked out. I've been able to build a pretty respectable surf wake with the older lightning hull. However, I really have to pull all the stops to get good surfing wakes on both sides. <BR> <BR>We had a Centurion Avalanche at the 2007 Scioto Wakefest, in Columbus Ohio. We also had two Avalanches at the NWL Wake Surf Nationals in Dayton Ohio. The Avalanche surf wake is the best I've been on. It's much easier to get a good surfing wake on the Avy than the older Lightning. At Nationals we had excellent surf wakes on both sides with just ballast. The goofy side surfers said that the wakes were the most evenly matched that they had seen in a competition. <BR> <BR>As far as my Mighty Centurion goes, well Iíve had a really good experience. My family and friends love the boat. The lines on my lightning a clean and the red color just pops. I get a lot of complements. Iíve had a ton of folks on board the mighty Centurion no complaints and she runs great. <BR> <BR>Iím planning on buying an Enzo as soon as I sell the Mighty Centurion. <BR> <BR>My Avy and Lightning <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527716.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>The Mighty Centurion Stirring up some surf <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527717.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Regular Surf way further back than 10 feet, I think thatís 25 feet back <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527718.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Tweaked goofy wake <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527719.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR> <BR> <BR> <BR>The Nationals Goofy Wake Avy <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527720.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>The Avy Goofy Wake <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527721.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR> <BR>Nationals Regular Wake Avy <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527722.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Nationals Regular Wake <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527723.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR> <BR>A little Air off the Avy Wake <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527724.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR> <BR>Some of the riders from Nationals <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527725.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR> <BR>This is a great looking boat. If I buy a new Enzo it will look like this one <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/527726.jpg" alt="Upload">

steedracer 12-14-2007 10:40 PM

Beer Good, Centurion makes a great boat! Owners tend to sit back on this forum and let the M &amp; M fans take shots at each other (perhaps CC, too). While they make good boats in their own right, they are certainly not the only game in town. We just wait until a Centurion owner posts up or someone asks a legitimate question, and we usually chime in (and most other boat brand people don't hijack the thread). I've mentioned to Centurion that someone needs to start up an owner's club type site, whether it be directly off of their web site, or not. It could be a great resource for Centurion owners and potential owners. <BR> <BR>Having said all of that, we've had our Enzo for two seasons, and she's been perfect, sans one exhaust header gasket that was quickly replaced under warranty. Also, if you check warranty records on boat engines, Mercruiser is as good as anybody else out these. I've taken many core wakeboarders out on my Enzo and they always come away impressed with the boat and the wake. The boats are solid and reliable. I like the '05 &amp; beyond boats personally. In your case, beer good, I'd go for the larger Avalanche. And, if you need to clean your wake up a bit, just ask a passenger or two to sit where you want them to, to eliminate any wash on top of the wake. <BR> <BR>Provided the boats you are looking at are sound mechanically (ie. haven't been abused, etc.), I think you'd be proud to be a new member of the Centurion Owners club! (and livin' in Tampa would allow you to get a lot more days of riding in than many of us!). Good luck.

mars 12-15-2007 3:49 AM

The new falcons might be worth looking at in that price range. They should have the rampier wake of the 216/220. The Cyclone is very vert. On any deeper V boat you're going to have to train your passengers to move when they see the wake washing on one side or the other. Another trick better drivers use is to slightly turn in to the rider to improve the wake on the side they are going to hit for their launch-this works particularly well on a deeper V'd boat. <BR>Agree that centurion owners tend to be a little more laid back on this board when it comes to some of the peeing contests that tend to crop up from time to time... if you're bored search on terms like "best wake" to see what I mean.

freefly70 12-15-2007 11:26 AM

The Enzo seems to get real good talk which I think is out of my range, just don't know much about the rest of the line and I need to go used just because of budget. I am in Tampa FL and am looking at 01 to 02 SANTE' and X Stars but then you see Centurion, Tige, and Moomba at the same price newer boats or brand new to be honest. I really liked the Tige and the dealer is freaking awesome but have been in all of them except Centurion just because no dealer in Tampa just ran across transition watersports in ocala so will give them a ring for a demo.

poser007 12-15-2007 11:33 AM

That pic with that little girl surfing is hilarious,, the wake is as tall as she is.

bulletlines 12-15-2007 2:18 PM

I have owned 2 Centurion boats, and neither boat ever had a problem: very reliable. The only thing I was disappointed in is that Centurion is not a very popular brand in my area, and therfore both boats were difficult to sell on my own. I feel Centurion just has not put an effort in marketing the Central TX market. It seems that all we ever see or hear of here is Mastercraft, Nautique, and Supra. If you are on the east coast or west coast, I would not worry about Centurion brand name recognition. <BR> <BR>BTW... If anyone from Centurion is watching this thread: Bullet Lines is looking for a 08 demo boat, and I think a Centurion with our graphics would look great. <BR> <BR>Thanks, <BR> <BR>Ken Land <BR>Bullet Lines <BR><a href="http://www.bulletlines.com" target="_blank">www.bulletlines.com</a> <BR><a href="http://www.wakeboarding-winch.com" target="_blank">www.wakeboarding-winch.com</a> <BR> <BR>(Message edited by bulletlines on December 15, 2007) <BR> <BR>(Message edited by bulletlines on December 15, 2007)

Ben Kerran 12-16-2007 10:27 AM

Another happy Centurion owner here. 05 Avalanche C4. My only issue was with the Tower (might have something to do with all the speakers I have up there<img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0>). Pro-flight took care of it even though it was out of warranty. My previous boat was a 2000 Bowrider. I had some cosmetic issues with that boat, but overall, very reliable boat. I don't think you can go wrong with a newer Centurion, they are super solid and a great boat IMHO.

bsebllhglyknit 12-16-2007 5:42 PM

I guess I will chime in as anouther Centurion owner. Well my dads but never the less I do all research for him. We have had two centurions our first was a 2005 sport bowrider very reliable never any problems. now we have an 2005 cenutrion enzo, once again with no problems expect in the beginning. We got it because it sat of the lot for a year and they were offering huge discounts on it. One of the fuel pumps was shot and some electrical stuff but the dealership covered it. The dealer is a huge part of buying the boat. Centurion makes great boats.

batman 12-16-2007 5:45 PM

I was behind an Avalanche not long ago and have ridden most wakes out there and it was PURRRFECT! I have a Nautique, owned Malibu VLX, ridden behind X Stars and Centurion is as good as any out there!

krbaugh 12-16-2007 8:14 PM

I have owned shall we several Centurions. <BR>My current one is the Enzo 220. They have progressed so much over the last few years! I will put My Enzo up against any other boat out there!

mars 12-17-2007 12:10 AM

Kevin: <BR>was wondering when you'd show<img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/wink.gif" border=0> <BR>so you peeled your 16 and had them put a 20 on... <BR>I think the 220 has the potential to be a sleeper hit for them. <BR>When replacing our last centurion (which treated us very well) we shopped around. The 220 compared favorably with a used X-Star (which was still more expensive) and was built a little more solidly than the Malibus. Sangers were VERY compelling but we wound up ordering an Enzo SV220. I was surprised at how good its surf wake was but think the stock prop would need to be changed in favor of a "top end" three blader before it would really be skiable and thus a true cross over, seems out of the box they are more dialed for surf/wake. <BR>Mr Baugh would know more on this than I though.

motobob13 12-17-2007 6:53 AM

Hook up with Nate at Transition Watersports. He has a young energetic crew over there who care about their boats and the sport. Worth the drive...

uga33 12-17-2007 12:10 PM

Another happy owner here. I have had 2 Centurions and both have been great experiences. Centurion has really stepped up their game alot over the past few years. There 08 products seem to look better than ever. Would recommend a Centurion to anyone.

uga33 12-17-2007 12:12 PM

You can see some pics of my boat here: <BR><a href="http://www.wakesiderides.com/rides/index.php?page=out&amp;id=1010" target="_blank">http://www.wakesiderides.com/rides/index.php?page=out&amp;id=1010</a>

norcal_wakejunky 12-17-2007 2:07 PM

I have an 05 Centurion Avalanche with the walk through and my wife and I love it. I just have a center ballast and it has a solid wake. For the guys and girls that like to go big I throw 2 400lbs fat sacs in the back compartments, and 1 350lbs sac in the bow and the wake is awesome. Check the profile for a pic. <BR> <BR>Also here <BR><a href="http://www.wakesiderides.com/rides/index.php?page=out&amp;id=2663" target="_blank">http://www.wakesiderides.com/rides/index.php?page=out&amp;id=2663</a> <BR> <BR>there should be some pics of the wake and some other angles of my boat at <a href="http://www.wakepics.com/member/skincaid" target="_blank">http://www.wakepics.com/member/skincaid</a> <BR> <BR>there are shots of a Malibu vlx and my centurion

05mobiuslsv 12-17-2007 3:06 PM

Hey if anyone is looking for an Enzo there is what looks to be a good deal on an 04 in the seattle craigslist, I think it said $39K.

freefly70 12-17-2007 3:16 PM

There is an 05 Cyclone C4 pretty whats the opinion on the wake for the average joe thats not an advanced rider and how surfable is it??? Compared to an 02 SANTE which is priced about the same with same set up. <BR> <BR>(Message edited by freefly70 on December 17, 2007)

tinytdubb 12-17-2007 9:54 PM

I think I may be the only person on this site with a 93 Falcon XP. Centurion has made a good product for a while. My 15 year old Falcon is a testament to that. With some weight it throws an ok wake and my indmar fires up every time no problem.

chpthril 12-18-2007 6:08 AM

We almost bought one, an Avalanche, about 4 yrs ago, til the crap @$$ dealer did us foul. <BR> <BR>After spending 4 hours in thier booth at the boat show, they invited us up for a "demo" day a few weeks later. When we got there, the sales girl was just raving about how good the boat was as the spent all day yesterday out on it. She said they where getting it cleaned up for us so if we wanted, we could sit and talk to the owner til it was ready to go. <BR> <BR>After spending about 45mins with the owner talking price, options, and delivery schedules, I said I really cant wait to drive one. He said "how much do you want to put down and we will get this thing ordered" I said I need to drive first, as I dont spend that kinda coin "site unseen". He then tells me that that all his boats are sold and they dont have any to water test............I laid the invitation on his desk and said dont call me, I'll call you. <BR> <BR>To this day, this dealer is still pulling crap like this.

enzostyle 12-18-2007 7:12 AM

If it is a choice between the cyclone and the avalanche, I would go for the Avy! The narrower beam on the cyclone makes for a slightly narrow table. I found that when riding behind it I needed more rope. The bow area is also very small in the cyclone. One of my neighbors has a cyclone and is more of a recreational rider so it is perfect for his crew. <BR> <BR>My 05 Avalanche was one of the best boats I have ever owned. The wakes seemed perfect with just the factory ballst, but for that little extra there is plenty of room for extra ballst. There is so much storage in these boats you will never have fat sacs out in the open. <BR> <BR>At the end of the season I was always amazed at the amount of crap that my wife had stashed away in the boat. <BR> <BR>What people have said about the boats being sensitve to weight placement is very true but no big deal really. Just tell people where to sit so the wake does not wash out. <BR> <BR>I have a 230 Enzo now and would only give it up for a 24 footer! If only the wife was on board with my plan.<img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/biggrin.gif" border=0>

cbk 12-18-2007 1:09 PM

Tige Mike - what part of NC are you in? I have a friend who is on Wylie alot.

soak_up_the_sun 12-18-2007 2:24 PM

We have an '04 Enzo, bought it new in '06. We love it. No problems to speak of (knock on wood!), the walk-through under the back pad is awesome, and the amount of storage is excellent. We have had zero complaints on the wake, except for me. I'm a wuss, and not a good wakeboarder and think it's too big, even without ballast! <BR>I would highly recommend them.

treycleaton 12-18-2007 5:18 PM

Tige Mike-hope that wasn't GetWet Marine outside of G'boro. That's the closest Centurion dealer, and I hope to hear good things about their service...

chpthril 12-18-2007 5:56 PM

Team CBK, <BR> <BR>That's our home lake. We try to ride year round since we have a power plant hot-hole but has been low all summer and only 1 ramp open now. <BR> <BR>Cosmocat, <BR> <BR>Not them, but located on Lake Norman. They used to have CC til this fall. Now my Tige dealer is the new CC dealer for this area.

famlyboader 12-18-2007 7:14 PM

I agree with some of the post above , i think alot of people that own centurions spend more time riding instead of bashing other people and their boats....myself i like looking at all of the makes and models of different boats. hey Nate if you read this post im working on re- doing that mistake i made will yell at you soon,thanks for being patient. my 2 cents, you cant go wrong with these boats...very solid and very nice wake...a goood dealer makes all the diffrence in the world. Here is a pict of my 06 avalanche..love it!!! my so called buddies have started calling it the great pumpkin...thats ok only have one word for them......BOO!!! <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/528717.jpg" alt="Upload">

deltaboy 12-18-2007 9:18 PM

Great looking boat Rodney I see you are into racks of all sorts of sizes too <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" border=0>

steedracer 12-18-2007 9:35 PM

Rodney, One look at your picture and I knew you had to be a Volunteer fan. Nice looking boat, except it wouldn't look good in Tuscaloosa! Don't know what part of TN you are in, but I'm in Nashville and get over to East TN quite a bit. Keep the Centurion faith alive! <BR> <BR>PS The Enzo got hosed by Wakeboard mag buyer's guide. It is a Core boat for sure!!

sailing216 12-19-2007 6:09 AM

The beam on the Avy was the deciding factor over buying a Cyclone or Elite V. Thought about stepping up to an Enzo 23, but my tow rig is already maxed out and a foot and a few thousand I really didn't need. <BR>I have a lot of respect for many boats. I don't bash any other manufactures. Each does something well and it's about having fun and riding.

midlifecrisis 12-19-2007 11:03 AM

07 Avy C4 owner (see profile for pic). The entire family loves the boat and all of my WB buds (they are all in their 30's or 40's so they are easy to please) who have been towed behind every wb boat out there have nothing but compliments on the fit, finish, wake, etc. Like everybody else, I do not bash other makes but I have to say I have had no regrets

bmartin 12-21-2007 6:13 AM

I have had 2 Centurions. Currently in an '04 Lightning. I would buy from their line again and think they are one of the best values out there. <BR> <BR>A lot of positive has already been said that I agree with, especially the great surf waves. One thing to note though, is that the Centurions in general tend to be more sensitive to weight distribution than say MC, BUs, Supras, and Moombas. Shift the weight a little and the wakes can roll over and get foamy and the drivers side wake (port?) is especially prone to this. The more weight you put in, the more sensitive the wake becomes based on my experience. Not a big issue, but you do have to get people sitting in the right places to have a big clean wakeboard wake. I do not know if this is the case for Enzos - still waiting for my first pull behind one.

soak_up_the_sun 12-21-2007 10:23 AM

AtTheLake: <BR>So come on over to Bull Shoals, we'll give you a pull. Well, when the water temp gets up a bit!<img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" border=0>

xstarrider 12-23-2007 9:36 AM

Here's my late take afetr selling both Centurions and Nautis and owning 4 Centurions. <BR> <BR>The Nautis are a great top quality boat. You can't argue with that. They are tried and proven. The wake is arguably one of the best (I say this because it can be argued all day which is the best all personal preference on shape). I would say the older style Nauti though a favorite boat by many is more of a one dimensional boarding boat. It excels in boarding and is a rock solid performance machine in that real. <BR> <BR>Centurions offer you a much more multi level performance boat. They have stepped up their quality over the years 10 fold and I now believe they are a contender with the top 3. Don't think they are quite there yet, but very very very close. The Centurions do a bunch of things well..... put out a great wakeboarding wake for a variet of levels (wouldn't classify the Cyclone's as pro caliber, but it def has advanced capabilities), ride like a dream in chop and through the double up, and put out THE BEST surf wakes out there. <BR> <BR>I think if you are looking for a pure boarding performance machine the Nauti is def hard to beat it wil take all the weight you ant to throw in it a just produce a clean crisp monster, but if you are looking for a top quality multi purposea boat Centurion will win out everytime. <BR> <BR>(Message edited by xstarrider on December 23, 2007)

882001 12-23-2007 9:53 AM

good post swatguy.

xstarrider 12-23-2007 12:58 PM

sorry for the typos guys...... was in a bit of a hurry

jon_a 12-23-2007 3:12 PM

are Centurions NMMA certified? I couldn't find anything about it on their website.

bigshow 12-23-2007 3:16 PM

Pretty much all manufactures are NMMA certified. They have a link to the NMMA on their web site.

krbaugh 12-23-2007 3:16 PM

Yes they have been for the last few years

czap 12-23-2007 6:52 PM

hows about somw wakeboard wake pics? I rode the enzo and it was freakin huge with stock..

freefly70 12-24-2007 9:21 AM

Did a test drive and was very impressed!! Leaning to a cyclone or a 20v. Seem to be more multi use boats for a small family such as mine.

onlyvdrivescom 12-24-2007 10:41 AM

Surfed an Enzo and it was rediculous. The wake was a bit wide for my likings, but a sweet boat non the less. Very roomy!

cbk 12-24-2007 8:27 PM

I have been riding an Avalanche for the last two years and I love everything about it. I run stock triple ballast an extra 500lbs. and 2 to 3 people and the wake is incredible. I have been behind a large number of boats...VLX, X-Star etc. and the Avy will hold it's own any day and it doesn't need a ton of extra weight. Good luck with the purchase man.

wakeboardern1 12-24-2007 8:52 PM

I'm looking at an 05 Cyclone as well. It's in my price range, since we'll have to sell our two boats combined to afford it, but both are old boats and should net around 25-30k. I wonder if there's any chance that we're looking at the same Cyclone Beer Good. You wouldn't happen to be looking at the one from Lake Gaston Water Sports? Or is yours at a Florida dealer? I hope it's a Florida dealer, cause I've been searching high and low for a newer boat that's in the range I need. It doesn't matter, you found it first, but we can all dream. <BR> <BR>After reading all of these posts, I see that the Cyclone isn't the best, but I just need a casual boat to go riding behind that throws a good wake.

cbk 12-25-2007 6:21 AM

Beer Good and Nick - Don't under estimate the Cyclone. It will hang with all of them. It's just a smaller boat, but the wakes can get real steep.

xstarrider 12-25-2007 10:08 AM

Yup the Cyclone is a core boarder boat in my opinion. The wakes are steep and poppy. I wouldn't say it is pro caliber, but it def has advanced capabilities, and like I and others have said before..... as far a versatility the Cylone is one of the top 20ft'rs that performs on a much bigger scale.

freefly70 12-25-2007 5:39 PM

Nick I am in Tampa Florida. Your good I am pretty impressed with centurion. I will send you a PM. <BR> <BR>Beer is GOOD!!!

p_e_ski 12-31-2007 7:44 PM

Wouldn't trade my 04 cyclone in for anything. We just keep adding little things to upgrade it. Over 350 hours on the 350 MAG and roars like a big cat. have fun with it.

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