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-   Archive through June 21, 2006 (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=339308)
-   -   Fresh Air Exhaust?? Has anyone installed this? (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=334782)

moondoggie 06-12-2006 4:51 PM

WaterSki Magazine has an ad in their May 06' Issue about a fresh air exhaust system that reduces Carbon monoxide approx. 90% and Noise pollution by 75%. It is a bolt on system to your exhaust pipes that basically pushes exhaust below the waterline when boat planing occurs, keeping the exhaust below the waterline. We do a lot of Wake surfing, and this really interests me if it works. My question is, has anyone seen this product before or had it installed on their boat? their website is freshairexhaust.com. I would like to see any feedback to help me decide if this is good for my boat. I own a 2000 x-star. On the website, they claim the low end torque actually is improved, although the top end speed would be reduced slightly, with out affecting the shape of the wake or the steering. Let me know what you think.

99_slaunch 06-12-2006 5:33 PM

My friend put one on a 94 SN and said it was worth every dime.

stuarts1 06-13-2006 9:30 PM

had one installed last year...couldnt imagine boating without...absolute must have...second only to perfect pass for boarding/surfing

ktmwakeboarder 06-14-2006 3:59 AM

My buddy Gordon has one installed on his Nautique, very sweet. No info on the torque or top end speed, sorry. Is effective in reducing the CO <IMG SRC="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" ALT=":-)" BORDER=0> <BR> <BR>I don't know about it reducing the pollution however, as it will be produced no matter what into the water. Maybe I'm mistaken, but it seems like it is pumping it straight into the water.

moondoggie 06-14-2006 12:24 PM

Yes, it would be pumping straight into the water, but would/should not be in the air that a Wakesurfer would breathe. I went ahead and ordered one for my x-star. I am excited to see how well it works.

06-14-2006 1:58 PM

I hope you didnt spend too much on it! A must have? Sorry i had to laugh at that one!

moondoggie 06-14-2006 2:15 PM

$365 is not a bad investment to me. If I can keep Fumes/Carbon Monoxide to a minimum, and Have it quieter so the rider can hear the tunes better, I figure it is worth it....

acurtis_ttu 06-14-2006 2:21 PM

I'm with Kyle on this one, I'm sure it does what it claims, but I've never once felt or has anyone I known of, felt or looked like they were being "poisioned" by exhaust gas. Plus IMO it looks ridiculous. I also ride in a shollow river (avg 6 feet or so) this looks like a potential hazzard as something that adds additonal draft onto the boat. No thanks.

tomcalabria 06-14-2006 3:05 PM

Kyle and Adam, <BR> <BR>you should do some research on this before you spread a negative vibe on a great product that could become a future must have on all boats. By the way every year people do get sick and some even die from C02 (granted that it is from teaksurfing or hanging out on the swimplatform when the boat is running). Secondly, even if you were in shallow water, this would not be a problem look under your boat and see what would get hit first: the fresh air exhaust or your prop? <BR> <BR>Also think about the quality of your sound system if you eliminate a lot of the exhaust noise. <BR> <BR>If you are wakesurfing a lot, I think this is a must have. Yes, I am in the process of installing one as well! <BR> <BR>$365.00!!, we spend more at the restaurant after wakeboarding/surfing! So not expensive at all!

acurtis_ttu 06-14-2006 3:22 PM

I thought the gadget stuck down further, your right Tom. My sound system is fine the way it is, and have gotten no complaints. Chris wanted to know what I thought of it, I gave my opinion. Most statistics are biased...I have no idea where they got there info of the CO2 PPM numbers, and I'm sure ther are freak incidents where people get sick and potential die from CO2 inhalation on a boat. But I also don't routinely spend $365 at a rest/bar after I'm done riding either, maybe this is why I think it's a waste of $$$? <BR> <BR>(Message edited by acurtis_ttu on June 14, 2006)

tomcalabria 06-14-2006 3:38 PM

Adam imagine this, you are in your living room listening to music on your kick ass home theater and someone comes in with a blender and is mixing cocktails (boy, am I addicted to partying). You can still listen to the music and it will sound good but when you turn off the blender, it sounds a whole lot better. People spend so much money on their sounds systems (better wiring, amps speakers, etc). My buddy just spent over $1200.00 on a amp. IMO This seems like a much cheaper way to get a clearer sound.

06-14-2006 3:48 PM

If you can hear you exhaust over you "sound system" i think you need to upgrade your speakers and amps. <BR> <BR>Im not into doing research on this product i just thought it was funny that someone thought fresh air exhaust was on the same page as pp. Perfect pass is a must have not fresh air exhaust.

michale 06-14-2006 3:57 PM

IMO if you surf behind your boat then fresh air exhaust is 2nd right behind p.p.

houdini 06-14-2006 8:43 PM

i think fresh air exhaust is a great idea for the sound quality. i just got my boat and it came with 4 6.5 tower speakers... they are nice, but really not that loud when i am boarding. you dont realize it until you are out there, but the boat is loud. if i could quiet it down a bit, that would be fantastic - cheaper than upgrading my sound system.

clubmyke 06-14-2006 11:44 PM

this sounds like a very good accoustical treatment, improves air quality, increases passenger / rider enjoyment, and saves lives.... <BR> <BR>~ my concern is what are the drawbacks (everything has a drawback) <BR>has any of the big 3 manufactures commented on this in regards to warranty? any possible damage to the motor ?

tomcalabria 06-15-2006 3:37 AM

I contacted Calabria directly and they said that the install would not negate the warranty. I think that you should contact your boat manufacturer to be sure.

houdini 06-15-2006 6:23 AM

i have heard that literally the only drawback is 1-2 mph top speed decrease. while this may hurt your kite tubing, i doubt any of us really care. <BR> <BR>if that is the only drawback and it doesn't hurt the boat at all, i wouldnt be surprised to see these (or an adaptation of them) factory on some new boats, or at least an option.

06-15-2006 11:24 AM

How many pepole have you heard of getting co2 poisioning from wakesurfing? So if we are going to do this just as a precaution then you might want to think about a prop gaurd to make sure no one gets hurt by the prop.

michale 06-15-2006 11:42 AM

I have had several headaches after surfing for a couple hours. I used to attribute it to dehydration or all the drugs I did in the 80s but once I installed f.e.a. no more headaches.M.

moondoggie 06-15-2006 12:28 PM

IF, and only "IF" the product does what it says it does, does not negate the warranty, does not impede performance, it is a no brainer to me. That is why I asked for opinion or if someone is currently using it. Engine noise is always loud when you are boarding, and the CO2 benefit is just a bonus. I was actually thinking of this product more for quieting the engine noise down once on plane, than the health benefits. I spoke with Portland Ski Boat Center (mastercraft Dealer) and had asked him if had heard of this product. He hadn't but was very interested and wanted me to get him on their webpage so he could do some research. We chatted while he was online and he thought the idea was a great one if the product worked as described. I am going to have them install it for me, and give them feedback as to if they would want to sell these in their store. who knows what will come of it. But it is worth a try. We can't ever find out if something works until we try it. That is how wakeboarding became a sport right? and that is how we are always seeing something new. inventions are what makes things safer/better/easier for all of us.

regalado1 06-15-2006 12:44 PM

Seems like you could make this yourself for alot less then $350 or so. Doesn't look like theres really anything to it. Has anyone made their own?

smokedog2 06-15-2006 12:59 PM

I have one. Works great but the clamps to the exhaust ports need to be tightened like you mean it. Mine has come off twice from the exhaust exit. Kind of a pain to re-attach. This time I'm not fooling around, we'll see how it holds this weekend under under the load of cub scouts tubing.

99_slaunch 06-15-2006 1:13 PM

My friend was given a money back guarantee when he bought his. The difference was just like the video.

06-15-2006 2:06 PM

Well i hope it works well for all that bought one. But like AnT said why couldnt you just have the local muffler shop make you a couple and weld them on for ya. Prolly be a lot cheaper and wouldnt fall off.

regalado1 06-15-2006 2:18 PM

Yeah. What he said.

moondoggie 06-15-2006 2:28 PM

True Kyle, but it would not have been a tested product and may do damage or hinder performance. I would much rather pay the money on a tested/proven product, than have some guy with a welding hat on, guess on what would work best for my boat.

smokedog2 06-15-2006 2:55 PM

Yea, custom work at less than $400. Folks do that all the time. Go for it. Maybe he could make you a $40 prop as well. I saw a pix of a tower made from 4x4's - that works. Talk to the lumber yard while your at it. <BR> <BR>SD2 <BR> <BR>Oh, I hear a bag of sand works great for an anchor. <BR> <BR> <BR>Wait - old tires for bumpers. I've see that in the movies. <BR> <BR>Us board boat guys - we are all about saving a buck or two. <BR> <BR>What were we talking about?

99_slaunch 06-15-2006 3:48 PM

The averrage boat-$50,000 <BR>sound system -$4,000 <BR>board and bindings-$750 <BR>home made fresh air exhaust PRICELESS!!!!!

regalado1 06-15-2006 3:49 PM

Yeah, what he said.

rake 06-15-2006 8:49 PM

I've got one on my Nautique 2001 (which is for sale BTW - shameless plug) and yes, it definitely quiets the motor down, you can carry on a conversation or hear your tunes even at WOT. <BR> <BR>It also made a huge change for surfing, my boat is narrow so sacking one side basically put one exhaust vent above the water or barely under it piping exhaust right into your face. Surfing for more that 10 - 20 minutes and you would get dizzy or have a headache. Not cool at all. After the FAE you can surf till the boat runs out of gas with no ill effects. <BR> <BR>The reason why you WOULDN'T want to go to a muffler shop and have one welded on is that it is meant to come off if you do hit something that wrecks your prop &amp; rudder, the last thing you would want is it then to tear your transom off because your exhaust system is welded on. Sure when you look at it, you think I could've done this, then go get a quote on the swaging jigs, stainless tubing, etc. and see how much you'd save. Like others have said, you have a 50K boat and this is 350 bucks. <BR> <BR>Maybe if the darwin guy with the Calabira had this system, his son would still be alive today. Just a thought. <BR> <BR>(Message edited by Rake on June 15, 2006) <BR> <BR>(Message edited by Rake on June 15, 2006)

regalado1 06-15-2006 9:09 PM

Well, you all make good points on why not to use any other option but to buy from FAE. But, just to clarify, I wasn't talking about just grabbing some tube and welding it to the exhaust. Or using wood instead. ha ha. I was talking about using good mech techs, certified welders, doing it smartly. Not just slapping some crap together. I mean really. And no to sand bag anchors as well. <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/proud.gif" border=0>

99_slaunch 06-15-2006 10:06 PM

Yeah,what he said.<img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/lol.gif" border=0>

wake_upppp 06-15-2006 10:15 PM

I built one for my 94 Ski Sanger and was just ready to try it when I traded the boat in on my new Sanger. My design would have had no top end mph loss too. I spent about $150 in materials and a days labor to build it. Of course it won't fit the new boat so it sits there... anybody with a mid nineties Sanger in NorCal wanna try it?

maxx_wake 06-16-2006 7:33 AM

This may be a stupid question but couldnt you just buy two of those thick rubber 90 degree elbows from Home Depot and clamp them on? I know it wouldnt redirect the CO but wouldnt you get the same effect as far as the sound levels go?

moondoggie 06-16-2006 8:48 AM

Drag would be a factor, you would have to make them somewhat aerodynamic to limit the amount of drag, like FAE has done.

niap101 06-16-2006 8:25 PM

Sparky Jay <BR> <BR>In all due respects, I have to assume that since you live in N. California and have a new Sanger, you probably make at least, let's say, $20 per hour. It took you a day to make your rip-off so that's $160, plus the $150 in material, for a total of $310. Not all that great a savings. <BR> <BR>Are your materials stainless steel and powder coated? Do you have a functioning mounting system yet? Is it designed to handle the forces that a ski boat can put upon it yet still come loose to protect your boat in case you should strike something? Have you already conducted months worth of testing over several years? <BR> <BR>You can also buy a speed control from J.C. Whitney (catalog) and avoid the expense of a Perfect Pass. Of course the cheap speed control wouldn't work as well as the PP, but at least you could giggle about how you were helping to stifle innovation. <BR>

wake_upppp 06-16-2006 9:03 PM

Actually Larry, twenty an hour was about ten years ago, lol. Unlike FAE, there is most likely no mph loss, so you see, it's not a copy, but I guess in a round about way it is. Like a BMW is a copy of an Edsel, lol. You see Larry, I am aware of patent laws and knew If I changed it up, there is no infringement. Do you even have a patent, just curious. Stainless Isn't needed and yes it would of been powder coated. Yes I had a mounting system that would of gave way under impact. For some of us Larry, it's not about just shelling out the cash and buying everything we want, some of us gain satisfaction in actually building stuff, and in this case possibly improving on it with potentialy no mph loss. It's not like I am going to compete with FAE, lol. Lastly, for now, I'll keep the grand and drive by throttle with a smile! Take it easy man and maybe have your blood pressure checked.<img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/wink.gif" border=0>

wake_upppp 06-16-2006 9:08 PM

P.S. You should consider imitation as a form of flattery, I know I do.

niap101 06-17-2006 6:08 AM

Sparky Jay <BR>Thank you for your concern about my health, but I have no blood pressure issues. The patent office has notified me that a patent can issue. <BR> <BR>While I am in business to have an income, I really do care about the carbon monoxide (CO) exposure that people are subjected to on boats. While most young men (typically the ones reading this) are indestructible (I was), I have more concern for the children. They are more susceptible to CO poisoning. There is also growing concern about the long term health effects of CO and believe it or not, noise. Besides, when you are breathing exhaust fumes, you are also getting exposed to numerous chemicals, some of which are cancer causing. <BR> <BR>On the water we are obnoxious. Our waves are big and our sound is loud. We have seen, and will continue to see, restrictions placed upon when and where we can ride because we are obnoxious. I really donít want to reduce the size of my wake, but now at least my sound isnít so loud on shore. <BR> <BR>Actually, if you have an improvement on my system, I would be pleased to discuss it with you if it is something that would benefit both of us and the customers. Imitation can be a form of flattery, but a rip-off isn't. <BR>

bbr 06-17-2006 8:05 AM

Does anyone know if it has any kind of flapper inside the unit? All boats have them to prevent siphoning back into the motor. It would really suck ass if you bolt this thing on, then you end up putting water into the motor without knowing it. <BR> <BR>I am looking into this product because we do our fair amount of surfing when the water is rough.

fish6942 06-17-2006 8:19 AM

Dateline 1983 - "IBM comes out with a new product called the Personal Computer." Imagine where the PC market would be today if it wasn't for all the "clones" that looked at the IBM design and decided that there were obvious improvements to be made. <BR> <BR>Larry - This is the risk that you take when coming out with anything new and innovative. Consider how many iterations of Perfect Pass have come and gone before the boat manufacturers came out with their own versions. Without a doubt, they used PP as a starting model. Don't take it personally, it's just something you have to get used to as an inventor. <BR> <BR>My money is on the manufacturers going to an underwater exhaust port. It would resemble a scoop that faces rearward and is located near the prop. Shoot - so much for public disclosure of another patent idea.

fullspeed 06-17-2006 10:57 AM

Doesn't look like it would work with the Wedge from the pictures on the website. <BR> <BR>

99_slaunch 06-17-2006 2:25 PM

I think they do make one for the bu with a wedge.

niap101 06-18-2006 9:10 AM

The flapper on a boat's exhaust outlet prevents wave action from "packing" water into the exhaust system while the boat is sitting in the water, without the engine running. A turned down pipe prevents that. Malibu and others have turned down pipes with no flappers as well.

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