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-   Archive through June 21, 2006 (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=339308)
-   -   ...And Then There Was Rear Ballast (http://www.wakeworld.com/forum/showthread.php?t=334565)

wake_upppp 06-11-2006 10:48 PM

Big thanks to Sanger, Mark Semper &amp; John Woods @ Semper Speed &amp; Marine and Mike Seipel and Chris @ Barefoot International/Flyhigh for all the help and patience with my custom 210 rear ballast that I just finished. Mike has outdone himself with this latest round of top guality sacs and fittings. This stuff is SWEET! Let me know what you guys think. <BR> <BR>Switch Panel <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334566.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Intake Fittings <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334567.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334568.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Vent and Drain Fittings (two per side) <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334569.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Intake Pumps <BR> <BR> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334570.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334571.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Intake Pump-Hidden <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334572.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Quick Connect Fittings for Sacs <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334573.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334574.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR>Custom Size Sacs <BR><img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/334575.jpg" alt="Upload"> <BR> <BR>(Message edited by wake_upppp on June 11, 2006)

stevev210 06-11-2006 11:07 PM

Looks Great, I also bought my Sanger from Mark a few years back, great dealership. I did my own rear ballast in my sanger and used the flyhigh sacs also. 16x16x30=280lbs each they fit perfect and I still have room for extra gear. What are your sac dimensions and weight?

norcalmalibu 06-11-2006 11:08 PM

looks great, but why not put the intake on the bottom of the boat with a scoop?

pittsy 06-11-2006 11:11 PM

thats a good question..where the intake are you can't ever pump water into the sacks when the boat is on plane!

yosquire 06-11-2006 11:28 PM

Looks good, clean install.

wake_upppp 06-11-2006 11:30 PM

Steve, our bags are almost identical. Mine are 15x16x31, lol. The math on yours equals 263lbs. Mine are 242lbs, a little more as they "bulge". Chris @ Flyhigh gave me this formula to figure sac weight: cubic feet x 7.47 x 8.34. Yours would be 1.3 x 1.3 x 2.5 = 4.2 x 7.47 equals 31.5 gallons, times 8.34 (1 gallon of water) is 263lbs. Nate, no real benifit to putting the intakes on the bottom, and they would be much harder to install there than the transome. As long as they're below the water line, they self prime and pump fine.

wake_upppp 06-11-2006 11:35 PM

I'm not really sure why I would want to fill while "on plane"? It takes like three minutes to fill the front sac and both rear sacs. It takes my kid twice that long to get his board down off the rack. lol <BR> <BR>(Message edited by wake_upppp on June 11, 2006)

tomcalabria 06-12-2006 2:32 AM

I was thinking of doing the same thing. This looks like such a good job, how much did this whole deal cost? <BR>

walt 06-12-2006 5:41 AM

Very nice Sparky !

wake_upppp 06-12-2006 7:41 PM

Tom, all the parts including custom size sacs were included in the price of my new boat, but I had to do the install. Sanger sent me a box with everything exept the sacs so not sure what all that is worth. The sacs and fittings from FlyHigh were around 500.

ghostrider_2 06-13-2006 2:21 PM

have to give props that is a clean install, and set up..

biz 06-13-2006 4:04 PM

Looks good. Are you using a 4 pump aerator type system? Two for filling and two for emptying? <BR>Can you post pics of the emptying pumps and the routing of the hoses for these pumps as well as the vent hoses. Any pics of the vent and emptying hose outlets inside the boat? I am in the development stages of a system that will be similiar to yours and i want to get it right the first time. <BR> <BR>(Message edited by BIZ on June 13, 2006) <BR> <BR>(Message edited by biz on June 13, 2006)

wake_upppp 06-13-2006 7:13 PM

TR, let me answer your ?'s in order. Yes, 4 pump aerator system. Two for filling and two for emptying. If you look in the pics of the hoses you will see the emptying pumps sitting just slightly under the back seat area and to the outside of the boat. They are just laying on the floor. The fill hoses run up from the fill pump and along the underside of the gunnel to the front inside bottom corner of each sac. The drain and vent just run up to the thru hull fittings and that's about it. Really the only thing to keep in mind is that this type of pump is NOT self priming, therefore they must be located below the water line to prime, (for the fill), or at the bottom of the sac, (for the drain). Hope this helps you TR.

stevev210 06-13-2006 11:16 PM

Sparky, Is that a mirror mount on your tower? If so which one did you go with?

fill_er_up 06-14-2006 7:15 AM

Sparky, great info... 2 'mo ques on your project: Do you need a check valve or something to keep the water from going back out the fill pump? And, what fills your front ballast? Is it served by one of the two transom pumps or ?

shagman 06-14-2006 10:13 AM

Take a look and you can clearly see a valve right in front of the fill pumps. <BR>Sparky, thanks for posting this up, there's a good chance I'll be doing something exactly like this. It's funny because when I've asked around everyone said that there wasn't room under the floor for any significant amount of ballast.

sanger215guy 06-14-2006 10:54 AM

Sparky, <BR>Nice work, I two have installed my own system I have the 400lb X-series in each rear locker with the quick connects. the other thing I added recently to really fill the sacs to max was a check valve in the breather line. Since it is pressur activated it lets the sac expand be for it starts pushing out water.

goodfoot00 06-14-2006 11:42 AM

Nicely done. I am finishing up a similar project on my Nautique SuperSport. Do your vent &amp; empty thru-hulls have screens too? I haven't seen that type. Where can I find them?

wake_upppp 06-14-2006 7:14 PM

JB, good question about the drain back through the fill pump. The first time I filled them I noticed they lost a little after the pump was turned off. I realized it was draining back, so I filled then full again and just closed each valve and that stopped the drain back issue. I suppose you could install a one way check ball in the fill line also. The front ballast is stock and also has two of the same pumps filling and draining it. Steve, it's one of Skylon's mirror mounts. I sent a link to Walt. I think he bought one too. Nick, I'm not sure if you misunderstood me but only the fill pumps are hidden, not the sacs. Gary, where did you get the check valve? Scott, no screens on the vent and empty thru hulls. <BR> <BR>(Message edited by wake_upppp on June 14, 2006)

sanger215guy 06-14-2006 9:03 PM

I did install one way valves on both the fill and the breather. Both were just in the plumbing isle at ACE, about $4.00 each. The ones on the fill are 1 1/4" slime line but are hidden in the same location as yours (almost). The breather are just 3/4" slime line and I put them just befor the thru-hull fitting tucked under the gunnel. I also added recently a in line ball valve to close off the drain to keep from blowing through the drain pump. I am currently looking for a good price on the 12 v solinoid valves that will open and close when I turn on the pumps to eliminate the manual action. I recomend the 1100 rule or the 2000 GHP rule (thats what I run). Both pumps fill quick and empty quick.

goodfoot00 06-15-2006 7:34 AM

I purchased my 1" solinoid valves from STC valves for $76ea. This was half the price of ASCO valves and they work great. <BR> <BR>Here's the link <a href="http://www.stcvalve.com/I-Solenoid-spec-2W-2S.htm" target="_blank">http://www.stcvalve.com/I-Solenoid-spec-2W-2S.htm</a>

fill_er_up 06-17-2006 6:41 AM

Sparky, thanks again for posting your project. Can anyone answer these: <BR> <BR>What is "slime line"? <BR> <BR>What is the purpose of the 12v solenoid valve and would it require another switch? <BR> <BR>Does an aerator pump like these located near the transom have any issue pushing water all the way up front to the bow sac?

wake_upppp 06-17-2006 9:41 AM

JB, I'll take the last one. When I talked to Sure-Flo about this particular pump filling my sacs from the bottom they said if you aimed the hose straight up it would stop pumping at a hieght of fifteen feet. So every foot of elevation from the pump you lose some pressure. My feeling is you would be fine filling the front sac from the rear of the boat but why not locate the pumps near the sac? You need a drain pump that needs to be right of the sac anyway. Put a thru hull with a ball valve in the bottom (under water line) in front near the sac and fill off that.

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