Any tips that have worked for you? <BR> <BR>I am about 4 inches away on both tricks and can't seem to close the gap. I think it has something to do with the way I leave the wake but just haven't been able to figure it out.

you can do what I did for a melan crow.....but be prepared to under-rotate and come up short a few times before you actually land it (depending on how solid your crows are). <BR> <BR>the key, which I'm sure you've already heard, is to get the grab first. if you initiate the flip, rotation, whatever before you get the grab, you will chase it all the way through to the landing and never get it. so what I was told was to concentrate ONLY on the grab and "inititating" the roll. DO NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT LANDING IT....that must be secondary to the grab. Like I said, I came up short 3 or 4 times but landed it in that first set. Now, I will say that I don't always get the grab because sometimes I get lazy....but when I do get it, it's only because I put the grab first and the flip second. Good Luck!

thanks! Yeah I know you're supposed to grab first, but I've never quite understood how to make that happen. <BR> <BR>With the tantrum I was told to push down hard as Im leaving the wake, and that is helping. I'll give it a shot with the crow. Mine are pretty solid one handed or two, so I think if I focus on grabbing right off the wake like you said then maybe it will work...I'll let you know.

cool. and I think wrapping your mind around "grabbing first" is all about the trick becoming easier and, as they say, slowing down for you. once your perception of the trick slows down enough, you'll find that you have plenty of time to grab then flip. <BR> <BR>oh....and the same thing will work on the crow as the tantrum.....make sure you have plenty of weight....plenty.......no, even more than you think!...on your front foot and then stomp it in the trough and it will help bring the board up to your hand. <BR> <BR>also...if you can get the grab without even trying to flip, it may help? sometimes it helps to do a couple of w2w grabs in the same spot with the same hand and then come right back and try it with the flip. do it!

p.s. I forgot that was you....but what an awesome deal you started with the boardshort give-a-way....mad props!!! <img src="http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/clipart/happy.gif" border=0>

Andrea, that pic of you and that grab on your profile rocks! Nicely done!

Eric- I have been super focused on grabbing right off the wake, and it is working. I haven't grabbed it yet but my rotation has definitely changed for the better and I am super close. I think I just have to push down even harder off the wake. <BR>Thanks for the help, I'll let you know when I make contact...should be any day. <BR> <BR>Keith- thanks!

that's awesome andrea! it's funny that you said your rotation has changed becuase that's the first thing i noticed after i starting concentrating on the grab first....it feels like a LOT less line tension and the landings are so much softer! <BR> <BR>one more thing to think about (or do).....when your in the water waiting for the boat to come get you, get upright in the water with your board under you.....now bring your front knee up and reach for the grab while sitting there. what this made me realize is how far up i actually had to bring my knee before the grab was even possible....it might surprise you how scrunched up you have to be! good luck....and keep this thread posted....i'll check back.

When you go to do the trick with a grab just make it way more compact than is needed...i had issues too because in my head i must have thought my arms were super long.... <BR> <BR>just do a few where you really ball up and will prob. over-rotate because you're so tightly packed... but once you get the feel for where you have to be at muscle memory takes over and you don't have to thing about it.