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WakeWorld Discussion Board » >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive » Archive through April 26, 2009 » SAN #3 « Previous Next »
By Rob (robandrus) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 12:02 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
The other thread has gotten too long. I'm starting over. My question is on the hard tanks. I'm seriously torn. I bought 3 540# bags. I'm tempted to just ditch the hard tanks and go with the bags, but I'm worried about using the stock areator pumps with just the bags, and I'll need to figure something out for the locker bag. By the way the bags were only $45 each from Wakegiant.com.

Or should I keep the hard tanks and put a pair of 350# bags on top of them? (I already have the 350's in my maristar and I can switch them out.)

Does anyone have experience with this? Thanks

 
By Rob (robandrus) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 12:13 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
For the complete history click on these.

http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/664579.html?1233484925
http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/3183/674675.html?1236865336

 
By Scott (K.B.C.) (sperbet) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 12:39 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I'd just ditch the hard tanks. My buddy has 750s plugged into the stock system/pumps on his 02 and it works just fine
 
By D.F.T.R. Josh (downfortheride) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 1:35 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Rob ~~ You ready to ride a SANTE this Sunday? You would make 4 and you need to see what kind of Gem your working with. Let's do this!
 
By Rob (robandrus) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 1:59 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Josh, you're insane. Fricken cold today, snowing tomorrow and Saturday, I'm worried about having any water in my engine block for fear of cracking it and you're out ridding. I'll post some pictures of the powder up in the mountains when I'm snowmobiling instead. If all this global warming keeps up there will be no summer left in Utah.
 
By steve smith (210hippy) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 2:10 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I have the same dilemma,Rob.Normally I run 2-350s full on top of my emty hard tanks,550 in the middle locker,2-300 up front.This is perfect for me.I can get more air than I can handle.If you want more,fill the hard tanks and a little more up front.I must warn you that anything more than 1800 is downright scary-huge.Last summer I went with hard tanks full,350s above them half full,550 in center locker,200 up front. I did this so I could get the weight I wanted,yet empty the hardtanks when pulling newbs.At $4/gal.I felt I needed to do this.
 
By Rob (robandrus) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 2:51 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Steve, I love your profile pic. I just hope that someday I'm so blessed to have that setup out back. Do you still have the stock pumps or are you running something else? I'm wondering how much value there is in the guages for the tanks? 200#s on each side is not a lot. I'm wondering if I could plumb the locker sack to the others or if I should just buy a couple more pumps. I know it can be done better, but I'm over budget already.
 
By pete c (saceone) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 3:10 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
can anyone post a pic of the vdrive space without the hardtanks?
 
By D.F.T.R. Josh (downfortheride) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 4:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Rob ~~ When there is no ice and good weather we ride. Sunday looks to be the best day and we will be out as long as the wind is down. We can handle this cold weather, nobody on the lake to F the water up .
If your over budget I would skip the extra weight and just pump a bag in the ski locker every time. At stock weight the wake is VERY nice and will send you flying. Like I said, come take a pull behind a stock weight SANTE and then see if you want the space or fill it with bags. Hell I bet david will fill his 1500 lbs on top of his stock and it's crazy big.
Post up some pics on www.downfortheride.com of your snow riding, should go good with out wake sessions when we post em up.

Pete ~~ Check out his old threads he posted up above here.

 
By steve smith (210hippy) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 4:50 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Rob, Yes I still use my stock pumps for the hard tanks. I have a 750 gph pump that runs off 12 volt cig lighter on dash, I would fill the 350 bags 1/2 full permanently. Then I fill the hard tanks full. This way you can just empty the hard tanks when towing. I wouldn't even mess with emptying the 1/2 full bags.The gauges work well when filling(evening out port to starboard), but not when emptying. I wish Nautique would just make 400lbs hard tanks.
 
By steve smith (210hippy) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 5:25 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Upload
 
By coinless (bruce) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 7:14 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I have a 2000 SAN and have the hard tanks with bags plumbed on top. The overflow hose of the tank fills the bag so that setup is functional. The main negative is you lose the ability to see how full it is without raising the hatch. I find I'm always checking it and asking people to move and sort it all out. Plus you have no way to easily let ballast out for other riders or surfing. You'd have to life the hatch and eyeball it. I just don't enjoy monkeying around with it all.

If you just had bags, and you leave the pump on and your overflow tube is kinked or the check valve is jacked up then you have a huge water balloon about to pop.

I'm not sure how much (if any) advantage there is with getting rid of the hard tanks. Space I guess is one, but laying all your gear on top of your redneck ballast system isn't that big of an advantage for me.

 
By Swatguy (xstarrider) on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 10:09 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Rob,

You can use the stock lines. The naught should have manual valvesto stop siphoning in that year. Just add the sacs. Most people are doing this these days as you can get more weight back there and have space when they are empty for trips. If you don't have the manual valves(ie the nauty dials which I am sure that model did) you need to put a one way check valve on the fill line to prevent it from siphoning back out with the bags.

You could piggy back the 350's onto the hard tanks but then you have to manually empty them which would be a pain if you ask me. If It were me would ditch the hard tanks and add the 540 sacs.



(Message edited by xstarrider on April 02, 2009)

 
By Joe H (superairdawg) on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 3:31 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I left my hard tanks in because A) I didn't want to go to the effort to yank them, and B) I like that they're pretty much automatic -- they fill and drain very easily and I can see how much they have via that gauges. I have bags on top that use separate pumps but I only put water in those to level the boat from side to side.

You've done a fantastic job with that boat!!

 
By David (dhorton) on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 7:55 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Rob here are a couple pics of my locker sac install. I put a scooped through hull fitting with a sea cock valve into the locker. Filling and emptying is achieved by 2 tsunami 800 gpm aerators. I ran the empty and vent lines behind the kick panel and out two additional through hulls on either side of the forward bilge through hull. I went with the Fly High rear seat sac as it fit the locker of my '02 SAN perfectly. In this pic you can see the fill pump and empty pump as well as the manual valve on the through hull.
Upload

In this pic you can see the fill line fitting, the vent line fitting, and the line running between them is from the empty pump.
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by the way, the locker sac and the rear hard tanks is all i typically run, unless surfing. i have run up to an additional 1500 on top of this and the wake just keeps getting bigger.

(Message edited by dhorton on April 03, 2009)

 
By Rob (robandrus) on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 11:11 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Dave, what kind of fittings are those on top of the sacs? Are they available at Lowes, Home Depot etc?

I think I'm just about resolved to leave the hard tanks with the 350's on top. Just because it is closest to stock. I'll plumb in a bag for the locker. But I'm also gonna hide a couple sandbags behind the hard tanks in the extra space. I'll run this for a while and switch later if I decide. Its tough when I've never actually been out in the boat to judge well.

 
By Swatguy (xstarrider) on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 11:22 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Rob,

Those fittings are from Fly High and NOT available in hardware stores. Not sure on the exact bags you have, but a barbed fitting would work best rather then the blue waterbed nozzel. Those you can get at HD, Lowes Menards in their PVC sections. They just give you a way more secure fit then the blue waterbed fitting.

 
By Rob (robandrus) on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 12:24 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I usually take a piece of 3/4" pvc with a little silicone around it and it fits perfect. I'll check out the barbed fittings.
 
By David (dhorton) on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 2:03 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
http://www.wakeside.com/product/boat/ballast/ballast_fittings/fly+high+pro+x+1%22+quick+release+connector.do
http://www.wakeside.com/product/boat/ballast/ballast_fittings/fly+high+pro+x+1%22+elbow+quick+connect.do
These are the fitting in the pics i posted

(Message edited by dhorton on April 03, 2009)

 
By Rob (robandrus) on Monday, April 06, 2009 - 6:52 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
NEW PICS! Yesterday was really nice, I spent all day working on it and made some real headway. I painted the other side of the trailer. Fixed the old tongue jack. Then I got to work on the ballast system. The stock system is just weird to me. I drew some diagrams of how it works but heres a simple explanation of the stock nautique system from 2000.

Underhull scooper to the fill pump. Fill pump directly into the empty pump. Empty pump to a "T" into the tanks. The tanks have a oneway brass check valve for over flow. They also have a vent line running to the knobs behind the drivers seat that lets air in to allow the water to empty when open. In the closed position it does not allow air into the tanks which creates a vacuum. Seems like a strange system to me.

My new system:
Intake to the fill pump. Fill pump to a oneway brass check valve. Check valve to a manifold that pumps to the new belly bag. (With a cut off valve in the ski-locker. Also maifold to the tanks. Tanks to bags. Bags to overflow. Last, manifold to empty pump. Empty pump is at the lowest point in the boat. (Note) The second brass check valve is on the belly bag which will exit out the drain from the glovebox. That bag is the lowest and should empty first so I want the check valve there. The stock venting system should be irrelevant now.

Here are the pics!
Getting Ready
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Old Faded Paint
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Stock End Cap
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My Replacement End Cap made from ABS
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I need to redo the gray pin striping? Anyone done this?
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(Message edited by robandrus on April 06, 2009)

 
By pete c (saceone) on Monday, April 06, 2009 - 6:56 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
looking good mate!
 
By Rob (robandrus) on Monday, April 06, 2009 - 7:07 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Trailer Painted
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Powerwashing the panels beside the engine
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The Boy playing R2D2
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Diagrams of the Ballast System
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Mock up of the manifold
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The Ballast Install!
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Starting to come together!
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By pete c (saceone) on Monday, April 06, 2009 - 7:39 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
hahah bucket head that was funny
 

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