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WakeWorld Discussion Board » >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive » Archive through December 26, 2006 » MC 205V Bow filler sub box DIY « Previous Next »
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:31 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey all!

I'm making version 2.0 of my bow filler sub box. My current version (1.0) is a down-firing box. Vers. 2.0 is a rear-firing design. I'll be using my Kicker Comp CVR12 from the previous design.

The box is being made out of 3/4" MDF and when finished it will be entirely fiberglass epoxy sealed inside and out and all seams will be glued, screwed, and caulked (inside or out). The top plates will also get a layer of fiberglass for overkill and a layer of marine carpet to touch it off.

All box building materials bought at Lowe's.

Just like the first one, it isn't pretty until complete. So, please forgive me as I'm not an expert wood crafter and don't have all the tools to make the job easier or as clean as it could be.

Just for reference, here are a couple pictures of Version 1.0...down-firing version.
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By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
OK...let's get started.
I used a cardboard template to make the bottom plate cutout. I forgot I had the snap-out carpet I could have traced too.
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Here's the base plate dry fit check.
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Since I already had the bow filler cushion setup, I could use the cushion base-plate as part of the template for my top plate design.
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When making the top plate, be sure to remember the bow walkway extends back further than the cushion base-plate. You'll have to make a template for the extra length.
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By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:35 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Here are a few pictures of the top plate dry fit. Please note there is clearance all around for fiberglass wrap and carpet wrap.

If you were making a down-firing design, this would be your finished top plate, but since I'm not I have more work to do.
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By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:38 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Here's a picture of forward side wall construction. Pay special attention to the height of the sidewalls. You'll want some clearance off the floor for water drainage and have to account for top and bottom plate thickness to make sure the overall height works out.

If making a down-firing box, you have to make sure you have extra clearance off the floor and have the required amount of sub mounting depth.
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Here's the box with the remaining side walls built. Note the ~4" step up. This is to accommodate the overall diameter of the 12" sub. The step height will end up being level with the top of the installed cushion. My only concern is that this could be a trip hazard.
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Here's a top down view of the assembled bottom portion. It is fully sealed with epoxy resin and caulked.
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Here's a front view. The cutout is for the jack.
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By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:40 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Here's the cushion top plate. Since you want to be sure the entire internal sub area to be completely sealed, the vertical section is to create a seal from the rest of the box for the cup-holder area. It will become more clear later.
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Here's a top down view to show sub mounting depth clearance. It is important to make sure you have proper sub mounting depth, cup holder clearance (if installing), and also be sure to dry fit where the end of the cushion is. This was somewhat of a balancing act, but turned out OK.
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Here's a close-up. You may note that I'm using 1/4" plywood for the front cup holder wall. This was in part do to the balancing act I spoke of. It's not a critical section of the box, so it's OK. It will be plenty strong once is fiberglassed in and epoxied.
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By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:41 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Final pictures for tonight...

This picture is of the fully assembled dry fit test. Note the cup holder cutout holes. The cup holders will sit in a sealed channel. I may add a drainage hole since they might be prone to take on some water, but again...it will be completely sealed with fiberglass epoxy.
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Top overview of dry fit...with cup holders set in place.
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Side view...
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That's all for tonight. It's downstairs with glue drying after cushion plate attachment.

More later!

 
By Red Sovine (san210nut) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:47 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thanks for the write-up!
 
By J B (mnwakerider) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:49 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
This is a great idea. I think this will be my next project. Did you ever want to make the aft-sub space into some kind of storage place. I dont know how big it is or if you find it necessary, just a thought.

Overall great work, and your wood craftsmanship is great, we cant all have the workshops of the our dreams. Props!

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:50 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
No problem. I'll post more pics as I move along.

It's not as much weight as a sac in the walkway, but I found out my 1st version weighed about 45lbs. I figure this one will push over the 50lbs mark (thicker and more material).

It, at least, makes a good rumble seat!

 
By J B (mnwakerider) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:52 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Yea, and you could fill the rest of the box with some lead, and your weight would get up there...
 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:54 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
JB... the sub needs all the internal volume the box can give it. So, no...no thoughts of storage.

Just to clarify, the first 2 pictures are of the box I built last year and ran this year. It was a down-firing sub. The new one I'm building will be a rear-firing sub.

 
By J B (mnwakerider) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 7:56 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Gotcha,
Thanks for the clarification.

 
By greg (malibususpect) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 8:36 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Paul - how do you like that kicker sub? i was thinking about getting the same one for our boat project and was wondering how well it sounds, also how much power do you have running to it (RMS/Peak)?
 
By Nate (norcalmalibu) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 8:44 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
wow great job! Why the switch from the downfiring to the rear firing?
 
By Mikeski (mikeski) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 9:40 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Great job Paul! Really cool of you to post your project. Looks like about 2 cubic feet, have you considered porting it? Also you may want to consider putting drain tubes on the cupholders to give water/beer a place to go when it gets spilled or if it ever sees rain.

Please keep us posted. This thing should work well using the walk through as a horn!

 
By Craig Stra... (yosquire) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 9:47 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Very cool, I've thought about doing this same thing so this give me good ideas!
 
By Todd (snyper1d) on Monday, November 06, 2006 - 9:54 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Good Idea, but it takes up room for fat sacks! JK great job.
 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Tuesday, November 07, 2006 - 3:42 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Greg...the Kicker sub has been great. I thought about switching to a 12" Kicker solobaric, but resisted for now. I can still do so later if I decide. The amp powering the sub is a Hifonics Brutus BX 605. 500-Watts at 1-Ohm.

Nate...the switch was mainly just to try something new. I also think I built the down-firing box a little too tight as it seemed to jump when hitting hard. If I were to put it back in, I'd probably create some slop so air could move a little easier.

Mike...the minimum internal volume for a ported box for this sub is 1.75ft^3. I think I'm pushing right around that, but didn't want to risk it. Also, sealed is easier. I will put some drain in the cup holder area. I didn't for the last design, but I only ran into 1 situation that required it. It's important to remember to completely seal that area for that reason.

Thanks all...I'll post more as I move along.

(Message edited by P-hat in Cincy on November 07, 2006)

(Message edited by P-hat in Cincy on November 07, 2006)

 
By David Ericson (sea_ray_dave) on Tuesday, November 07, 2006 - 6:53 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Great idea- thanks for posting the pictures and details. I am sure this project will turn out excellent. I have 2 Kicker CVX 12's in my boat on a Hifonics Class D 1200 watt amp (BXI1206d) and they are incredible. I had the CVR's and switched to the CVX's, there is a Night and Day difference.
 
By Airmousam1 (mitchm) on Tuesday, November 07, 2006 - 10:24 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Paul, Looks great!
 
By Mikeski (mikeski) on Tuesday, November 07, 2006 - 9:41 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I am running the HiFonics BX1500D, I replaced the ZX6400 A/B due to heat but the BX is a real workhorse.
 
By Psyclone (cyclonecj) on Wednesday, November 08, 2006 - 6:26 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I love them cheap-ass Hifonics! They look like they were built in a Chinese prison inside, but they hold up. I've had no problems with mine in three seasons.
 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Thursday, November 09, 2006 - 4:56 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I can't complain about my Hifonics. Bought it off a buddy and it's done nothing but keep the sub thumpin'!

Thanks for the kind words all!

Slow stage last couple nights. Just sealing the box with epoxy and waiting for it to dry. I'll fiberglass the top deck this weekend and carpet soon after.

I drilled out 4 drain holes in the cup holder area. They are channeled to drain out the sides. This should minimize any water retention. I made sure to double coat the cup holder area and drain holes with epoxy.

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Thursday, November 09, 2006 - 4:58 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hit the submit button a little too soon!
Here are a couple boring pics...
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By E Double U (three6ty) on Thursday, November 09, 2006 - 6:38 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
That seems like alot of air spaqce for CVR 12" esp since it is sealed. Do you know what the volume is for that box.

It looks awesome and keep posting the pics until you are done.

 
By Mad Child (madchild1) on Friday, November 10, 2006 - 12:53 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
DOWN WITH THE BUCKEYES!!!!

that said, cool install. :-)

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Friday, November 10, 2006 - 5:44 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
E...sealed is 1.0 - 4.6ft^3. The box is probably just about 1.5-2.0ft^3.

Mad...thems fightin' words!

 
By Kevin Denbroeder (stepintoliquid) on Friday, November 10, 2006 - 10:54 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thread Hijack:

GO BLUE! 8 Days and counting Ohio State........

Un-Hijack!

 
By Mad Child (madchild1) on Friday, November 10, 2006 - 1:04 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
i'm still bitter about the texas game. they played sooo sloppy! it was so irrirtating.


oh well, my stance hasn't changed: BUCKEYES ARE GOIN' DOWWWNNNNNN!!!!.

 
By trace (trace) on Friday, November 10, 2006 - 1:24 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Most everybody plays sloppy against Texas, for some odd reason. ;) Well, except the Buckeyes.

Hook 'em!

Oh, and nice project and writeup!

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Sunday, November 12, 2006 - 4:11 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey all,
Finally got around to laying the fiberglass out today. The fiberglass is overkill, but I feel better about adding the extra strength to the top surfaces since people will be walking on them.
A few pictures. 1 of cut pieces and 2 of after epoxy.
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By Bling-it" (grant_west) on Monday, November 13, 2006 - 8:07 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Paul: cool project. Great use of wasted space. IMO open bow is great but how much time do you really spend up there. I spend more time cleaning the seet's in the open bow then sitting up there LOL. Sorry I dint read all of the post's how does t sound?
 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 13, 2006 - 8:50 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Grant,

Thanks.

Yeah...I found most people like the spread out up front when they are up there, so loosing the floor wasn't a big deal.

The first version shown at top (down firing) sounded pretty good! I think it surprised me and others. I guess we figured the bass would be too far forward, but wasn't the case. Actually heard it rear more than in the bow. Mostly felt it in the bow.

The rear-firing version isn't quite done. I'll probably carpet early this week and then test it by the weekend. I'll post back what I think.

All I need is to find a protective grill cover that will fit a tight space...

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Tuesday, November 14, 2006 - 6:43 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Things are rapidly approaching completion. Last night I decided to paint the exterior. Tonight I dry fit the box and started carpeting. Just need to do some final carpet trim tomorrow and then start wiring the box.

Again, the carpet is just marine carpet found at Lowe's and I used indoor/outdoor carpet adhesive as well as stainless staples to attach the carpet.

Pictures...
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By Ben D (wakeboarderdown) on Tuesday, November 14, 2006 - 9:10 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I really like what your doing there, thanks for the write up!
 
By Craig Stra... (yosquire) on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 - 8:47 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Why did you cover the top with fiberglass cloth, and not just resin?
 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 - 8:52 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Craig,
It's probably overkill, but I did it for added strength. Since we sometimes pick people up from the dock bow first, the box tends to be a landing spot for those climbing on board. It'll get walked on, so I just felt better about it.
Paul

 
By Craig Stra... (yosquire) on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 - 8:55 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Ok, cool. makes sense. I was just wondering, because if I can avoid working with fiberglass cloth I would ...

Good looking project! I may do this too. I don't like the idea of putting a sub under my glovebox.

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 - 9:44 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thanks.

That fiberglass cloth/resin job on the top deck is easy. Just wear gloves and have something to work the creases and air out. 15mins of work, that's it. Doesn't have to be perfect because it gets carpeted anyway.

Yep...I still have all my storage. Under driver kick panel isn't an option b/c I put a 3 port heater there.

 
By Derby (derby) on Wednesday, November 15, 2006 - 10:37 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Im curious to why everyone is still using MDF. You can buy MedEx which is a water proof MDF. It's what they use for street signs and billboards.

The cost difference is neglegible considering resin cost and time lost.

I have a few scrap pieces on the side yard and after two winters untreated they have the same structural integrity.

Just a thought.

Oh very nice work Paul. Great Idea!!!

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 6:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Derby,
Thanks.
I just went with what was readily available.

Here are a few pictures of it installed. Didn't put sub in yet to make it easier to 'adjust' some things. I'm pretty please with the fit, but may have run it a little too long towards the rear. I'll have to put in my sub to check the fit. If it's too tight I'll have to remove the rear plate and cut it back ~1". Luckily, I built it to be able to do this if I chose a different sub in the future.

Also, I'm going to have a heck of a time finding a grill cover. I ordered one and I don't know how I mis-measured, but I'm almost sure it's not going to fit. I have a simplistic design in mind if I can find a weld shop... Upload
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By Greg Bodor (gti2lo) on Thursday, November 16, 2006 - 7:05 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Wow it's looking good that is for sure!!! Great work!!
 
By Red Sovine (san210nut) on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 7:06 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Sierra can make you a grill cover. I was there last night and he had some very cool looking customized grills going on the mill and lots of other cool boat stuff.

http://www.wakeworld.com/MB/Discus/messages/65921/351817.html

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 7:51 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thanks Red...I may look them up after I explore an idea I have.
 
By Bling-it" (grant_west) on Friday, November 17, 2006 - 8:25 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey Paul: Did you get my E-mail. I was asking about your garage door opener. I wanted to ask you some questions about it?
grantwest@gmail.com

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Saturday, November 18, 2006 - 6:28 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Grant,
Didn't get it, but just sent you an email.
Fire back at me with your Q's!

HOW 'BOUT THEM BUCKEYES!!!

 
By Tim Krutz (timmy) on Saturday, November 18, 2006 - 7:01 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Paul, you need to fire that bad boy up and let us know how you like it
 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 6:48 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
OK all...hooked it up tonight to test it out.

Here's the report.
From what I can recall of the previous (down-firing)box, it might have had a more powerful sound. Maybe firing down into the hull used the acoustics of the boat a little more? However, the new box has a much cleaner sound. A lot of stuff used to rattle with the down-firing box. Not so with this one.

I still think the sound is very good with this box and the cleanliness of sound and becoming hypnotized by watching the sub hit made the project worth while. Of course, the true test will be when I get the boat out of the garage to test open air acoustics.

The last thing I have to do is construct a grill. The space is just too small for a conventional grill. I ordered some smoke colored 1/4" Lexan to see if I can come up with some design.

Pictures...and yes...shameless pride showing in the background...
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By Kasey Kurtz (malibu_nut) on Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 6:59 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
looks very nice, you do good work.
 
By Tim Krutz (timmy) on Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 7:01 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Fantastic!
 
By Nate (norcalmalibu) on Sunday, November 19, 2006 - 7:41 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thats super pimp!
 
By Mad Child (madchild1) on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 2:40 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
god i love your boat.


is that box strong enough to support sacks or lead?

 
By dj (dizzyj) on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 3:19 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
paul, any chance on publishing all your mesurements? I'd love to duplicate that, without all the work of course :-)
 
By David Ericson (sea_ray_dave) on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 3:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Nice work Paul, I like it!!

Did you consider doing both a down fire along with the front fire sub set up??

How about showing off your other work with your boat/system?

Are you running a tower speaker set up?

(Message edited by sea_ray_dave on November 20, 2006)

 
By Paul Brothers (phat_in_cincy) on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 4:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Mad...again...thanks! Cool of you to say that. I would bet the box is very capable of lead/sacks. There was zero issue with anyone(s) standing on the first version, which was 5/8" plywood. This one is 3/4" MDF. The only thing to consider would be pressure points (support points) since this has an air gap for water drainage.

dj...I'll have to think about how to do it because most everything was off templates and I'm not sure how to accurately capture all of them. Plus, some measurements are based on the particular sub of your choice. Maybe I'll have one of the CAD guys do a little side work for me!

David,
I thought about it. However, I don't know if sub volume requirements are cumulative. Maybe someone else knows? If they are, then there is not enough internal volume for 2 subs (at least 2 of what I'm using). I don't have the amp power to do it right now anyway...and before another amp comes a higher capacity alternator, which means another battery, which means gel batteries, which...ugh...I'll stop there.

All my other audio stuff is bone stock (except for the amps). That's kinda slack I know, but I'm starting from a baseline ride and working my way thru the boat. Tower is naked as can be! Not sure what I'll do there.

If you want to see everything I've done (ballast, heat, audio to date), check out my profile page. I have DIY's for all of them.

The boat will never be up to par with some of the systems I've seen running here. The point is to get some basic systems in and then go out and enjoy the boat...'projecting' as I have the time and desire.

Thanks for all the positive comments!

Paul

 
By jeff goldblum (jeffcanary62) on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 9:23 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Awsome work, i've thought about something like this for a while now. Email me the measurements and i can do a cad drawing of the box for everyone on the site
 
By Airmousam1 (mitchm) on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 5:48 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Paul, That would fit perfectly in my boat. Nice work!!!
 
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