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WakeWorld Discussion Board » >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive » Archive through January 28, 2006 » Tige' vs. Natique vs. Sanger « Previous Next »
By Tristram (brady_bunch) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:06 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
First off Im new here so please bear with me.

I live in Houston and have these 3 dealers plus Mastercraft near by. Ive been to all the dealers and picked their brains and have test driven 2 boats. I drove the Nautique 21 and the Sanger 21V, the Sanger, I wasnt impressed with its 315 hp and slow starts but over all I liked the boat. The Nautique was also a great boat, plenty of hole shot but a little pricey (imo). I liked these 2 boats until I saw the Tige'. The thing I liked most about it was the deepness of the boat as compared to Sanger and Nautique. We have 2 lakes here in Houston which at times can get very choppy so I need a boat that can handle those kinds of conditions easily.

Im interested in peoples opinions here about these 3. They all seem like great boats but it seems now Im leaning more towards Tige'.

Thanks for your input.

 
By Mad Child (madchild1) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:12 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
out of those mfgs i'd go w/ tige`. i admit i haven't used the TAPs2 but i hear very good things. i didn't like the lines for the longest time and then they grew on me and i am very pro-tige`....behind 'bu that is .
 
By Aaron Ware (99_slaunch) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:18 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I live in s.w. houston. I normaly ride on the Sanjacinto. Great place for the family and great to board. You might want to look at the Supras at Rinker's Boat World. It's rite down the road from Darryl Moore's. I love my Supra it's a deep sided boat also.
 
By Squid (twakess) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:23 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Trisyram, I own a 2001 Super Air Nautique. Yes they are very pricey. I still think the Sanger is the most under rated boat out there. You get a very well built boat for a good price. The wake on the sanger 210 is killer sacked out and also the 215. If I did it all over it would be a very hard choice between a sanger and a SAN. You also said that you have a Mastercraft near I think you should also look at that boat to X1 is a killer boat which was the X2 last year. To me its all personal choice. You can't go wrong with any of those 3 boats.
 
By Sparky Jay (wake_upppp) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:24 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Well the big Sanger fan that I am, I will admit that they do sit somewhat lower than alot of others, but a very solid, dependable boat that beats alot of others in the chop as far as ride. That said, out of the three you talked about, I would lean towards the Nautique, but that's just me. No matter what though, I would recommend a real world demo on ANY boat you're considering including driving/riding it FULLY weighted and getting them out in the conditions you will be using the boat in. It really comes down to your own personnal preference and needs though.
 
By Tate (redv215) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:48 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
When you say the Sanger 21v, which boat are you talking of. They have a V210 and V215. The 215 is a bit deeper inside than the 210. We bought our Sanger because it handled the chop better than any other boat out there. I am not fimiliar with the Tige but I have been in several of the SAN and MC. I would say they hit a little hard in the rough water for my taste. I would agree, as most would, to what Sparky Jay said:
"a real world demo on ANY boat you're considering including driving/riding it FULLY weighted and getting them out in the conditions you will be using the boat in."
Good luck

 
By Machew (mbrown) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:50 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
V215 with a Black Scorpion will pull just fine. I'm with Squid, the 215 is a underrated boat with a great wake and more room than the SAN, but the new VLX, well you might want to test drive one of those, IMO! If a SAN is in your price range so is a Bu.
 
By oscar (zacky) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:58 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Demo them, and demo them hard. Pretend it is your boat for the day and take all of the gear you would usually take. Take the boat to the water and put it through its paces. Try to demo them back to back if possible. The only person that will be able to decide the best boat for you is you.

You should also pay particular attention to the dealer's ability to provide customer service after the sale. None of those boats will do you any good if they spend weeks on end in a service center because of a dealer's inability to fix a problem...

 
By talltigeguy (talltigeguy) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 8:53 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I was drawn to the Tige because of the deeper freeboard and taller seats. I find the shorter seats in a Nautique to be uncomfortable after any strenuous exertion (watersports). The Sanger also has seats that are lower to the floor. I am certain that the Tige will handle the best in rough water. The storage in the Tige is enormous compared to the others you are looking at.

Dealer service is important, try to find other customers who have bought there and ask their experience.

 
By Craig Anderson (stillstandin) on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 8:56 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
All those are great. You said you go to a lake that gets choppy. Either Sanger will handle chop just as good, if not better than any other inboard made. The Sanger V-drives also handle extremely well. Obvioulsy I'm a bit biased, but I absolutly love the decision I made. I have the V215 with the Black Scorp, and it hole shots very good. I do ride behind a SAN on occasion. I think as far as size goes. If you compare it to a V210, it is similiar. The V215 has tons more storage and space. Cant say much about the Tige, never been behind one. Good luck, not a bad problem to have:-)
 
By David (whitlock87) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 8:50 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I would get the tige with the mrine power 340hp engine.
I have that setup, and love it

 
By adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:04 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
The local Tige dealer will give you the best service IMO....what other dealer would loan you his personal boat if you had a trip planned and your boat needed to go to the shop? I owe a supra and have been very pleased with it. I think the tige will give you the best rough water ride, the boat weighs close to 1k lb more than most boats its size.
 
By Paul (psudy) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:27 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
If you are looking for a boat with a good ride in rough water, stay away from the X1. They beat the crap out of you. If you do look at MC, look at the X-10 and up for ride.
 
By B Whelan (tx_cook) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 9:38 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
i assume you went to HWC to demo the Sanger and Nautiques. Talk to a man named Cliff McInnis(sp?). He sold us our boat back in July and is awesome. He recently bought that dealership too. As far as boats, we got a Sanger V215 with the Black Scorpion. Last time i was there they didnt even have a Sanger without the 330hp motor. Where in Houston do you live? If you are refering to Lake Houston as one the lakes you go to i suggest that you skip that place and come down to the San Jacinto River. The lakes a piece of crap in my opinion and is only good for tubing(BOOOOO) mostly. We're pretty lucky in houston though. We have all the major manufactures; MC,CC,Malibu,Tige,Sanger,Centurion,Supra...Im sure theres more. One note on the Centurions though. The closest dealer to me, Boat Superstore, sucks. We just sued them yesterday as matter of fact for $5000 due to mechanical negligence on our older boat (Not a Centurion though). They replaced an oil pump and didnt connect all the lines correctly so oil pumped all over inside the cover and burnt out a piston. But whatever you decide, just do what everyone says and demo, demo, demo. We love our new Sanger and are enjoying the pretty penny we saved as compared to the others. Oh yeah, the wake is pretty nice. We just have the stock ballast. Im sure it could be better, but no one in our family really needs it.
 
By adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 10:13 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Yes, go to the lower san jac to ride...stay away from Lake Houston, it's full of mack truck size stumps, toxic water and man eating alligators

But seriously...Lake Houston is the only rideable lake ( and Taylor Lake down south, but it's brackish) in Houston on the weekends. You just have to know where to go. I just bought a house on the water over there.



(Message edited by acurtis_ttu on December 13, 2005)

 
By Tristram (brady_bunch) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 11:04 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thanks for all the help guys, didnt help much as it seems all these boats are a good choice.

Im not refering to Lake Houston, I wouldnt stick my big toe in that crap but was refering to Lake Conroe and Travis.

The Nautique and Sanger I test drove were at the HWC but those conditions (private lake) were not a resembalence (sp*) of the waters I will be spending most of my time in. As far as the Sanger goes, it was the 21?? open bow with the V-drive last one on the lot and was equipted with the 315 h.p and I thought it was a bit slougish compared to the Air Nautique 206 (w/ the 330 hp). I liked the way the Naut. rode but like I said it wasnt the kind of conditions I would be driving it in. Are there Naut that are deep? I havnt checked out the Supras but will this weekend. The Tige' dealer was very informative, spent quite a bit of time with me in comparing boats that Ive looked at so far as did the the Naut dealer Im just leaning more towards the deepness of the Tige'. I will not buy from MC as I spent over 30 minutes walking around before somebody approached me and when I began to pick his brain on the boats specs and comparing it he seemed to give me the attitude as if I was just window shopping, maybe thats being hard headed but if thats the customer service I receive before the sale, whats it gonna be like after?

Looks like I still have more homework ahead of me before spring.

 
By Big Heavy (stephan) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 11:05 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Most of the responses here are from boat owners who one way or another are recommending what they purchased. Since I am a boat whore I will give my impartial opinion on your selection.

Tige has definately stepped it up in the last three years. They used to characteristically have a sharp weird wake & have since adjusted their hulls to provide large clean wakes. The Tige is a wide boat & creates a wide wake, despite it being heavier this will make it tougher to sink and could burn more gas. TAPS is sweet but we put an additional 2k in a 22i. My biggest beef is the low bow that takes on water and must be very carefully brought off plane. If your wife or kids aren't too experienced get ready for a wet floor board. Also I hate how the transom is so long, it seems like wasted space to me. The gap between the pad & the swim step is ridiculous.

The SAN is a great boat, handles chop well and has a great wake. Loaded down they are perfect if you like a big, lippy, vert wake. They are very manueverable but like the X-1 (although not as bad) they will chine lock in sharp turns. The storage is a bit lacking especially with the rear tanks. For the price I am not sold on Correct Craft. For less(although close) I would much rather rock a VLX and have tons of space everywhere.

The Sanger's are the secret of wakeboarding. The V210 has about as much space a SAN but a noticeably low freeboard. I have been in one that was a little scary as the rub rail was practically in the water but it never proved as sketchy as it appeared. Even when loaded (& it doesn't require as much water) it drives great and is very nimble. the wake is much like a SAN with a little less lip. Personally I love the 210's wake. The V215 is very similar, except it is wider and the freeboard is much higher. I like the V210 wake more but the V215 kicks up great. For the $ the Sanger's are exceptional. Hell you can get into a new 2005 V230 for $38k on boattrader!! That is incredible.

Overall you have agreat decision to make, either way you go you will get a great boat. You need to go spend some quality time in all and a few features will stand out that no one else has mentioned, but are important to you. That's why everyone has a different boat. Different strokes for different folks. Personally I will be looking at Sanger's in the next year or so but since I have the hookup with Malibu I may do that so I can get a new boat every year. Good luck, happy hunting!!

 
By Paul (psudy) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 12:04 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
What the hell is chine lock? I can spin my X-Star, X-2, now X1(confusing?) on axis.

 
By adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 12:07 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
"Im not refering to Lake Houston, I wouldnt stick my big toe in that crap but was refering to Lake Conroe and Travis. "

Travis is too deep to touch, but everytime I party at the damn on Lake Conroe my toenails are green for a few weeks.....

Back to tht original thread. Check out the Supra 21V. It's got a deep freeboard...although not as deep as a tige.


 
By Kyle (grampsrider) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 2:26 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
i would go with tige if i were you.we had a 22v weighted with 580lbs in the back and about 500 in the walk through and had probibly 11 ppl in it and the wake was huge. i could go so bigger behind that boat than a SAN.the day we took the boat out it was really choppy and you couldnt feel any of the chop.the taps works great and makes it so you can custumize the wake
 
By Big Heavy (stephan) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 2:30 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Chine lock is what happens when the boat is loaded and you have to whip a sharp turn. The boat will get hung up on it's chines and not turn as well. Sometimes you have to straighten out before you can continue the turn, albeit very quickly.
 
By Craig Anderson (stillstandin) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 2:49 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
You can also get a Hyrdolick wake plate on the Sanger. Same thing as taps
 
By WakePro (skireel) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 5:44 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I am on my third Tige' and have owned Nauts, Skiers Choice, and Malibus which are all nice boats. It is all about features and Tige' builds the best hull bar none. My boat is almost 1100lbs heavier than the VLX or SAN and it's all fiberglass. This weight and deep V make it perfect for rough waters. You can add a wake plate to any boat including a bass boat but unless your hull is designed to adjust with it, it will do you no good. Tige' was the first to use it in conjunction with the convex V hull. My opinion, drive them all and make sure it is in 3 foot seas so you can see how the deep free board of the Tige' keeps you dry vs. the chinchy 1.5' free board on the Sanger and Naut. Then see how each boat takes the swells. No doubt you will see how smooth the Tige takes the transition vs. the how the others slap the water once they go through the swell. I bought my 22V from the Houston dealer and he knows inboards. Not only that, you deal with the owner and not a commission sales guy or a dealer that has two or more competing inboards on the floor. I like my boats Texas made and Texas Proud Baby!!!!
 
By Daniel Perry (poser007) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 6:54 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Lol, funny how the boat you own seems to be the best choice ha ha ha......Don't be haten just keepin it real
 
By WakePro (skireel) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 7:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
So let's see here, most people buy a product because they think it is the best right. Wow, what a novel concept. Of course I recommend the boat I own, that's why I own it.
 
By Daniel Perry (poser007) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 7:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Wakepro I wasnt being a dick, I was just saying, on threads like this most people will have a bais toward what they own. Is it the best? thats a big NO! In my oppinion there is no best. Its all preference. People need to ask questions but in the long run its what your needs wants and how much you are willing to pay.
 
By Craig Anderson (stillstandin) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 7:40 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
WakePro. Ive never been in a Tige, tho I have looked at them, they are nice. I wouldnt say the Sanger will slap threw chop. I will put the Sanger up against any boat when it comes to rough water ride.
 
By Tristram (brady_bunch) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 7:55 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thanks WakePro for your opinions. You said you delt with the owner of the Tige' dealership in Houston? Brandon Raymond? I do alot of offshore fishing and have been in high seas and completely understand the importance of having high freeboard, but then again thats just my opinion. I too like the idea of having the manufacturer in my home state. Brandon (Tige' dealer) was telling me he picks up his boats himself from Abilene and if I ever had a serious enough problem, again theyre close to home.

I also understand that everyone here has their boat for a reason but I was trying to possibly downsize my options but its something Im going to have to do on my own.

You guys have been a great help so far and I can tell this is going to be an informative and helpful forum.

Thanks again.

 
By richard estevo (mendo247) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 8:04 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
sanger sanger sanger! lol just kidding.. your not gonna go wrong with any of these boats they all have there up sides and down sides.. personally i think you could by a mastercraft, malibu, tige, supra, moomba, mb, sanger, nautique, or any other big name wake boat and youll love it!! just try.. em all out and pick the one that feels right and fits your needs best..
 
By Greg w (whitie) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 8:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
What up wakepro. Im torn spent a summer behined a tige,99xstar(x2),nati and only one day with sanger. As a true boat hoe they are all good boats over all. I would say tige over 21v supra and malibu based on wake not to say that the other 2 are bad I just like the tige wake better of those 3. For staight ridin cant beet the OG Xstar much like a SAN small boat but sick wake sorry dont like the SAN wake either.

Rollin 4 ladies deep.
Cuase thats how I roll.
www.wakeculture.com
www.stupidtxdudes.com

 
By JK (justridin) on Tuesday, December 13, 2005 - 8:56 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Like Richard said, your not going to go wrong with any of these boats. However, I had the amusing privilege of spending some time with your local dealer, Brandon Raymond a couple of weeks ago, and based upon his enthusiasm and energy with respect to wakeboarding and wakeboard boats I would probably buy a canoe equiped with a ten-foot-pole if he showed me that it worked. They are all great boats and the mantra is "demo, demo, demo" followed by "dealer, dealer, dealer". If Brandon sells you a boat and you are not happy with it, I will buy it from you for what you paid for it*

*Some conditions apply with respect to delivery to Canada, but I am serious.

 
By Tristram (brady_bunch) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 6:17 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
So JK...youd buy a canoe...bla..bla..bla you lost me on that one. Are you saying he is a good bs'er or you honestly believe his sales pitch?
 
By adam Curtis (acurtis_ttu) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 6:36 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
JK hit the nail on the head. Brandon is very passionate about wakeboarding as well as promting the local wakeboarding scence in Houston. One thing about Brandon, he won't B.S you. His enthusiasm for wakebaording and Tige boats is very real. You won't find a more down to earth dealer in Houston. I don't know of another dealer that has as much interaction with their customers and local wakebaording community.
 
By AndrewD (c640947) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 6:40 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I don't know brandon real well but I have met him a couple of times and know lots of people who have dealt with him. I can say you will get the best service from him for sure. I have a Mastercraft and if you have to take it in for service, kiss it goodbye for the next month or so. The Mastercraft dealer also doesn't support the local wakeboard association, so I think even though they carry two great brands, people have a bias against them. The sales guys were a bit cocky. I like the quote (while I am looking at the XStars) me - "yeah plenty of room back here for a 600 in each side" him - "oh with all the stock ballast you dont need more weight - the wake is huge" me - "huh? are you serious? please tell me you are not serious." him - "oh you dont need any bigger - its huge" me - "ok whatever."

Texas Tige is a huge supporter of the club. I like Sanger's wakes but if you plan on riding Conroe, the Tige is probably the better choice. I have never liked the way the Nautiques look, but they wake is awesome. VERY pricey though. HWC is also a strong supporter of gcwa.com. I think their service dept is pretty decent. Rinkers (Supra / Moomba) is also a supporter but I think service is a bit slow there too. I like Supras and ride behind Adam's often and it would probably do well on Conroe too.

 
By JK (justridin) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 7:31 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I am saying that someone this passionate about wakeboarding and the products he sells, will likely provide you with great service.
 
By David (tparider) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 9:00 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Alright, here's my view on this debate. And as a precursor to my upcoming comment, I will say that this represents my personal opinion - nothing more, nothing less.

First, I own a Malibu.

The local dealer is huge. They are busy. This is not an excuse for them, however it is a fact of life that if you buy from a huge dealer, while you will probably have great service performed, it may take a while if you need something major done in the summer months. Pretty simple. My experience with service has been great - I recently got a fuel filter, impeller, 2 outlet heater, and a transmission fluid change, along with some gelcoat work, and had the boat back in under 2 weeks...and this was over Thanksgiving. I'm happy.

And another note - why not consider a Malibu? If you are considering dropping the dime on a Nautique (and the Tige for that matter), look at the Malibu. I considered the Tige 24v, Supra 24ssv, and the Nautique 226 before going with the Malibu LSV. Of course this is coming from a happy owner, so I am biased to say the least. Do yourself a favor and compare the options on the boats. What are you looking for? Comfort? Wake size? Dealer service? Price? All of the above? Again, just my opinion here, but to me, the Malibu has the plushest interior of any boat, and I bought the LSV to deal with the chop of Conroe - it does so handily. You're going to get a great wake out of all of them. I liked the Supra but wasn't impressed with the dealer. I loved the 226 Nautique, but the dealer is almost 2 hours from my house, so trailering for service would have been a pain. The Tige dealer is closest to my house, but I wasn't prepared to buy a "lesser known" boat (in this area) from a newly established dealer.

Next, and again on the service note - Buy a boat from the dealer you feel with most likely honor his committment to you and provide you with whatever service you may need at the time you need it. End of story.
Everyone has been commenting on the Tige dealer's great service because of the owner's enthusiasm. My personal opinion of the local Tige dealer is that although they may be passionate about our sport, they are still a new dealer, and to me, have yet to establish a track record of great service. Not to say they don't provide great service, it's just that they haven't been around long enough to comment on that in my opinion.

Lastly - WakePro - you posted above, "I bought my 22V from the Houston dealer and he knows inboards." Aren't YOU the Houston dealer?

 
By Donny (dfromtx) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 9:27 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey Tristram,

Good that you're doing your research - this way you'll actually end up with a boat you're happy with and not second guess yourself when your pulling it home after signing those fat papers. I'm the same way. I picked every dealer's brain (to the bone) in the Houston area, and researched every aspect of the Wake boats out there. Don't be an uninformed buyer!

I'm for Tige though - not too much experience with Mastercraft or Sanger, but have been out on and behind a few Nautiques (no major complaints to speak of, other than the price and not so smooth in chop). I won't criticize though, since I've never owned one, but the prices on most Wake boats seem a bit out of line if Tige can offer, what I feel Tige is top-of-the-line at a significantly lower price.

Also, check out the curb-weight and hull/deck thickness on the Tiges (if you're concerned about chop). And decide what you "really" need in the boat. All those bells-and-whistles are nice, but most aren't worth the materials their made from (IMO).

My girl and I just bought a sweet 2006 20V (w/ 340HP EFI) from Brandon and couldn't be happier ...no second guessing! Sorry, but I don't like much dealing with Salesman anyway ...and well - Brandon's a rider, so I think that you're going to get what your looking for after the sale as well.

The new 20V handles like a fine sports car. Plenty of pull, sweet wake (even w/out ballast), comfortable ride, and tight-as-hell turns. Last time out was a few weeks ago with 20+ MPH winds on Lake Conroe - was extremely impressed with how she handled the horrible chop - and best of all, my crew stayed dry.

That's my 2 cents, but I'd say either way you go ...pay for the boat, not the name and consider your dealer. Good luck w/ your purchase!

Later,
D

 
By Big Ed (big_ed_x2) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 10:12 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
If a dealer does great service to me it doesn't matter how far the dealer is.I'M NOT GONNA BUY A BOAT SIMPLY B\C THE DEALER IS CLOSE.
As a matter of fact,when I bought my MC,the MC dealer was the farthest away from me but I didn't go and buy a TIGE,SANGER,CENTURION or CC and they were ALL considerably closer then the MC dealer.

I guess when you want an MC,nothing else will do.

 
By David (tparider) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 10:24 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
So does anyone know what is the deal anyways with the hull thickness of the Tige boats? I understand it increases the weight of the boat, but what is it really for? Does that weight help it to handle rougher water better? Thanks in advance.

Also, Donny - congrats on your new purchase. You mentioned that your boat produces a sweet wake even with no ballast - you should at least use the stock ballast though since it's there - what does the 20V come with?

 
By Donny (dfromtx) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:01 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thanks for the congrats David...

Hull thickness - I would say ...weight for one, same concept as ballast and proper weight distribution for wake size/shape. How better to distribute more weight than to have it uniformly throughout the craft and as part of the craft. Useful ballasts are not just how much weight one can put in the rear of the boat or cram wherever it might fit. Why the need to make an "off-the-trailer" boat even heavier? Well, even if the boat was 15K curb weight we'd still wanna add extra weight, right? It can become somewhat mental. I'm no different, see my response about ballasts below...

For two, I'd say a strength, look at offshore boat hulls. They're designed to take their environment, which is usually rough waters. This is not to say that other Wake boat hulls are not thick enough - it's just pointing out a basic engineering concept - that there's sufficient design, which is more production cost friendly and there's more than sufficient design, which is the road less traveled. I'd have to say that Tige hulls fall into the "more than sufficient" design category ...of course your goal is to ride in smooth water, but the nice thing about Tige is that you don't have to pay extra for their design principles, like you do for most things in things that follow this concept. Interior creature comforts and the extras are nice, but I focused more on the core of the boat, than how well I liked the interior. Interior plushness was my secondary consideration, although I'm very pleased with the 20V interior layout.

Ballast - Yup, I bought the stock ballasts - 850 lbs b/w the 4 hard-tanks (2 forward, 2 aft). I should note that even with the hard-tanks and extra battery and stuff, there's still plenty of large storage room, except in the forward-starboard, where that area is completely consumed by the tank. My comment was intended to say "a sweet wake" even w/out ballast (period) but of course the ballasts add that extra height and kick that more advanced riders might seek. With or without, the 20V produces a good clean shape with good height and handles the same with the extra weight - as it should.

D

 
By talltigeguy (talltigeguy) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 12:17 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
David,

If you ever get a chance when you see a Tige and another brand...Grab the side of the boat and push your knee into the fiberglass, putting a lot of pressure on it. Then repeat it on the non-Tige boat. The flex in some boats is a lot. The Tige is very solid. My experience has been that when hitting big waves, the vibration in the hull created by the flex makes other boats feel less solid.

 
By Victor Newman (newtige20v) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 1:57 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Texas Tige in Houston delivered a 2006 20V to me three months ago and I am loving this boat. Brandon, the owner, treats you like you are a celeb and takes time and covers the details to make sure you are 100% satisfied. My 20V was a custom order and I went up to Abilene to tour the factory. If you live in Texas, I recommend a custom order because Tige builds it and delivers it in four weeks or so to your spec. All I can say is that Tige builds a large safety factor into their boats and this is important to me because I have two little boys and they live on this boat. I ride on Lake Livingston and went from a 2002 Malibu Wakesetter to the 20V. I had problems with the boat from day one and the Houston dealer could have cared less. When I hit a stump with my wedge and nearly sank my boat, I decided to do my home work and chose Tige.
 
By Kyle Cramm (00wakesetter) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:07 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Tristram,

Everyone on here has had some very good information for you about the dealers and the products they sell. A couple of years back when i was looking for a boat (even tho i new i wouldnt be buying a new one) i visited all the local dealers and chatted with them just to try to decide what brand boat i wanted. I felt the same as you did on the mc dealer in Houston and wasnt impressed with the supra dealer either. The guys at HWC were very informative when i talked to them. And Brandon was not yet in buss so i didnt get a chance to talk to him before i bought mine. I did meet Brandon at one of the gcwa events this year and i can also tell you that his stoke for the sport is like no one else. I have been out on the 22v a few times and the wake is sick when you add a few extra pounds to it. I can also tell you from experience that his service is top notch.

Once again, demo as many as you can in the conditions you will be riding in and then choose which one will best suit you.

Good luck!

 
By David (tparider) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:12 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
good post Kyle.
 
By Sam (wake1823) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:12 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Donny, how can you compare an offshore racing boat to a wakeboard boat…they operate in two totally different environments. All of the big three make solid boats. While Tige does have noticeably thicker hulls, I feel it’s more of a marketing ploy. In the environment you run your wakeboard boat in do you really need such a thick hull? Most newer boats nowadays are designed to take the beating of double up, and increased ballast weight. Do you think boat manufactures would have lifetime and limited lifetime warranties on their hull if they felt they were inadequate? Tige may take it one step further but it’s an unnecessary cost. If you hit a tree stump at planning speed with a tige or Malibu your riding day is over and both should have considerable damage. How many hulls do you ever hear about having major issues with? Tige’s are very plain on the interior…and use plastics where the big three use billet aluminum/stainless. No one even mentioned the added towing stress you place on your truck every time you tow the extra 1000 lb’s to the lake, not to mention the extra gas burned pushing another 1k lbs thru the water. Correct me if I’m wrong but all the bigger heavier boat I ride in need a lot more weight to make the wake decent.

In this day and age…unfortunately .850lbs is not enough ballast…most intermediate/advanced riders will still be filling sacks.

While I believe tige brought the concept of their taps system to the ski boat market…it’s a simple concept that alto of other boat manufacturers have used for a long time. A few other large ski/wakeboard manufactures use similar concepts and achieve the same great result.

“Interior creature comforts and the extras are nice, but I focused more on the core of the boat, than how well I liked the interior. Interior plushness was my secondary consideration”

You spend all your time riding “in” the boat, for the price you pay for a Tige the interior should be more plush.

My advice to Tige…take a few layers out of your hull and spend the extra $$$ on R&D for your interior.

Lastly, anyone else notice that the last few posts praising this dealer are from people who just registered today???? Myself included?????

 
By Victor Newman (newtige20v) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
David,
You mentioned that the Tige dealer has not been around long enough to have a trackrecord. The area rep for Houston told me they just finished their first year in business and won "Best New Dealer". Tige awards this based on CSI (customer satisfaction index) and these guys beat out all new Tige dealers worldwide for 2005. In addition, they are now third in the Houston Market in sales volume. I say watch out CC, MC, and bu, Texas Tige is about to roost on you baby!!!

 
By Kyle Cramm (00wakesetter) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:17 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Sam you have no idea what you are talking about. Sorry bro.
 
By Kyle Cramm (00wakesetter) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
After riding in the Tige all day i will tell you it burns less gas then my 2000VLX.
 
By David (tparider) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:30 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Victor -
I understand the value of winning awards, but my personal thought is that I am a skeptic until proven otherwise. The normal human reaction is that a dealer has to prove themselves over time, not just win awards internally from the corporation.

Not to discredit Texas Tige - I'm sure they run a tight ship and obviously they are on the right track to establish themselves as another option in the boat market in this part of the country.

 
By Sam (wake1823) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Just my opinion, but how big is your tank on the 200 VLX vs the tank on the tige. Your motor is 5 years old as well (less effecient). Just looking at the guage is not an accurate measure of who burns more gas. Gallons per hour using the (similar motors, most manufacturers do)push 1000lbs thru the water takes less gas than 2000lbs. Of course hull design plays a part in that too. Maybe tige's hull design is much more effcient that malibu's?????
 
By WakePro (skireel) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:35 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I agree Kyle, Sam is way off. Check out this link
http://www.boattest.com/boats/comparison_results.aspx?MainCompare=1036&Compare=135&Submit=Compare

Boat Test.com tested a 24V (24feet) vs. a Wakesetter VLX (21).The 24V gets a little better fuel economy yet weighs 1400 lbs more. The 24V even plains faster that the VLX. This is an unbiased test and it is fact not an opinion. It is the CONVEX V Hull and TAPS that make this possible and no other inboard has this hull because it is patented. As for towing an extra 1000 lbs down the road, if you have to worry about tripping over those nickels, buy a seadoo

 
By Brandon Raymond (big_brandon) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 2:39 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Big Sam, I just registered too, is that wrong of me????

David, thanks for the support!!!!

 
By Brandon Raymond (big_brandon) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 3:05 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Tristram, thanks for coming in again today, I never get tired of visiting with good people. Forums are a funny thing sometimes. The main thing is to demo all boats you are considering, do your research, don't let the BLING fool you, and most impotantly, feel comfortable with who you are buying from. I personally thank you for your consideration and look forward to helping you and your family anyway I can. Peace.
 
By Machew (mbrown) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 6:49 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Just to back up Sam, offshore boats are different.

I live in a place where neighbors all around own and race offshore boats and they are built completely different form wakeboats, only the materials are similar.

Offshore boats use thinner glass on the sides where strength is not an issue. They increase the glassing on the bottom and around the wood yes wood stringers. The focus of these boat's build processes are to be as light as possible, design strong bottoms and stringers, and create a hull shape that can absorb large ocean rollers with little bow rise.

Just because tige or any manufacturer adds extra glass does not mean their hull is superior or will last longer than a "lifetime". All new boat hulls should do that. However, it will cut down on noise from water hitting the hull if the glass is thicker in that region.

If you really want to save on gas go MB with the 2 speed tranny, because it makes about a $30 dollar an outing difference in fuel consumption. Every one else could be within $10 bucks of each other. 4400lb boat with ballast and a 340 hp engine= thirsty no matter what.

 
By Donny (dfromtx) on Wednesday, December 14, 2005 - 9:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Certainly, I agree ...offshore boats do have a different design concept, when you add greater speeds and higher stresses safety requirements and liabilities become a whole new factor. Boats, just like any other product in this world have a design optimization model, which is of course based on use and performance, but also based on manufacturing costs (among other things). I'm sure we'll agree keeping manuf costs low is a good thing for business. And certainly Tige is in the business of making money just like everyone else, I just feel they went the extra step here, but certainly not to say that others don't meet the use and performance needs of their intended audience.

I work for a company that over designs their product, we have less volume than the other guys, but much longer and regular repeat customer relationships. It's a different concept because we're Engineering-based and not Marketing-based.

Sam - I don't think you'd hear me say that others didn't make solid boats. Actually, the last thing you'll hear from me is bashing other peoples products ...unless I've had a specific bad experience with them. However, I do concur with your response "Tige may take it one step further..." but "...it’s an unnecessary cost" is not entirely the case, because I didn't see any extra cost with a considerably lower price than others.

Hey Machew - I know your waters ...ridden in the Sac delta several times. Got some fam in Disco Bay - and yes, lot's of big racing boats out there!

As for interiors, well I also chose the Z71-Tahoe over the Cadillac-Escalade - the Z is not the big pimpin interior, but I wasn't looking for it at the higher price. Now I'm sure somebody will jump in and say "how can you even compare a Chevy to a Cadi" and I'll say ...well my girl drives the Cadi ;)

Later - and happy debating! And Trishtram, I hope you've gained some piece of what you were looking for.

 
By Tristram (brady_bunch) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 5:35 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Donny, I have gained what Im looking for. Ive dug deep these past few weeks researching and asking questions and have greatly narrowed my choices. All these boats offer great packages and all are well built boats but what it really boils down to is personal opinion and taste.

Thanks for all your help.

 
By Sam (wake1823) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 6:54 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
"As for towing an extra 1000 lbs down the road, if you have to worry about tripping over those nickels, buy a seadoo"

If money is no object I would glady open up an account that you could deposit your "nickles" in on a monthly basis.

If you tow more than a few mintues to your riding spot....towing another 1000lbs is a legitimate concern. For you to dismiss it, is borderline ignorant.

Thansk for the boattest info. I wouldn't have predicted those results.

Wakepro, according to your profile and email address and the local tige website, are you the owner of the tige dealership in Houston?

(Message edited by wake1823 on December 15, 2005)

(Message edited by wake1823 on December 15, 2005)

 
By Chris White (ccwhite) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 7:27 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Buy a Sanger and a New truck for the price of the SAN
 
By Kyle Cramm (00wakesetter) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 9:19 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
For you to dismiss it, is borderline ignorant.

hahaha stop sam your killing me bro.

 
By WakePro (skireel) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 10:37 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Sam,
I am an investor in Texas Tige. I know the product is superior so I put my money were my mouth is and dropped some big $$ to help get this dealership started in 2004. I did buy my boat from Brandon Raymond who is the actual DEALER. He treated Donny, Victor and all other customers just like he treated me. I simply see a P&L statement every quarter and outside of that I run my company Skireel Watersports. As any investor in any company, when I see misinformation about the product or company that I have invested in, I call it out.

As far as gas, what you doing is no different than the guy who goes to the Hummer or Ferrari dealer and asks what kind of mileage it gets. If you have to ask this about a Hummer, a Ferrari or a Wakeboard boat, you should not be buying either, you should be looking for a better paying job so that operating your weekend toy will not break your bank.

 
By Big Ed (big_ed_x2) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 11:14 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Not to cap on Tige but I know you didn't just compare Ferrari to a Tige.LOL
 
By David (tparider) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 11:54 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
hahahahah big ed. way to lighten up the thread!!! Getting too serious over here!!
 
By JTW (sangerlover) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 12:03 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
When I bought, I knew I wanted a Sanger V210 and had no need to test any other boat. That was the boat I had wanted for a few years due to reputation and price .
 
By JK (justridin) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 12:13 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I think he was talking about expensive toys in general relative to fuel cost. To compare any wakeboard boat company's products to the technology in todays high-end automobiles would be laughable. Big Ed, you would not be thinking that your much loved mc is in the same class as Ferrari would you?
 
By Mad Child (madchild1) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 12:19 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
i'd have to say go tige'.


 
By oscar (zacky) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 12:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Maybe I missed something, but where did he compare a Ferrari to a Tige?
 
By Big Ed (big_ed_x2) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 6:19 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
JK,I think any towboat cannot be compared as you said but now that you mention it I guess that my MC would be THE CLOSEST.


 
By Big Ed (big_ed_x2) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 6:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Oscar,check wakepros last post.
 
By Victor Newman (newtige20v) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 8:26 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
"If you have to ask this about a Hummer, a Ferrari or a Wakeboard boat, you should not be buying either"
Where does Tige show up in this analogy BIG ED?
Basic reading comprehension skills.}

 
By David (tparider) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 9:04 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey Victor Newman - relax over there buddy. Big Ed has a sense of humor that he exercises quite regularly on this board.

I understand you've only just registered here a couple of days ago, but all the more reason to take it easy on the figure of speech mocking.

 
By Big Ed (big_ed_x2) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 10:07 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Thanks David,It's all good tho obviously Victor didn't read the whole thread but just a part of it.

Victor,don't pop a blood vessel bro! I don't want to recap the whole thread for you but it was mentioned that Tige are heavy boats b\c of the xtra fiberglass the put on the hulls and they will burn xtra gas.

Now I'm assuming that everybody is reading the whole thread and if you are making a comment and didn't read the whole thread,then state it.

(Message edited by big_ed_x2 on December 15, 2005)

 
By Greg w (whitie) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 10:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
just get a triple axel trailer for that extra 1k and aad some bling
 
By Craig Anderson (stillstandin) on Thursday, December 15, 2005 - 10:59 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
For whats its worth, I talked to a friend who does ride in a Tige 22v on occasion, and rides behind my Sanger. I asked him which one is smoother, handles rough water better. He said the Tige has a higher freeboard, but the Sanger def. rides smoother threw chop. He said both have good wakes, just a matter of preference.
 
By Joe Umali (dakid) on Friday, December 16, 2005 - 10:04 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
i don't own a boat, but i'm a boat whore so take this for what it's worth.

my picks in order;

1. nautique
2. sanger
3. tige

 
By Sam (wake1823) on Friday, December 16, 2005 - 1:06 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
"I am an investor in Texas Tige."

When you have a financial interest (potential financial gain) in a product, your selling it, not giving an independent opinion.

I can’t say I wouldn’t be doing the same thing, but you have to see the bias?

"when I see misinformation about the product or company that I have invested in, I call it out."

I mearly stated my opinion. I never gave false info. I applied logic that a 1000lb boat takes less energy to move than a 2000lb boat (hull design played a factor) I guess it was a bigger varibale than I thought.



(Message edited by wake1823 on December 16, 2005)

 
By Donny (dfromtx) on Friday, December 16, 2005 - 1:19 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Yeah, but only a fool invests in something they don't believe in. As he said, he puts his money where his mouth is... Not only a 3 time Tige owner, but an investor - shoot that makes his opinion even stronger in my view. Come on Sam, really.

Yup, me thinks the thread is dead ;)

(Message edited by dfromtx on December 16, 2005)

 
By Sam (wake1823) on Friday, December 16, 2005 - 1:41 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
My last word....

Donny, going from a boat owner to investing your own money in the dealer puts an entirely new spin on how you talk about your boat (which is now your product) . I have an older malibu....I'd be more than happy to tell anyone every little fault I think the boat has as well as the positive....will wakepro do the same about tige?
Proabbly not. I'm mearly highlighting things I think (my opinion) a potential buyer should consider before his purchase.

(Message edited by wake1823 on December 16, 2005)

(Message edited by wake1823 on December 16, 2005)

 
By Jeremy Krenek (crowmobe540) on Friday, December 16, 2005 - 2:19 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I think what sam is saying is don't buy a tige....go to the most hours link on this discussion...look at the one right before my last commment...need i say more
 
By Sam (wake1823) on Friday, December 16, 2005 - 2:42 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I never said don't buy one, but make an informed decision.

Soemthing I just picked up on .....did anyone else notice that a few of the main participants in this discussion that are tige owners (Donny, victor) bought boats from the same tige deaelrship and registered recently? and wakepro and brandon are the owners?

(Message edited by wake1823 on December 16, 2005)

 
By Mike (ponyh8r) on Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 11:51 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Tris,

I have a 2004 Tige 21I. After having some trouble with the engine alignment, my dealer tried to fix it several times. After they determined that they could not get it fixed they sent the boat back to Abiline to the factory. 2 days later I had my boat back and it ran like a champ. Just another benifit of having the factory in the same state.

 
By Kyle Cramm (00wakesetter) on Monday, December 19, 2005 - 12:09 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Sam, you figuring things out way too fast.
 
By Kurt Assenberg (balti) on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 3:05 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hi Tristram

Yeah I had the same issue as you, deciding which boat. I settled for the Tige and honestly don't regret it for a moment. I bought the '05 22v.
I tested the Xstar, x 10 and Malibu wakesetter. i also owned the old X2.

The tige hull is solid and the taps really works. I love the idea of being able to change the wake shape. Also worth mentioning that taps becomes very handy with holeshot and vary the wake with different weight configurations.

Malibu uses the wedge....it broke after 15 minutes of riding.

I rode this weekend with 5 ppl, 3 sacs + stock ballast full ... taps on 3-4 and the wake was crisp. After my mates left I had less weight in boat all i did was push the taps to 8 and I was back to the same shape and size wake.






 
By Sam (wake1823) on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 6:17 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
"After my mates left I had less weight in boat all i did was push the taps to 8 and I was back to the same shape and size wake"

Trim Tabs or in this case Tige's Taps system won't increase the size of a wake , but will change it's shape. Think of a boat w/o trim tabs as having a "normal" wake with trim tabs you can decrease the size of the wake but cannot increase it past it's "normal" size. if that makes sense

"when I see misinformation about the product or company that I have invested in, I call it out."

One of us is wrong...can you please clarify.



 
By Kurt Assenberg (balti) on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 7:42 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
sorry sam , let me clarify...

I was short two people.

The wake with the current settings ie. taps 3-4, full stock ballast + 3 sacs + 2 ppl was "flatter" , than when I had 4 ppl.

The moment we pushed the taps to 8 and adjusted speed accordingly the wake returned to its original shape the size seemed the same. How much difference 2 people will make to size , i am not sure.

The point I was making is the ease at which one can compensate the wake for loss in weight and changes in speed to get the same or similar wake.

to be honest I was pleasantly surprised with this discovery because until then I was under the impression that taps had some advantage but not to the extent I had witnessed.




 
By talltigeguy (talltigeguy) on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 7:48 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I agree with Sam on the size of the wake issue with Tige. Wake size is a matter of water displacement. It is impossible to have the same wake with and then without extra weight. I have enjoyed the TAPS a lot to adjust the steepness of the wake.

I do beleive that Tige wakes UNWEIGHTED are generally bigger than most others, due to the fact they are heavier to start with, and due to the hull shape that allows the transom to settle a little deeper into the water.

 
By Brandon Raymond (big_brandon) on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 8:10 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Sam, have you ever rode behind, or even been in a Tige???? I am not talking about a '99 or 2000??? Tige is beefy, durable and DOES throw a sic wake, and when you get around H-town, hit me up and I will prove this to you and any other NAYSAYER out there. PEACE!!


This thread is dead!!!!

 
By Sam (wake1823) on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 9:05 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I've riden behind an older 97 or 98 DD (no comment) that's it and have looked at the newer. (05 v-drives). Like I mentioned earlier Tige should remove a few layers of fiberglass and spend more $$$ on the interior. For the kind of money a new tige costs they lack some of the "bling" in the interior when compared to the big 3 (comparable models/price). I have not been in an 06.

(Message edited by wake1823 on December 21, 2005)

(Message edited by wake1823 on December 21, 2005)

 
By Greg w (whitie) on Wednesday, December 21, 2005 - 9:58 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
drip drip drip.
Dude seedoo makes the best boat out ther i dont know what yall are talking about.


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