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WakeWorld Discussion Board » >> Boats, Accessories & Tow Vehicles Archive » Archive through April 01, 2004 » beware of tige « Previous Next »
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Friday, February 27, 2004 - 9:59 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
my name is mike and a own a 2002 tige 20v. i bought the 40k boat thinking i would have summers of fun and trouble free performance. not the case at ALL!!!!!!. i have a 40k peace of junk. my first summer out and the tranny goes out. to add to the list the tower was cracking the gell coat, the powder coat was flaking off the tower, the ski pole was hitting the fiberglass were it comes up and cracks it all up. while i was getting the tranny replaced i replaced the v-drive(at my own expence!!) with a reduction one in hopes to prevent premature wear on the engine so it would not have to work as hard. with no more than 5 hours on the new tranny and v-drive the tranny goes out once again and the v-drive started making some noise. at the same time the engine quits. at this piont i am so disapointed in the boat i did not know what to say. when you look at the engine its clear that its in the boat cocked to the side. this is what caused the ski pole to crack the fiberglass and you can not even change the fuel filter because its being wedged into the boat structure. this is were it gets good.
merc was giving the dealer ship a hard time about the tranny so the dealer ship went to tige. this is what they said. "its not our problem!!!!!!" what?? i am so disapointed in this boat. i traded from a moomba to this boat and now wish i had not.
my advise to everyone would be to STAT AWAY!!! once they sell you a boat you are no one. plus it seemes to me from my own personall boat that the product is not worth the money. i have paid to many boat payments while the boat set in the dealership shop. summer is on the way and i still have no boat
maybe i just got a FRIDAY boat. i wish they would buy it back and then let it sit in there shop.

 
By Brent Huling (captainfreedom) on Friday, February 27, 2004 - 10:34 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I am sorry to hear about your problems Michael. Unfortunately, I don't buy your story. With all of these things going wrong, the dealership should be taking care of everything immediately with no expenses out of your pocket.

On top of that, if you were still having these issues, why wouldn't you just drive it directly over to corporate and make them fix it?

Either you aren't giving us all the facts, or something isn't adding up. Tige would be the first to jump in and help you out if there were issues with your boat. I am on my second Tige in 3 years and both have been trouble free.

You sure there aren't any details you are leaving out of your story?

 
By Bill J (sdboardr99) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 12:20 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Wow, I have 450 hours on my 2002 20v and I've only had a couple of minor problems. Nothing with the engine, v-drive, or tranny.

 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 4:28 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
BILL, like i said i must have a friday boat. as for the story thats no lie. i will admit the first tranny they fixed with no problems, and i did buy(at my expence) the new v-drive for the reduction in the gear.
for the rest of it, thats that. i should not have to drive my boat to corporate! the dealer ship asked tige if they wanted the boat to look over and they said"no we are not repair men" if merc is giving the dealer ship flak about the tranny tige should be on there butts to get my boat fixed if they cared about it.
so im sorry if yo dont buy it. you dont have to, i bought it and i am paying for it every month.
all im saying to the people out there getting ready to buy a wakeboard boat is BEWARE!! i know every boat mfgr makes bad a bad boat or two, but it really says alot on how they take care of there customers. you might not have had problems with yours so you did not have to deal with it. good for you. i hope you never do.

 
By Mike (upupnaway) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 5:01 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I don't care how good a product is, there will always be a few lemons that slip through. I hope tige steps up to the plate and does what is right.
good luck man.

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 6:16 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
My experience with Merc. and Tige' was the same. Marc said Tige' problem and Tige' said Merc. problem. I would never buy another boat with Mercruiser in it due to quality issues I have had with Mercruiser in two different boats and their complete lack of response or willingness to help me when I had my Tige' problems.

I hope you are making the storey up based on the responses you have received accussing you of doing such. Otherwise, the responses you are receiving are a complete undeserved slap in the face.

 
By JONb (jonb) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 7:56 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
that really sucks
 
By Tom Barnard (tlb) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 8:39 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
My advice is to keep posting about this on this and other forums. Maybe going to a boat show that this dealership is at on a busy sunday and complaining like hell all afternoon will get something done.
 
By wallyworld (wallyworld) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 9:01 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
why dont you tell us what dealership isnt taking care of you so we can get their side of the story?
 
By Nick Heckerson (kstateskier) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 11:34 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Guys, I think this one is at least halfway legit. If he was making up the story he would have used a new username, not a name he has been registered under for almost 2 years.

I agree with Doug, stay away from Merc if possible, they seem to care less about their customers. I think they should stick with I/Os.

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 11:58 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Mercruiser is so massed produce they seem to be more hit or miss and. Of course any engine/tranny etc is subject to bad ones. My biggest frusteration was trying to get someone on the telephone to help. I don't know if it is better now, but back then it was an exercise in frusteration and futility to get a live person on the telephone from Mercruiser to help troubleshot.

I even resorted to calling other Tige mechanics at large Tige's dealerships around the country back then because both my dealer and I was not getting any response and we had replaced everything and done everything we could think to do. I did talk to mechanics from two other dealers just to see if they had encountered similar problems and to see if we were missing anything in our trouble shooting efforts. Kind of sad when you have to resort to calling mechanics at other dealerships because you cannot get any response or help.

Needless to say, my problems never got resolved and the boat remained screwed up until the day my dealer reluctantly took it in on trade to avoid a lawsuit.

 
By Terry Barrett (terry_barrett) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 12:11 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael, I read your post this morning and called Andrew Reyes who is the Customer Service contact at Tige Boats. He is not available at a computer today so he asked me to make this post for him. Call him first thing Monday morning at the factory and he will make every effort to resolve any issues that you have with your boat. He can be reached at 325-676-7777 or tigeman@tige.com. I hope this helps. Terry
 
By Michael Gilbert (leftcoastpunk) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 1:19 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I do not own a tige personally, but from my experience with them and the dealer here in Phoenix, Terry, I have only good things to say about them. I'm sure they will make every effort to satisfy you as a customer. I know a few years ago Brett offered Doug a new 20v because he had such a bad experience with his boat. Good luck
 
By Grant Stewart (elmog) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 1:29 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Obviously Tige does not manufacture the engine or the tran so you can't really blame them for any drive train issues. Just as long as they/your dealer step up.
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 2:36 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Brett offerred to TRADE me a new 20V for my $ 60k MSRP X-Star. This was after I traded the 21i for the X Star and lost a lot of money in the process. Too bad that they didn't offer to trade me a 20V for the $ 20k 21i that wouldn't stay running. It is also too bad that the offers/help came only after negative posts on here.
 
By dane (greatdane) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 2:43 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Grant wrote: "Obviously Tige does not manufacture the engine or the tran so you can't really blame them for any drive train issues"

So, if Ford/Chevy out-source their motor production, then they get to avoid all waranty issues?

 
By thomas ryan (g3revenge) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 2:44 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
here is my .02. when your tranny was removed the first time, was it inspected for the actual cause of the damage? (i will not replace a chunk of expensive metal until i know what killed it.) was the engine ever aligned or did it cock to one side when it blew the second time? are the bolts still tight on the mounts or did they vibrate loose. did the tranny or v-drive box over heat? where the internals blue from getting hot? did you have blockage in the water intake that caused all of this? i would investigate before blame was placed on anybody.

merc is correct to climb up the dealers rear quarters for not properly aligning the motor. tige would not be responsible to warrent oversight of your dealer. but if everything overheated, i would say that that is your responsibility and thus covered by your insurance. for example...pick up an ice bag on the lower unit of an outboard or i/o and it will smoke the motor just the same.

i do hope you get it fixed, but i have a hard time finding blame with either tige or merc until more is known. is your old transmision laying around? the gear teeth would be blue if it was run hot and the fluid would smell burnt. if the engine was out of align, the output bearing would be 'making noise' as you described.

(Message edited by g3revenge on February 28, 2004)

 
By zach (klk) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 3:11 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I read all of it and i am leaning the same way as thomas. It's possible the dealer installed/fixed something wrong and won't fess up to it. That would be why Tige' nor Mercruiser is responsible. Just like the man said, you don't replace without knowing whats wrong. And, they could have used the wrong part when puting in the v-drive. I suggest taking it to someone else to get another opinion on whats wrong exactly and why.
 
By thomas ryan (g3revenge) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 3:52 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
i read your post again and it sounds like the motor was mis-aligned or loose from the factory.(assuming you ski pole is attached to the motor on your model.)

your dealer probbably never touched the front mounts and just slipped in the 2nd tranny without re-aligning anything. (aligning a v-drive is very complicated with two boxes.)

the percentage of blame is still a tough call unless your first transmission can be inspected.

 
By JohnE (tigejohn21i) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 4:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Xtigeman: It's a shame that Tige didn't take care of you before you lost money. They could've easily made it up by selling you more boats. I don't understand the nearsightedness of some dealer.. they think they've sold you your last boat or something.
 
By JohnE (tigejohn21i) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 4:20 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Mike: you should hire a lawyer and go after the dealer. The dealer clearly is representing Merc and Tige in the sale. It's the dealers problem to go after Merc or Tige, and their responsibility to be your representitive in fixing your boat. I'd threaten the crap out of em.
 
By Tom Barnard (tlb) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 5:09 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Who cares if it's Tige or Merc that is responsible. The dealer should take care of it. Please post the dealers name so we all know who not to deal with.
 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 5:38 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
ok thanks for the response everyone. i think if tige chose to put this motor in there boat, then they should be ready to stand behind it!!! no matter what! i know everything man maid is subject to fail, and i was more than understanding on the first one. the engine has been shifted over since delivery. my dealership told tige about the problems and asked then if they wanted to take a look at it and thats when they said they were not repair men. the dealership i bought the boat from went out of business shortly after i took delivery of the boat so this one (dock side marine) has been doing the service. i do not think its there fault. when they got stumped they called tige. thats what they should do. tige told them it was not there problem.

it comes down to this. its a tige! so every thing in it as far as im concerned is tige. they felt good enough about the products to put them in there premier wakeboard boats. so they should take care of any problems the dealer ship has with the manufacturer of the products.
i agree they should fix the problems with the engine sitting off to side. i believe this probably caused it from the begining. the dealership tried to align it and can not. you run out of adjustment before it would align. which is why they called tige. also i have not been able to change fuel filter because its wedged into the boat structure.
i do not care if you believe me. i am just trying to educate the people that may be interested in buying a new boat so they can think about this while makeing there decision.
thank you mike gill

 
By matt (supraman) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 5:59 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Gill,

The problem you're dicussing is a problem across the boating industry. From bass boats to cruisers. You're right, it should be more like the automotive industry where you know where to go when you have a problem with your boat and they can address it in a timely fashion. However, it's not that way now. There are a lot of reasons, a major one of which is parts warehousing and distribution network logistics. (Your local dealer simply can't have all the parts on hand to fix anything that may go wrong with your boat.) Some of the giants in recreational boating are working vigorously to change this, as it's key to long-term customer satisfaction, improved boating experiences and growing the potential boating customer base.

I believe it's still at least a couple years from happening. I'm not sure how long it will take to trickle down to wakeboard boats. In the mean time, I empathize with your frustation and I'm sorry to hear about your negative experience. Good luck!

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 7:07 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Deja vu with me. I just had different type of engine problem, but my dealer told me they dropped the Tige' line because they told me they couldn't keep them on the water and they were baffled by my main motor issues. They tried to fix it maybe 6 or 7 times. Although they remained in business, they did drop the line and were not succesful at acting as an intermediary to get my problems resolved or get me a new boat. My boat sat at my dealer more than 1/2 of the year and a half that I owned it.

My dealer even had another local motor specialist look at it for trouble shooting because we couldn't get any help. The last time it died, my friend who was using it swam it back to shore, put it on the trailer and hauled it off to the dealer where it sat from maybe October until April. I told the dealer I was never coming to pick it up and if I did not get a new boat I would sue everyone involved. I would have except for a conflict in that my law firm represented that dealer.

I couldn't sell the boat to anyone because it wouldn't stay running and I would have gotten sued. My only option was to trade it in, get a new boat and let the dealer deal with selling the lemmon to someone else. To my recollection, they gave me about $ 17K or so after I had paid over $ 25k + tax so maybe $ 28k for it just a year and a half earlier and I had spent about another $ 3k on a stereo, put a tower on it (maybe $ 1,500 or so, cannot recall specifically), new prop, paid for some gel coat work, bought new trailer tires, fixed a but load of tears in the upholstery and etc. If I remeber correctly, I lost about $ 16k + all of my boat payments I made for a year and a half for a boat that was probably away from the dealer and in my actual possession for maybe 6 months during which it would die without warning or not even start at the boat ramp. The engine was the major issue, but my hull was sagging to where the walk through windshield would swing completely through after it was adjusted as far as it would go, guages failed and/or one fell behind the dash, pop up cleat fell off into the water, vynil tears and cuts everywhere, glove box broke, latch for rear seat broke, staduim seating broke, mysterious stains bleed through on the vynil, trailewr bunk fell off, had two blow outs on same trailer tire, throttle cable, 2 water pumps, water leaked in winshield area and submerged the battery, the front eye hook area screwed up and leaked water in, I had this spot on the hull where the gel coat fell out in chunks and even after I paid a couple hundred dollars to fix, the chunks fell right back out, and a whole lot of engine work and troubleshooting are just some of what I can recall.

The sad part about it, I was just so dog gone happy to get rid of the boat and get a new boat I did not even care about throwing away $ 16k lost at the time. Candidly, I don't care what boat anyone buys, but just thought I would convey my old story many of which have heard just to let you know your not alone and/or it could be worse.

You are luckier than I as this forum now seems to help people get responses so I have no doubt that you will in all likeliehood be taken care of.

 
By zach (klk) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 8:10 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Curious? Micheal, how is it that you paid 40k for a 2002 when it is 2004? And, if it's used have you ever thought of how the old owner could have miss treated it? And, if you just bought a new 2002 being that its 2004 maybe there was a reason that it hadn't sold yet.
 
By bill montanye (bill) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 8:15 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zach if you read close he said the first summer out he started having problems so he could have bought the boat brand new late 2002 and got the boat early 2003 but still it was brand new in 03..so now its early 04 meaning hes had it one full year and got to run it hard one summer and already it has been in and out of the shop more then in his own yard and on the water hence the frustration...

I hope Tige steps up and takes care of the problem ,maybe taking the lemmon back and putting him back into a 2004 20v for the same money he has left on his original note..throw in a few upgrades for his trouble and all will be well..let the dealer,merc ,and tige decide who eats the most of the loss..that would be the right thing to do..

good luck mike

 
By Bill (skionone) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 8:44 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
"the engine has been shifted over since delivery"
I've got to ask why in the world did you take delivery of the boat with this type of problem? Did you buy the boat new or used? If you bought it new than I would assume that you have warranty and at least have a leg to stand on. Also, I find it very hard to believe that Tige told you that it was not their problem(even if it really wasn't their problem)

 
By Kevin Wood (kevin_wood) on Saturday, February 28, 2004 - 9:24 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Mike, The issue is the dealer. If you're still working with Chris at Dockside, find someone else to work on your boat. He's a nice guy but can't fix/diagnose boat problems. He was also the primary mechanic at the old dealership 3-4 months before they went under. He worked on my boat for about a year. Shoot me an e-mail if you want to discuss details. I would definitely call Andrew.
 
By JohnE (tigejohn21i) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 8:05 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
The issue is definitely the dealer. I would find out their legal status, and go after them. If they have been wiped from the face of the earth, which is unlikely, then, or simultaneously, go after Tige directly. And by go after, I mean get some legal counsel to make your phone calls for you. It shouldn't cost too much and a good business lawyer that is familiar with UCC laws etc will know exactly how to approach them -- may even educate them on just how responsible for the merc problem that they are.
 
By www.tigeowners.com (tigeownerscom) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 8:29 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael, for future reference you may want to post over at www.tigeowners.com. Our moderators include Andrew and Harvey from Tigé. They answer any questions or comments that the members have. Other members include most Tigé dealers and some of the TeamTigé riders.
 
By shane (auto) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 10:55 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
wow, all I can is I am glad that i have a bu bought from WSA, never have been w/o a boat on the weekend. In fact two days before the 4th they came to my house and picked up the boat, and brought it back all fixed.
 
By Jeff (tigetx) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 11:47 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Have you contacted Tige directly prior to making your problems public???

If not why not give the company a chance to make you a satisfied customer.



(Message edited by tigetx on February 29, 2004)

 
By oscar (zacky) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 12:40 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Man, that's too bad. I know all too well the frustrations of having a brand new boat sit at a dealership for weeks/months on end. It pretty much makes you want to puke every day that the is gone.
One question. Did Tige tell you that the problem is not their's since they are not repair men, or are you getting your information from the dealership on what Tige has said? Not to discredit your problems, but I find it hard to believe that Tige would tell you it is not their problem. What I have seen is a lot of the old "passing of the buck"; issues between the dealership and, in this case, Merc. Neither one wants to step up and fix the problem, and they both blame the other for the problems. There is also the possibility, depending if you have talked to Tige directly or not, that Tige does not even know the severity of the problem(s). Either way, Tige knows about the problems now, and I am sure they will step up and make the situation right...

I hope it all works out for you...

 
By bruce walker (bruce) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 8:01 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Doug- Don't leave out Tige's offer to buy you a brand new boat. I know you declined because of your $15,000 stereo system, but Brett Thurley/Tige redeemed themselves (a little late)with this more than generous offer.


 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 8:07 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Look up above. That was discussed and it was more than just a stereo. I would have declined even without the stereo being in the boat. I could have ripped out the McIntosh/expensive stuff and put cheap stuff in no problem.
 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 10:04 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
ok chris is not the tech at dock side its lamar butts is the one and only tech. chris left three months before water ski boats went under.
also yes they (water ski boats ) are not to be found. they owe me $2000 for a hippo ballast system i ordered when i bought the boat.
i bought the boat the end of 02 and only had one summer of 03 the boat has about 67-72 hours. all my friends have like 250 hours on their boats that are 02'
i will talk to tige on monday.

also i did not notice the engine until i took the boat out a couple times and by that time the dealership had gone out of business with no notice. they were there one day and just gone the next.
i do not think they would tell me that to my face. they would just give you a bunch of corporate bull.
at his point i dont even want the boat anymore. as of right now the list of things not fixed
tranny #2, v-drive #2clunks and rattles, engine will not start, fiberglass around ski pole cracked, engine cocked over to left side, powdercoat flaking off tower, fiberglass crackes under tower mounts, gas gauge out,
i hope you are correct (oscar) .

 
By talltigeguy (talltigeguy) on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 12:28 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Most of your problems are clearly related to the jacked engine. It doesn't help that your boat repair guy is not a Tige dealer. They should definitely take care of you on the other small things like the powdercoat, gel cracks and gas guage.

Clearly your mechanic didn't ask himself why the tranny went out so quick.

You've never hit ground?

 
By Keith (rkg) on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 1:48 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Just hypotheticaly Doug, if they offered a 22V with the PCM ZR6, would you have considered it?
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 4:32 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
More tempting without the Mercuiser and the 22 V is apparently a more expensive boat. Just don't think I would have done it because: (1) I was very happy with my X-Star; (2) no-one around here to work on Tige' that I was aware of anyway; and (3) I would hate to give up a boat I love for something that is still is a question mark in my mind. Don't think I would have done it that late in the ball game. When I mentioned it to my wife and friends who I boarded with that had been in/behind my Tige', they all thought I was crazy to even think about considering it. There are people on this site and that are currently posting that could tell you how bad my boat really was and how bad of a run around I got. They, however, are very non-confrontational individuals when it comes to this board, but they were the ones who told me I would be crazy to trade my X-Star in on a Tige'.
 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 10:08 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
dock side is the new tige dealer in my are. so they should take care of all the stuff. i would trade my peace for the 21v or 22i
 
By Keith (rkg) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 8:01 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
That's cool, sometimes a bad taste never leaves your mouth. I was just curious what your take on that would be.

Did you sell the X or decide to keep it?

 
By bruce walker (bruce) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 10:08 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
My bad Doug.
 
By Steven Hahn (solo) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 10:12 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
This will be my fourth season re-reading all about Doug's Tige' issues........

Just kidding Doug, I don't want to get you started...

Mike, I hope you get things worked out. In my experience, Tige has always stepped up and made an effort to satisfy their customers. I hope they do the same for you.

 
By steven hattaway (stevenf) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 10:16 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
yeah the houston boat dealership water ski boats near greenspoint mall was shady to say the least. just like the guy who is posting about his problem stated they were there one day and gone the next. I can vouch for that i used to drive by that place all the time. One day it was there then the next gone....If tige doesnt fix it go trade with daryl moores there a very upstanding dealership in houston to work with.
 
By Jeff Salem (jsalem) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 10:56 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Get rid of the boat. Cut your losses. Buy a Malibu.
 
By Kaiser Soze (tattoobling) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 11:08 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
or a Vortex, Brett Svfarvra, Bayliner....anything
 
By Bob (bob) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 11:21 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I got halfway through this thread and it sure seems people freely blame merc when they know nothing. The engine was misaligned by TIGE at the factory, fails trans and engine and just because it has a merc they are all BAD APPLES :-) :-)
Id realy like to see some numbers, percentage wise, on who's product has the best reliablity. Merc makes way more units then the other (i believe) two?

 
By thomas ryan (g3revenge) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 11:32 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
i like the black anchor stuff myself. they have always gotten me back to shore.
 
By Tony Carroll (blindsiderider) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 11:37 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Doug, It seems to me that if your 2002 boat has a problem and it has been delt with, then 2004 is not the time to complain about a dealer that is out of business. It seems to me that you got a raw deal from the dealer and it had nothing to do with Tige.
The other thing that always cracks me up on this site is that as soon as someone post one bad thing about any brand of boat there will be at least a half a dozen post that will follow that have nothing to do with the thread other then the wonderfully helpful and informative comments like, "Get rid of the boat. Cut your losses. Buy a Malibu." What does that have to do with the matter at hand and I am sure that I could find just as many people to bad mouth whatever brand it is that that post is saying they should buy. Why are boat owners so negitive towards any other brand of boat other then what they own at the time. I am sure all of you have seen the person who one year is bashing brand X but then they went out and bought brand X and now they bash brand Y. It just seems like a big NA-NA my boat is better then yours. I am glad that I stopped that after I got my first bicycle at age 3 and found out that no matter what, people are going to buy differant brands and it is not my place to badmouth there choice.

 
By Rich (rson) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 1:20 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I vote to make Doug Hansen a Mod on the Tige owners forum....Does Tige still use wood?


 
By Mike Souza (ridn9high) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 2:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I had the same problem with my Tige. Boat it new 2002 and the first weekend out fuel pump went out. Then the 2nd summer came around and the tranny took a crap and the belt shreaded 3 times and then there goes the fuel pump again. So took it back to where it was purchased in Livermore,Ca(not to say any names) but they did a crappy job. Their shop is no longer there. My boat sat for over a month last summer because this boat dealership ran me in circles. I called the owner of Tige and he got me in, in San Ramon and boat has ran good ever since.
All motor problems are from Merc and Are not Made by tige. Yes they are the engine in Tige but they do not manufacture them. The stress cracks will be fixed if you talk to the owner in Dallas. He is a very respectable guy and will help you out anyway he can. This winter my boat will be going in for the stress cracks as well, without any cost in my pocket book.
Just remember all boats with towers can have stress cracks, its not just a tige thing.

 
By talltigeguy (talltigeguy) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 3:09 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
So the dealer you're with now is a Tige dealer? They need to step up to the plate.

Out of curiosity, when a boat has a warranty issue, does the dealer pay for that directly or are they reimbursed by Tige? If the dealer is the one to take the cost, then there is incentive for the dealer to not step up.

 
By Mike Souza (ridn9high) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 3:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I was told by San Ramon that for Warranty work that they get paid 60 bucks an hour and they usually charge 90. So the lose money.
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 3:38 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I find it funny how so many people jump in and comment on my situation without even reading the full post. Not to mention any names, TONY, but that is part of what keeps me responding to you Tige' defenders of the faith. You take my situation, TONY, and twist it or don't take time to read, TONY, what exactly happened and who said what.

I would be a great moderator, hehehe. Let me at them.

Keith, still have the X. Man, I dropped off the Cayenne the yesterday for service and they had a brand new Audi RS6. I told my wife she could trade the Cayenne for it, but then I realized I couldn't pull the boat. I am ready to sell the boat right now just so I can get another car. Man, I got problems with buying cars.

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 4:48 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Maybe I could get a head count as to how many votes I get for being the new Tige' moderator. I am in a run off with Tige' defender extraordinaire Mr. Hand, I mean Steve Hahn.

Who votes for me.

 
By Nick Heckerson (kstateskier) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 5:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I didn't see Doug bash Tige at all, he pretty much told his experience. I don't think I would have taken a new boat from a company I had that much trouble with if I was happy with my current boat. But I'm already labeled a Tige bashed myself, so I guess my opinion really doesn't matter.

I wonder why the Big 3 never get a full bashing thread devoted to them. Hmmm......

 
By Tony Carroll (blindsiderider) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 5:20 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Doug you bash just as bad as Mike so I group you all in the same group. WHINERS!! But not a problem I am just a kid what do I know?
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 5:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hahaha. Brush up on the reading skills. I take it your not voting for me Tony.
 
By Dan (dfish) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 6:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Lemon Law: Some States have lemon laws that protect boat owners. Go to your States Attorney Generals website and look up consumer protection.

Lawyers: By the time you hire one, you have lost. Even if you win, you will loose the attorneys fees.

Warranties: Read and understand them before you buy!!! Stay away from manufacturers who are not big enough in the industry to stand behind what they put in their boats!

With my CC's and MC's I take them to the dealer, the dealer fixes them. Any warranty claims, my dealer takes care of them behind the scenes--as they should.

Good luck with Tige!

 
By WakePro (skireel) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 6:35 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
We bought our Tige 23V new in 2002 and have had very few issues. We have done most of our hard testing for the SKIREEL on this boat and have put over 400 hours on it in a year and a half. I service the boat at Lakeshore Marine in Conroe / Montgomery because they are Mercrusier cerified and the motor and V drive are obviously the componets on the boat that get the most wear and tear. Tige and Lakeshore have been awsome and they know Mercruiser. Never assume a dealer knows the motor and tranny. Ask if they are cerified, if they are not, take it to a certified repair location. Lakeshore services any boat with Mercruiser in it and I have to admit or Tige has been extermely reliable.
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 6:48 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Not sure lemmon laws apply to boats. At least it did not seem to in my area.
 
By Dan (dfish) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 7:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
{http://www.state.tn.us/consumer/index.html,http://www.state.tn.us/consumer/index.html}

This is a link to the consumer protection division of the State of Tennessee. Not all states have a "lemon law" that specifically covers boat but all states have a "Uniform Commercial Code" and a Consumer Protection division to ensure the commercial code is followed.

The phone call and their investigations are free. Federal Law has the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act. Your boat and its warranty is covered by state and federal statutes.

And for all the rest--I AM SURE YOUR TIGEE IS AND HAS BEEN ABOSOULTLY PERFECT!! UNFORTUNATELY MECHANICAL THINGS WILL HAVE MECHANICAL PROBLEMS---SOME MORE THAN OTHERS. EVERYONE MAKES A MISTAKE. WE DO NOT JUDGE A COMPANY BY THE MISTAKES IT MAKES BUT HOW IT CORRECTS THEM!

Tiege needs to step up and trade Mike his boat for a new one and write it off.

 
By Rich (rson) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 8:15 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I think it is time for Tige to step up.... I do not own a boat but maybe in the future I will invest in one and I am 100% sure Tige will not be a model I will look at and I am sure that there are many others that are in my same boat(no pun intended). I ride almost all 'Bu's here in Texas and I have met the Malibu reps and the dealer and the reps stand behind the product 100%. I think people need to realize that when buying a boat not only are you buying a boat but your are buying a Company and dealer that should go to bat for you for ALL problems with the product that they sold you and I have no doubt in my mind that the local 'Bu dealer here would for me.

Good luck with your Tige

 
By Tom Barnard (tlb) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 8:36 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I agree with Dan and Rich, Tige needs to step up and replace this boat. From the description of the problems it sounds like it's beyond repair.
 
By wallyworld (wallyworld) on Tuesday, March 02, 2004 - 10:18 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
has michael contacted Tige directly? from the posts it sounds like "no" His dealer sucked and he doesnt know how to raise hell to get stuff done right. Tige is not pyschic, maybe if he contacts Andrew directly he will get some answers. Come on Mickey, stand up for yourself!!
 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 5:12 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Doug, I would love to talk to you about the Porsche. Need some feedback before I take the plunge. What do you think of it? Is it the turbo or S version?
 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 5:54 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
And the entire boating industry wonders why sales are flat since 1988? Before someone jumps up about wakeboard boat sales, I’m talking about the industry as a whole and inboard boat sales make up less than 1% of the new boat industry.

This is sad…our industry is failing to keep up. Ask the US auto industry what happened when its attitude was “our cars are good enough”…the Japanese came here and showed people what quality, reliability and affordability really meant (and they never left). Would anyone reading accept this kind of treatment from Honda?

Sure the dealer should have taken care of it…sure the factory should have taken care of it…should Mercruiser should have taken care of it…but guess what ? From the story everyone was too busy pointing fingers and the customer got forgotten about, so NO ONE took care of it.

In the boat business you are working with something very precious to people, their leisure time. This cannot be taken lightly. After the daily grind of work life the boat is an escape. Whether you own a 65 Viking or an X2 this is your chosen means for getting away from it…be it with family or friends and no one wants that taken away from them. We as an industry need to move towards that understanding. Sure we all need to make a profit (selling and delivering the product), but we also need to service the customer to grow our business and secure our long term future.

Put yourself in “Mikes” position; is this what he paid for? I’m not bashing any brand here, I’m bashing the industry I’m a part of…slowly the changes are coming, but after reading this you wonder how long the industry has before the damage is done.

 
By Andrew Reyes (andrew_reyes) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 6:27 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael, This is Andrew from Tige and Terry called me and I asked him to post since I was away from the computer please see his quote... Michael, I read your post this morning and called Andrew Reyes who is the Customer Service contact at Tige Boats. He is not available at a computer today so he asked me to make this post for him. Call him first thing Monday morning at the factory and he will make every effort to resolve any issues that you have with your boat. He can be reached at 325-676-7777 or tigeman@tige.com. I hope this helps. Terry... Michael I have not received a call from you and again if you would like to solve these issues then we must talk. Please give me a call so we can discuss and get to the issues at hand. My number is 325-676-7777, I can not assist you if you do not contact me. Look forward to talking to you.
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 6:28 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zed, are you looking at 993 95 to 98 or the 996 body style 99 to 04. There is nothing like turbo boost if you want to spend the extra money, but both models are awesome. Shhot me an email at

dhanson@gewwlaw.com

if you have questions about specific models and what to be careful about.

 
By Greg Davis (vortech347) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 6:45 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Well put Zedz. I had issues with my CC dealer a couple years back. I had given up on them due to their service departments mistakes made over several warranty issues. I decided to give them one more chance when I bought a tower for my boat.

So I told my whole story to one of the service department managers and he told the owner's son who worked there about my problems. The dealership stepped up to the plate and took care of me. Now I should not have had to go through those problems. But the dealership acknowledged that their service department needed improvement and that they were getting better.

Whoever brought up the lower warranty labor prices hit it dead center. Dealerships hate warranty work because the factory pays a discounted rate. They only want customer pay work. A reputable dealer would treat the warranty customer exactly like they treat a paying customer. Unfortunately, too many dealers care only about the money.

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 8:02 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Greg, they were lucky that they had a customer like you that would extend the "one more chance". We all need to get better...and fast.

FYI, MasterCraft went to full retail labor on warranty 2 years ago in an effort to get dealerships more interested in warranty service. I think it has helped some...unfortunately when given the chance to make a "quick" hit selling a boat vs. the labor rate of warranty the short sighted quick hit wins more often than not.

 
By wallyworld (wallyworld) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 8:29 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Mike, dont you feel stupid?? Why would you seek to discredit Tige and ruin their reputation without first calling Tige yourself?? Dont give me the "well i yelled at my dealer" BS. We all know that we need to go over peoples heads to get stuff done sometimes.

Before you try to make a company look bad, at least give them a chance to make it right!


 
By Mike Souza (ridn9high) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 9:17 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael,
Talk to Andrew as he has asked you to. I spoke with him last summer about my boat and he got it all fixed, and i paid nothing out of my pocket book. He will not run you in circles. Good Luck.
Thanks again Andrew.

Mike Souza

 
By Brent Huling (captainfreedom) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 9:21 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
As I said from the beginning, there was no way this was an accurate story. As soon as Tige found out about this issue, they responded and want to help fix the problem. And don't say they are only responding because you posted on this board. I had a problem with my boat and called the factory. They flew someone from the factory all the way up to Seattle to fix the problem, no questions asked.

As for your post Nick, that could be one of the most idiotic things I have read on here in a while. No one has started a thread devoted to bashing one of the big 3???? Is that your final answer? How about just looking at the current threads up right now? Hmm....pick a boat...okay, how about Malibu? Here you go: http://messageboard.wakeworld.com/MB/discus/messages/3183/101455.html?1078321255

I have no idea what your agenda is, but it is clear you don't like Tige boats. Why do you insist on posting on every Tige thread? It is really getting old. Is Doug paying you to do this? I have friends that own some of the "big 3" boats and have had problems. I don't jump on every thread and rip on those boats. I am tired of your comments and they provide NO value when related to Tige's. At least Doug has a reason/motive behind his comments (although you could really try giving it a rest). Grow up!!

 
By zach (klk) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 9:42 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zedz, sorry man but i don't like Japanese cars and will never buy one, i am a Jeep and Chevy man, trail rated and like a rock baby. Built For us By us.
 
By Peter Chandler (peter_c) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 10:09 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
"unfortunately when given the chance to make a "quick" hit selling a boat vs. the labor rate of warranty the short sighted quick hit wins more often than not"

I am not sure of the stats in the boat market but in the automotive field the service bays produce more net profit than the sales department. The auto manufactures also have less labor times for warranty work, but because of repetion they can beat the clock easily and still make plenty of money.

He does deserve his boat to be fixed properly and hopefully they will extend the warranty for no charge. That would be the right thing to do.

FYI my Chevy is made in Mexico, and the Japanese lead us in automotive technology.

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 10:23 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Different strokes and that’s fine. The point was without the market pressures exerted by the Japanese imports we may still be saddled with the likes of the AMC Hornet, Ford Pinto and Chevy Vega…I wasn’t trying to sell you on Japanese cars I was merely trying to illustrate my point.

But…I couldn’t let this one go…

Built by us for us huh? Jeep is wholly owned by Mercedes Benz Corporation. Which Chevrolet were you referring to…Nova AKA Corolla, Prizm AKA Corolla or the Pontiac Vibe? All are built by NUMMI (the alliance of GM & Toyota) if you can’t beat em join em. By the way GM has not poured a cylinder block (other than GM Performance Parts stuff) in almost ten years…hecho in Mexico.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/business/7945293.htm

 
By Greg Davis (vortech347) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 10:40 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
It's funny how people go and say I will only buy an American car when almost every piece of electronic equipment in their house and in that American car were manufactured overseas.

Take a look at the tags on your clothes sometime. Not many brands are made here.

We live in a global economy where the lines of where things are made have been severely blurred. I like my American made Ford and will look at American made products again when I get ready to trade it in. But if that Nissan Titan or Armada is the better vehicle then I will be buying it over my beloved Ford products.

Besides most of the foreign cars sold here are assembled here and the dealerships are owned by Americans so the majority of the money stays right here in the Good ole USA.

Now for my rant. I don't bash Tige' much anymore because I think they have markedly improved their products. But you Tige' goggled backers need to stop sniffing glue and just sympathize with the guy having problems. HE SHOULD NOT HAVE TO CONTACT TIGE' DIRECTLY TO GET HIS PROBLEMS SOLVED. THAT IS HIS DEALER'S RESPONSIBILITY. AS A DEALER FOR TIGE' (even if he didn't buy it there) THAT DEALER IS THE REPRESENTATIVE FOR THE MANUFACTURER.

Now I do agree he needs to escalate the problem and talk directly to Tige'. But that doesn't negate the fact that he has been severely done wrong by Tige' since it was one of their dealers that has dropped the ball. Hopefully, they will make it right and put him in a replacement boat.

If this had been a MC, CC, Bu or even an aluminum Jon boat my answer would still be the same. The guy is getting jacked and is passing on his experiences to us all.

 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 11:05 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
no i do not feel stupid! i was dealing with a tige dealer. a tige dealer means that tige has trusted then to represent the tige name! so as fare as im concerned i was talking to "tige". also i have not been able to call him until today. thank you.
 
By Pat Frist (qwert1420) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 11:41 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
General Motor's largest engine plant is located in Tonawanda, NEW YORK. The plant manufactures, among others, the following engines: 2.2L 4 cylinder, 3.1L V6, 4.3L V6, & 7.4L V8.

The second largest General Motors engine plant is the Romulus Engine Plant located in Romulus, MICHIGAN. This plant manufactures the 4.3L V6, 4.8L V8, 5.3L V8, & 6.0L V8.

To say the big three US automotives do not manufacture engines in the USA is ridiculous.

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 11:54 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hahaha. According to Mr. Hulling, I am paying you off Michael. That is the most pathetic thing I have heard in a while. I guess jealousy breeds irrational thinking.
 
By zach (klk) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 11:59 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
thanks pat.
as for greg i have a question. Why is it that dealer who did not sell someone the boat should be burdened with extra expenses? That is like saying you, Greg, own a (going neutral because of your bias) funiture store. And, a man walks in saying he as had problems with his 20,000 dollar king size bed furniture that is defective that he bought from someone else's store. (and yes furniture can cost that much) But, your store sells that particular brand along with others. so the man protests that you must fix his problem at your expense. How is that fair. Just like a boat dealer ship, many boat dealerships carry more than one brand, just as my tige' dealer does. Thats why there is a larger company that handles warranty problems when a small buisness goes out of buisness.
waiting patiently for your response.

 
By Nick Heckerson (kstateskier) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 12:26 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
No Doug, you're paying me off!

I think the only reason I post to these is to get you guys riled up because it is so easy. I'll try to stop.

Oh, and as far as the thread you posted Brent, I stand corrected.

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 12:31 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey Pat...if you were referring to my post I said "GM has not poured a cylinder block” I said nothing about “assembling engines”.

Are you asserting that someone posted “the big three don’t assemble engines in the US” because I don’t see that anywhere on this thread?

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 12:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Oops. Shows you how much I think of what he has to say. I just glossed over it but saw something about me paying someone off.

Who has incentive here. I wonder what kind of deal Brent got when he traded that 22R that was practically brand new for a new Tige' hull without the lip curl. I remember telling him that when he rode behind a boat with a real wake similar to the shape and size of the big three, he would trade 22R. He will never admit it though.

 
By Pat Frist (qwert1420) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 1:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zedz,

Have you ever been to an engine plant? An engine block begins as a cast blank. Basically, a hunk of metal in the rough shape of a block. The blank moves through a blockline where it undergoes many, many machining operations, such as cutting, boring, drilling, treating, etc. only to become an engine block at the end of the blockline. An engine block is not "poured" into a finished block. There are many other lines such as crankline, camline, conrod line, head line, etc. which machine their respective components. Then, everything is put together on the assembly line which is only a fraction of what it takes to manufacture an engine, let alone "pour" a blank block.

That being said, the implication of your post was clear that GM does manufacture engines in the USA which is not true.

FYI, the JEEP 4.0L is manufactured at the Kenosha Engine Plant in Kenosha, WISCONSIN, along with the 2.7L and the new 3.5L.

 
By Andrew Reyes (andrew_reyes) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 1:44 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael thanks for talking to me today and as I have stated on the phone my goal is to slove your issues. I am not concerned as to who's fault it could be. You are a Tige customer. As I have stated I do not have any problems fixing your boat, and this would be at no cost to you. The only thing I have requested is for you to transport the boat to Abilene. I understand that you are looking into this and will be waiting for your response. Again thank you for the phone call.
 
By zach (klk) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 3:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
thanks once more pat
 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 3:36 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
well my problem is im stuck with a boat that is clearly jacked up! the only offer i have gotten from tige (andrew) is "we will fix your boat for you at no cost to you" well i would hope so since its under warranty! but they want me to haul it 14 hour round trip from houston to abilene. $400 gas and another $200-500 for food and hotel plus my time, which is very valuable. i guess my point is if i had a moomba, supra, mc, corect craft, malibu. i would only have to haul it about 1/2 hour and get it taken care of. tige is making it out to look like they are doing my a favor by repairing my boat for no cost when its all clearly warranty issues. thats not called stepping up for the customer or trying to make up for the months(6-8) of not being able to use the boat.
so i guess at this point thanks for nothing. due to personal obligations (family and work) and to money issues making a trip to abilene is NOT an option.

 
By Bill J (sdboardr99) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 4:05 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
So did you tell that to Andrew when you talked to him on the phone? From his post it certainly doesn't sound like it.

I'm sure the boat could be shipped to Abilene for less than $1000 (not that $1000 is cheap, just what you are saying it will cost you to drive it there). Maybe Tige will be willing to split the cost of shipping the boat to them.


 
By bill montanye (bill) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 4:06 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I agree with Micheal,they need to do more then just fix it ..Tige needs to come get the boat or have it taken to a local Tige dealer and send there best mechanic from Tige Factory too look at it and fix it there ..then afetr they find out what happened to it ,fix it ,appologize and let mike come test drive it a week and see if he likes it and its fixed to his liking..if its not they need to buy the boat back from him and get him in a new tige of his choice at cost..

WHY??because hes the customer and has been making payments on something he cant use as well as all the headaches hes went through thats added stress in his life he probrably doesnt need..

Offering to fix it isnt enough,Tige come on step up fully and make this customer a believer again before he ends up in another Manufaturers boat and we have yet another Tige basher for life on these boards and those reading this stuff wouldnt even think about buying their first Tige..

I know i wont from the last few years of posts where Tige hasnt fully stepped up to resolve these problems FULLY and the customer is 100% satisfied...

 
By zach (klk) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 4:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
he didn't go about it the right way, if i were him i would be thankful that Tige' will even talk to him after he opened up a Tige' bashing thread instead of actualy calling Tige' for help. Personaly, if i were Tige' i would say sorry to bad you screwed up. Their offer is more than generous when what he has done is taken into the equation, in their eyes they just lost more sales, costing them thousands of dollars all ready, and they haven't even had to fix a boat for free yet.
 
By Shawn Jessup (bigjessup) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 5:09 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zach - Maybe you should re-read what has been said. Tige had plenty of time to step-up and never did. The dealer contacted them several times and Tige responded with "we are not mechanics, its not our problem". It took this thread for them to finally do something, which is inadequate at best.

"Their offer is more than generous"

Why because they built a pos boat and now want the customer to spend 12 hours on the road and almost $1000 dollars out of his pocket to bring their mistake back to them.

Tige needs to step-up. I would expect any mfg to.

 
By Brent Huling (captainfreedom) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 5:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Nice Doug, way to put words in my mouth like a typical lawyer. What I said about paying Nick was a joke if you didn't get it. Obviously your head is so far up your a$$ that you have no humor and don't pay attention to what is being said. I was attacking Nick because what he said was idiotic. I actually defended you on why you always bash Tige. I actually kind of enjoy your posts. Every time someone complains about Tige, I bet myself how long it will take for you to show up and make the same post you have made for the 200th time telling your story. It gets a good laugh out of me.

I also agree with everyone else...Tige should do more to correct this problem. If the dealer screwed Michael over this bad, Tige needs to rectify the problem. However, I do think there is more to the story we are not hearing.

For the record Mr. Hansun, I bought my 22ir for $38k, and almost 2 years later, sold it for $36k. I didn't trade it in. I originally bought the boat because I ski and thought it would be more versatile for my family. Once I bought the boat, all I do now is wakeboard and my kids have no interest in skiing, so I got a V drive. Nice theory, but it didn't have anything to do with the lip. If I could get a 22ir wake as big as the 22V, I would buy another 22ir. I loved that boat. And anyone who knows me, knows that I don't keep any of my toys more than a few years before I buy a new one. Nice try though. I try so hard to not even comment on any thread you are on because you are such a jackass. This just validates my theory.

 
By zach (klk) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 6:36 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
dude obviosly the dealer is craping and not doing what was supposed to have been done. however, its not the dealers responsibility if the boat didn't come from them, doesn't mean the dealer isn't being an a-hole but the it isn't the new dealers fault. and tige' obviously didn't have a good idea of what was going on, notice its 2004 and just now has Andrew found out about the problem and even better it still took the guy a couple of days to call tige even after tige asked him too, so he shows signs of slackness. take it how you will i have my opinion and you have yours
 
By Rich (rson) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 6:46 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
wow, this is stacking up to be as good as post from last years discussion about wood in the Tige.

Doug you remember that?

http://messageboard.wakeworld.com/MB/discus/messages/65921/33608.html

(Message edited by rson on March 03, 2004)

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:05 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Yep, I remember they always seem to make it personal and resort to name calling . . .
 
By Nick Heckerson (kstateskier) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:13 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
This looks like it's turning out to be another give me a free boat thread like the wedge post, I'm going to quit defending it. What kind of fuel are you putting in your tow vehicle Michael? $400 in fuel for a 830 mile round trip, $500 in lodging and food. I must still have that college mentality. I could do the whole trip in less than $300 I bet.

I love how a little boat argument can set somebody off enough to call another person a jackass!

(Message edited by kstateskier on March 03, 2004)

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:21 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
It is a bit of a dilema, but what you gonna do,leave your boat crapped out and keep paying your boat note. Surely, you guys could work out a meet you halfway thing or pay some high school part time floor sweeper to pick the boat up and bring it in.

I can understand the frusteration about the initial offer not seeming the perfect solution, but sleep on it and maybe you guys can come to a better compromise. Sometimes, it just isn't worth fighting over a principle. Maybe you can get them to throw in some options, a bigger motor or trade you up. With some many engines or so much work, it would seem to devalue the boat if you ever tried to sell it especially if someone asked you about the problems you had in the past with the boat.

 
By Greg Davis (vortech347) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
zach, where in my post did I say the new dealer should pay out of their pocket to fix Michael's boat? You show me where I said that and I will eat my words.

I said the new dealer was a representative of Tige' and they should be representing Michael's interests to Tige' since he has brought in the boat for a warranty issue. How tough is that to understand? If it's a problem that the old dealership caused then, of course, the new dealer should not have to foot the bill. Then it comes down to convincing Tige' to step up.

But then again, that's something the new dealer should be willing to address if they want to make a customer out of Michael.

You really need to take off your Tige' glasses. This is not a thread singling out Tige' just to make them look worse than other brands. This guy has gotten the shaft from a dealer and now it seems Tige' as well.

If a manufacturer told me I had to deliver my boat to them personally that was out of town, for warranty work, I would be livid. There is a Tige' dealership in Houston. This is not a stereo that you can ship for $30 to get fixed. It's a $40,000 boat under warranty with a factory authorized dealer nearby.

 
By andy lewis (aman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:39 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
To Michael Gill: do you live in Southern California? curious...one of my family members thinks she might know you.
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:43 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Profile says he lives in Texas. That would really suc driving your boat from California to Tige' in Texas.
 
By Tom Kuzma (thekuz) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:47 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey guys. I got it! Here is a template for all you know-it alls. This will save all of you the trouble of typing to much. Just fill in the blanks!!! Here goes...

Don't ever buy__________________. It is a piece of junk. I would never even give _________________ a chance in my driveway, let alone my lake! _________________ is the worst boat ever made. I know this from my great experience. I have driven every boat out their and I am an expert. __________________ has the worst wake in the world. I know because people say I am the next Danny Harf. You should buy _____________________ because this is the boat I own and it is the best because I did tons of research and ridden behind a million boats. Don't ever buy _______________ or____________________ or ________________. They don't have enough cup holders.
P.S. I am also an expert in cars, blenders, stereos, and support hose. Let me know and I will give you my EXPERT opinion on any of the above topics.

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:58 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Great form, but a little late. He already bought his boat.
 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 7:59 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Pat,
“Have I ever been to an engine plant?” Well I’m not sure what this has to do with it but yes, I have. As to the assembly procedure you were so kind to outline for me, I believe your second sentence contains the words “cast blank”…would you care to explain how the iron got into the mold so that it could be called “cast iron”? Have you ever been to a foundry?

FYI…the Germans own the plant that those jeep engines are being built in and the equipment that they are being built with…My problem with it, they bought all of it after the American public bailed Chrysler out…you do remember 1980 don’t you?

I now return you to your previously hi-jacked thread…Sorry.

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 8:05 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
The highjacking part is more entertaining and keeping this demon thread alive.
 
By Greg Davis (vortech347) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 8:12 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Ok, now hijack your way over to my new thread and share some knowledge.
 
By Dan (dfish) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 8:13 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post

Just for my edification:

1. Who chooses its dealers?
2. Who chooses the components?
3. Who is required to stand behind a product?

And...

Who asked for a free boat? Who expected a free boat?

One of the biggest benefits of a board like this is education--good and bad so we can all learn by the mistakes of others and have a strong enough voice to hold the answer to my three questions accountable.

 
By zach (klk) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 9:24 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
greg how do you expect the dealer to fix a boat without it costing them, they have to pay someone for the time, regardless of whether thats phone calls are actual maintence.
 
By Rich (rson) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 9:27 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
all the more reason for the dealer to fight for a Lemon repurchase.
 
By zach (klk) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 9:27 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
nick once again we agree, i am on the east coast i could do it for 300 bucks too. with college mentality you can do almost anything with very little cash
 
By oscar (zacky) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 10:22 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I like how many of you are taking the "out of business dealership's" side of the story and blaming Tige for not knowing about the problems. I guess it makes it easier for you and justifies yor reasoning for bashing Tige. Are you kidding me? It wouldn't surprise me to know that the dealership never even contacted Tige about the problems. If they knew they were going out of business, why would they want to get involved knowing that in a few days/months they would no longer have to deal with it? To think that a boat manufacturer would tell a dealership "it's not our problem, we're not mechanics" is absurd and absolutely ridiculous. And to think that some of you would believe a dealership over a manufacturer is even more ridiculous. If that were the case, I bet you all paid full price for your boats too...

Don't get me wrong, it is a bad situation for one to be in. In my opinion, it sounds like the dealership made the situation 100 times worse by feeding you a bunch of garbage about things Tige may or may not have said. I do think that slamming Tige in your initial post without even talking to them and getting the facts straight was probably not the best way to go, but hey, what's done is done. Unfortunately, if you had a strong dealership backing you, this could have been resolved long ago and without as many headaches. The situation that has been magnified by your dealer (or lack thereof) is now Tige's to fix; which I am sure they will.

Oh, and by the way, Brent, nicely put!

 
By Pat Frist (qwert1420) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 10:24 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zedz,

The reason I asked is you seem to have no knowledge of how or where US automotive engines are manufactured. You keep repeating that engine plants are just engine assembly plants. This is not true. The critical components i.e. block, heads, crank, camshaft, conrods, etc. are manufactured from raw material at the engine plant. Which engine plant have you been to and when?

Chrysler paid back the government every dime plus interest. Jeep is a division of DaimlerChrysler as is Mercedes Benz. DCX is a publically traded company owned in part by the Germans.

And yes I have been in foundries and steel mills in the USA.

Sorry for the theft...

 
By Rich (rson) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 10:30 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I think with all the collective minds (some being better than others) we can send a nice letter to Tige.

So far we have discussed metal extruding, boat construction and the Lemon laws. I am sure we can collectivly construct a nice letter to help this man out. Let me start:

Dear Tige and Company,


(Message edited by rson on March 03, 2004)

 
By oscar (zacky) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 11:26 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
How about this:

Dear Tige and Company,
We, the Tige bashers of Wakeworld, are sorry for bashing your product. Many of us have never been in or ridden behind a Tige boat, yet we still bash because of what others have said, even without first, second, or third-hand knowledge. Many of us own a "Big 3" boat and have experienced problems much like those associated with your boats and dealerships, yet we will never admit it for fear we will all look like idiots, more so than we already make ourselves out to be. After all, the bashing we do makes us feel better about ourselves and justifies our own purchase. Many of us talk like we are on the pro tour and bought boats that supposedly "revolutionized wakeboarding"; yet we still can't clear the wake. Oh, wait. Some of us can clear the wake because we only have a 91 inch beam. The truth is, we fear companies like you- companies that are innovative. We try to keep you down with hopes that you do not rise to the "top" because then, after all of the bashing we have done, we will be compelled to buy your product. As an insecurity, we only buy boats that are the most expensive and labeled the "best." So take our apologies for what they are worth. Keep up the great work!

Sincerely,
Wakeworld Tige Bashers

I think this will work just fine...

 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 11:54 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
ok
yes i told andrew that driveing to abilene was out, and i would give him a call later. i also advised him it would be good to get on the phone with the tige dealer to find out how it can get fixed.

when you have a warranty that means"they fix the boat for free"

i started the post b/c i have never gotten taken care of by tige until i started screeming. i also have a life and did not get to call him until today. my boat has been down since september/ october so i new one more day was not going to hurt.

i drive a 2003 chevy hd (gas) so chevy hd+big boat behind it+ $1.60 gas= $500. also i am not a meth freak so i can not stay awake for days at a time with out eating so i would have to stay the night which means two day trip.

why should i feel lucky the boat manufacture is going to fix my boat. if you guys think posting a bad post on wake world is bad wait to see what happens if it does not get taken care of!

the dealership gets paid for warranty work. they love it b/c it keeps the guys working. other wise they would have to fire most of the people during the winter.

if anyone does not think they are getting the full story feel free to call me 281-723-6572

it does not matter whos fault it is. the facts are its a tige boat under warranty. it should get fixed without it costing me one or two trips to abilene. i have health problems, and family members depend on me every day. so to just leave them is not really an option. i know, boo hoo for me right! still if i had bought another boat it would be 1/2 hour away and i would not be typing right now.

i spent four years in the us coast guard as a machinery tech and went to almost every school they offered. i have worked and maintained boats from 210 feet with gas turbins and 16 cyl alcos, to 21 foot with a 4cyl tubo cummins. so i know my way around a boat.
finally, wake boarding is not even fun anymore. it stoped being fun almost about the time i got this boat. thanks alot!

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 5:29 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Pat, please for give my ignorance…the words stamped on the 5.7l block threw me for a minute. Apparently “Hecho en Mexico” must translate to “made in the USA”, my mistake. Apparently my Spanish teacher was unaware of the UAW dialect.

For you to imply that Chrysler paid all of the debts in preposterous! It is documented how many millions of dollars in debts that were forgiven and even more were given 0% open-ended terms. Did those suppliers win when the sale went through? And what made Chrysler so special that a government decided to bail out a company (unprecedented at the time)? Governments (at best) should assist industry not target specific business for assistance while others fail and die. (Topic for another day)

Who paid for Chrysler’s Jeep plant in Vietnam?

 
By Greg Davis (vortech347) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 5:40 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zach, once again. And I won't repeat it again.

WARRANTY!!!!!!!

They get paid to do warranty work and it does not cost them extra to make phone calls to the manufacturer. They are already paying their employees to be there.

If it turns out the problem was caused by the out of business dealer and Tige' refuses to pay then the new dealer has every right to charge Michael for their diagnostic time.

How difficult is this? Take a vehicle in for warranty work to an authorized facility and have them do what their paid to do.

 
By Lance (uga33) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 5:59 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
That's funny Oscar. I'm with you on that.
 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 6:10 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
By the way Pat, when did they start assembling engines at the Defiance CASTING facility?

And since the Teksid group (owned by Fiat & Renault and the world’s largest producer of aluminum castings) is producing 150 million pounds of castings a year for GM 6, 5 and 4 cylinder engines including cylinder blocks and heads wouldn’t that validate the point I was making? IF you believe the American auto manufacturers are still producing everything in house down the line (ala Rouge River) you are kidding yourself. One word…outsourcing.


 
By Kevin (ctrider) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:03 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I have read this thread and many other Tige threads and find them amusing.

I can see some of Michael’s points but do not understand why if the boat has not been running since September/October he is now just posting this. Why not post it sooner or if the dealer went out of business and the new dealer was of no help why not take the 5 minutes to call or email the factory direct? He spent the time to start this thread.

I am in not saying it is ok about the service he has received and I would be pissed if it was me but why wait 5 months.

Yes I own a Tige it’s a 98 V-Drive that runs great and has a great wake with no curl and no spray pockets and that is the way it came from the factory. Not all older Tige’s have spray pockets.

Will I buy another Tige? Probably not and not because I do not like there boats or because I have had any major problems, because I feel they have nice boats with lots of room and nice wakes. But with the lack of dealer support in my area and the inability to keep a dealer in CT I would have second thoughts. We finally have a new dealer in CT; now let’s see if he can stay open. Before I had a local dealer I always emailed Andrew or called him and he was able to help me out. Now I did not have major issues like Michael. But I think if Michael took the time to contact Tige direct this all could have been resolved 5 months ago.

Andrew why would you even ask Michael to bring the boat Abilene? I know Michael live in TX but it should go to the closest Tige dealer and be fixed. And it should be fixed in no more than a week’s time. If there is no dealer close by then Tige should make arrangements. If I purchased a new Tige up here in CT and the dealer went out of business would I have to bring it to Abilene to get it fixed? If that is the case then I am never even considering a new Tige.

 
By Greg Davis (vortech347) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:09 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Well put Kevin. I think Michael waited to post this in hopes that his efforts with the new dealer would work out.

This appears to be a last resort post to vent and share his frustrations with the rest of us.

I still don't think he deserves any criticism for this post. It's not his responsibility to fix his problem. That belongs to Tige', Merc or the dealer. Unfortunately, the dealer is gone so now it's up to Tige' and Merc to make it right.

 
By Andrew Reyes (andrew_reyes) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:21 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael, The boat is out of warranty and registered to Joe Allen and MerCruiser will not extend the warranty. I am still agreeing to fix the boat at no cost to you, as I have stated. I said that I would make a trip to Houston to pickup the boat. I asked if you could make one trip up here once the boat has been repaired, so you can check everything out. I see this is not accecptable to you so we will get the boat from Dockside and deliver when it is done.

 
By Rich (rson) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:34 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
One Step further...if Michael can provide proof of the many repairs and out of pocket expenses would Tige buy his boat back and sell him one at dealer cost?
 
By zach (klk) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:54 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
like i said more than generous offer, the boat isn't even under warranty!
 
By Bill (skionone) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:56 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Oh Snap! Sounds like most everyone was right. Mr. Gill is full of it! That is too damn funny.
"due to personal obligations (family and work) and to money issues making a trip to abilene is NOT an option."
Maybe you never should have bought the boat if you can't afford it. Man, this can make a whole new thread.
Will MC, CC, BU cover a boat that is out of warranty and go pick the thing up 8 hours away from a guy that's pissed because he can't afford to fix it?

 
By Andrew Adams (wolfpack) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 8:30 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Sounds to me like they were doing more than their share to make it right.
 
By Jeff (tigetx) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 8:37 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael,

So exactly who is Joe Allen the first owner who bought this boat from the dealership that has gone out of business?? Or is he your alias..... Your story isn’t adding up and it seems more and more like you are doing this for entertainment. If you want to be the center of attention try Karaoke on Thursday nights at your local pub it poses to be more rewarding, especially with the magnitude of this act.

 
By Kaiser Soze (tattoobling) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 9:23 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I don't know about the 8 hour travelling issue but one thing is for sure. Their isn't a 2002 MC, CC, BU, or Skier's Choice for that matter, that isn't still under warranty. Perhaps that is the core of the whole problem. But once again, much like Mr. Stanton and his Wedge-Lawsuit issue, it seems like the board has had enough of you Mr. Gill. Which is a shame because it sounds like you have a total terd on your hands.
 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 9:36 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
its my mom!!!!!! she signed for the boat before she got sick !!!!! i have papers that show i bought a 5 year warranty on the power plant and all the other problems better be under warranty b/c they all happened 6-8 months ago. i bought the boat sep/oct 2002 so the first year was up sep/oct 2003. it was in the shop over the summer getting its first tranny and me and dock side and tige decided to wait until winter to fix all the other stuff so i could get on the water. so like i said it better still be under warranty.

also i gave all of you my personal cell phone # if you do not buy it call me we an talk about it.
i did not want to jump right on the board and start saying bad things about tige. i waited and gave then the chance to fix the stuff. would'nt you think that would be better. i did. but i guess next time as soon as my boat breaks i will let you know, everytime it breaks, or has a hard time starting. i wont give the company the trust i thought they deserved.

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 9:39 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
What happened to Pat?
 
By Bill (skionone) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 9:46 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
"me and dock side and tige decided to wait until winter to fix all the other stuff so i could get on the water"
I thought you said Tige told you they wouldn't fix the problems. Man, you've got a whole bag of problems and I don't think it's only your boat. Why don't you contact the guy that sold you the boat. He owns Waterski Boats of Dallas. If I were you, I'd go drive it through his showroom window. Guess the deal in Houston didn't work so he thought he'd give it a shot in Dallas.

 
By Bill (skionone) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 9:50 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zedz- come on man, let it go. Would it make you feel better if I said, "you're right"
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 10:02 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Funny how all these guys take it so personally if someone has issues with a Tige' boat, even to the point of personally attacking the individual who has the issue.
 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 10:04 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Yes it would...Thanks Bill.
 
By Bill (skionone) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 10:11 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
I don't think anyone is attacking the guy. Okay, maybe just a little. But it sounds to me like he just got called out on a BS story. The dealer that shut down owes him $2,000 and did file his 5 year warranty with Merc. Either come clean or take it up with the jerk that sold you the boat.
 
By Michael Gill (mgill76) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 10:32 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
OK,

i can say this. tige has steped up big time. they are going to repair all the problems with my boat engine and boat repairs. i guess this got out of hand. i will admitt when i found out my boat was not going to get fixed a week ago i was maddddd and to no fault but my own it got out of hand.
i APOLOGZE for this. i know know that if you give tige the chance they will take care of you. i guess my lesson is to not rely on what the dealer tells you. i am only sorry it took this to show me. i guess you learn something everyday.

the boat should be fixed before summer and that is great. thanks again for the help.

i guess at this point tige has another happy customer.

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 10:33 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
BS story. Are you saying that he lied about all of the problems he had with the boat or are you just trying to redirect attention by finding any little thing you can find to personally attack the guy. So what if his boat is POS or broken down and he feels like he is getting the run around. Why does it matter so much to you. It would be interesting if you were in the exact same posisiton as he. Until you have been, I don't think its fair to judge him or personally attack him unless he is making all of the mechanical issues up.
 
By Jeff (tigetx) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 10:50 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Michael,
I think that was very stand up of you to post these things, I am glad that you are excited about getting your boat fixed. Qudos to Andrew for getting this taken care of in an expedited manner.


 
By Marty McFly (mcfly) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 10:52 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
{"me and dock side and tige decided to wait until winter to fix all the other stuff so i could get on the water"
I thought you said Tige told you they wouldn't fix the problems. Man, you've got a whole bag of problems and I don't think it's only your boat. Why don't you contact the guy that sold you the boat. He owns Waterski Boats of Dallas. If I were you, I'd go drive it through his showroom window. Guess the deal in Houston didn't work so he thought he'd give it a shot in Dallas. }

Bill, I appreciate you chiming in here with your comments and attacking our dealership here in Dallas. Once again, someone comes on here and tries to make a point with information that is totally wrong.

Waterski Boats Houston was owned by the same person that still owns Waterski Boats Dallas. However, Waterski Boats Houston was sold by the owner to a new owner in June of 2001.

Thus, Waterski Boats Dallas and Waterski Boats Houston were no longer doing business together after June of 2001.

Now, I am not a mathmatician by any means..However, I do believe that Mr. Gill said he purchased his boat in Sept/October of 2002. I am almost positive that June 2001 comes before Sept/October 2002. Please correct me if I am wrong.


FYI, Waterski Boats Dallas was opened in October of 1993, and Waterski Boats Houston was opened in May of 1997, both by the same owner. Waterski Boats Houston was sold in June of 2001. Waterski Boats Dallas is still doing very well.

I appreciate the point blank shot. I have been following this post as well, and never expected to see our name brought up.

Thanks!

Marty McFly
Waterski Boats Dallas

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 11:07 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Hey Doug,
You would you care to explain to the class the following terms: Slander and Libel.

 
By Pat Frist (qwert1420) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 11:13 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
The GM Romulus Engine Plant, located in Romulus, MICHIGAN, gets it's "outsourced", "poured", engine block castings from the General Motors Powertrain, Saginaw Metal Casting Operations located in Saginaw, MICHIGAN. The GM Romulus Engine Plant manufactured 1,300,000 engines in 2002. General Motors has engine plants in Canada, USA, Mexico, South America, Europe, and the Asia-Pacific region.

There is no point to a discussion with someone who has no idea what they are talking about.

 
By bill montanye (bill) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 11:35 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
How would the warranty be up for any 2002 boat??

all boats have a 3 year drive train warranty dont they??that my understanding whn i was shopping for boats ove rthe last 5 years at boat shows etc..then most have a limited lifetime on the hull..

so how could they warranty be up im lost??

anyway glad to hear Mikes getting taken care of now so issue solved for now ,stay tuned :-)

LOL @ Marty,way to put him in his place :-)

BTW there is a Tige dealer in Dallas its called the Slalom Shop in lewisville ,tx ..

 
By Bill (skionone) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:09 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Easy there Marty. Best I can tell, your math is okay. No point blank shot at your dealership. I was just passing on second hand information that must not have been true(I'll be sure and beat that idiot later). I simply was trying to give Mr. Gill a little more leverage as the dealer he bought the boat from clearly shafted him. I know if the guy was still around, I'd damn sure like to know it and have a little visit with him.

Bill, you must have skipped over a few boats while shopping for your 2000 Supra over the past 5 years. Mercruiser warranty is 1 year. The hull warranty is a lifetime replacement warranty. I'll crawl back to my hole now. Man he really showed me

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:17 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Meanwhile back at GM/UAW propaganda room…oh hey, thanks Pat.

SO they actually do pour the blocks somewhere else huh? I think I said that earlier. But your statement was "The reason I asked is you seem to have no knowledge of how or where US automotive engines are manufactured. You keep repeating that engine plants are just engine assembly plants. This is not true. The critical components i.e. block, heads, crank, camshaft, conrods, etc. are manufactured from raw material at the engine plant." But now it seems that you are substantiating my point that the pieces namely blocks are cast elsewhere, sometimes by other companies and brought to machining and assembly plants. Hmmm interesting.

Nothing about Mexico huh? The foundry is owned by Mexico's Quimmco Group.
And lastly…Straight from American Metal Market, and I quote:
GM produces the North American versions. of the L850 engines at its Tonawanda, N.Y., production engine machining, assembling and testing plant. That is Where the castings it buys from TAC will go, and where most of the products of GM-Massena and the bedplates from Mexico are shipped. The first model in the aluminum-intensive L850 engine line--a 2.2-liter 14--was introduced a few months ago in Saturn Corp.'s new L-series midsize cars.
COPYRIGHT 1999 Cahners Publishing Company
COPYRIGHT 2000 Gale Group

Oh hey look at that…more outsourced blocks.
Ok, now let’s get back to the thread for more exciting action.

 
By Marty McFly (mcfly) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:34 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
No problem. Just protecting our Dealership.

Thanks.

Marty McFly

 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:36 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Dude that is in such poor taste...I love it!

Good luck Michael, I'm out.

 
By Jeff (tigetx) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Zedz, Everyone concurs you win!! Even a blind squirrel gets a nut every once in a while.
 
By thomas ryan (g3revenge) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:38 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
going ot now that the tige in question is as good as fixed................

they had some scrap yard on the discovery channel or speed channel one night munching on old, old cars. the guy that they where interviewing kinda chortled when asked where the metal goes. and i quote,"they come back to the US as hundia's." i thought i was going to dump in my pants.

 
By bill montanye (bill) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:40 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Bill thanks for clearing that up i will make sure i keep skipping over any boat with any brand motor that only hold a one year warranty on it ..Merc sounds like a nightmare from other posts ive read,thats rediculous..For the money that is being spent on these boats there should be a min 3 year and maybe up to a 5 year bumper to bumper(bow to stern) warranty..shoot i get a one year warranty on just about anything built IE sunglasses ,small electric aplliances,speakers etc etc and on and on now a days so thats rediculous on a boat motor/tranny.we offer 1 years parts and labor on HVAC equipment but 5 years total on parts etc right from the factory so that one year warranty is sad.

That brings a lot of light to this thread Tige is cool for stepping up and making this right even more now but maybe they should change boat motor manufacturers or offer the extra two through them for free..

Indmar and supra have stood behind everything ive needed 100% for the 5 years ive owned Supra/Moombas and i feel lucky after reading all these posts of late..

this may not seem much but i remember two years ago when a friend over here had a 2000 21i and had that vinyl problem that were popping up on all tiges and some malibus and supras..Well all other boat manufacturers stepped up and had the vinyl replaced at NO Charge from what i know personally and heard from others but my friend got all the skins in the mail from Tige and was told he had to pay to have the labor done,i thought that was rediculous and that along with the ugly wakes and sad tower they used to have kept me from looking into buying a Tige'..dont know if that was isolated or not but not good when compared to other big three boats warranties.....

Im done :-)

 
By zach (klk) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:50 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
is it just me or doesn't the tige' lose its lifetime coverage after it changes ownership from the original owner, thats what i was told when i got mine. and also it says that tige' does not cover the engine, the hull warranty only covers the hull.
 
By bill montanye (bill) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:10 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
this is right from there site and doesnt say anything about transfers but that would mean they have about 3-6 year warranty on their hulls becasue most people done keep their boats longer then maybe 10 years but on average i bet they are sold or traded in every 4-6 years..


The Tigé LifePlus Lifetime Replacement Warranty is the only replacement warranty in the industry, and it’s a bold statement about our faith in Tigé quality and product integrity and impeccable LifePlus Precision Engineering. Buy a new Tigé, and if there is ever any structural failure, degradation or delamination for as long as you own your boat, we will replace your Tigé at no charge. This covers our breakthrough LifePlus Core matrix stringer system, Penske Extreme composite engine mounts and floor material and our over-built hand-laid lamination process. There has never been a single incident of structural failure in any Tigé hull, floor or stringer component. Our boats are precisely engineered using the most advanced composite materials and meticulously overbuilt for performance, safety and long-term durability. The Tigé LifePlus Lifetime Replacement Warranty…another tremendous difference that sets Tigé apart from the rest.




 
By Bill (skionone) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:22 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
The warranty transfers to the second owner for up to 10 years. And Bill, here again, you're not real clear on your facts. Tige does offer other motor optoins than Merc. While you are looking at their web site, take a look at the GM Vortec and PCM options that they offer. Both of those engines offer a 3 year warranty. Merc chooses not to offer the warranty, it's not Tige's choice. Any other motor questions and I'll have to refer to our local engine expert, Zedz.
 
By zach (klk) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:26 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
when did the life plus warranty start? as in what year of boats? and it still doesn't include the engine, its for the hull.
 
By bill montanye (bill) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:30 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
hmm ive never heard of a boat manufaturers offering more then one motor manufacturer option..thats also new to me and my facts are coming off this site,who would have thought that Tige would offer more then one brand of motor,thats strange in itself and causes confusion..id say they should pick the best one and make it consisitent in all their new boatss..merc wouldnt be my choice ,dont they put their motors in i/os for the most part??

so lets see if we can keep this going

Supra -Indmar
Moomba-Indmar
MC-indmar
Malibu-Indmar
CC-PCM???
MB??
ceturion-Merc??
Tige -Pick out of three Merc,GM,PCM??

People fill in the blanks??looks like Indmar seems to be the most popular...

what trannys are offered on boats and who uses what and whats the best??

 
By Jeff (tigetx) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:35 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Bill, If you just go to the Supra website you will see that they offer PCM as well, huh not so strange anymore.
 
By Jeff (tigetx) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:37 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
MB-pcm
 
By bill montanye (bill) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:48 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I didnt feel like checking thought id let you do the work jeff..i havent seen one ,or a newer one with pCM in it seems Indmar is the standard motor in Supra/moomba/mc ,and malibu..

thanks :-)

BTW still strange but when i bought my last two boats supra/moomba i wasnt given the option of another motor so it wasnt confusing at the time..

 
By Bill (skionone) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 1:49 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Oh Snap! I bet that dude don't even know what motor he has in his boat. I think if you look close at all boats built in the entire industry, you will see that most manufactures offer multiple engine options and different makes. Anything else Bill?
People fill in the blanks??I don't know what the hell I'm talking about.

 
By bill montanye (bill) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 2:01 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I have a 310 indmar in my boat Mr Bill and i did know that from the beginning as well as in my old 98 Moomba..i know i have almost 500 hard weighted hours on my Supr and had over 200 on my Moomba and no problems yet..hmm Indmar has a three year warranty on the motor just in case..what i said is when i bought the boat there were no signs up,no salesman or mechanic telling me that there were an option on engine choices just differewnt upgrades on the Indmar ,,i guess that just meant standard indmar engines were good enough that if i didnt ask supra/moomba felt confident that they were selling me the best engine available In their oppinion or they would have the PCM stock on the showroom floor but they dont so i went with what they offered...obviously its a strong enough engne to have a three year warranty and be offered on 4 major boats as standard equipment..

OH SNAP seems good enough for me..!! :-)

BTW looks like centurion uses Merc as well and that was also a boat i dint and wouldnt consider buying along with the Tige for that reason and many others ..

HA that slogan on centurions website says something like the strongest and best motor that would be the only one good enough to go in a Centurion. Hmm thats sending me the wrong impression of their boat buy saying an engine with a one year factory warranty is only one good enough for their boats??Sounds like a saving money issue to me ?

 
By Nick Heckerson (kstateskier) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 2:06 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I'm not always a huge fan of Merc, but they have been powering boats for a long time and I think, for the most part, they make a very strong engine. But, we might as well ad Centurion to this Tige bashing thread, as it seems like these are Wakeworld's favorites!
 
By Terry Barrett (terry_barrett) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 2:28 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I'm not sure I follow the logic of a motor choice being a negative or confusing thing. Malibu still offers Mercs if you want it. They are however an Indmar supplier. PCM is a very highly rated engine as per JD Power. It is offered with a 3 year warranty. The Gm Vortec moter offered by Tige also carries a 3 year warranty. All of these engines come from GM Powertrain and then they receive the marine applications. Only Indmar still produces the throttle body fuel injection. TBI is 10 year old technology. I wouldn't call that cutting edge.
 
By Brett Davis (bdavis) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 2:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
This is so dramatic, incredible! I wish I had time to read all these damn posts. Sounds like a few of you should meet up and put on the gloves. Should we set up a ring at the WSSR? Just kidding, although it would be fun to watch. Hopefully Mike and Tige' both come away happy.
 
By Rich (rson) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 2:33 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I just thought I should mention this....

You are all whining and bickering like a bunch of bitche$. This post isn't even about the topic anymore....

(Message edited by rson on March 04, 2004)

 
By Greg Stanton (broken_ride) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 2:54 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
"Perhaps that is the core of the whole problem. But once again, much like Mr. Stanton and his Wedge-Lawsuit issue, it seems like the board has had enough of you Mr. Gill."

Thanks Kaiser.

 
By cory kowalski (maristar210) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 4:34 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
havent read much of the fourm, but just one question. Why arent there any pics of the defects?
 
By Rick Tinker (rickt) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 4:55 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
FWIW,

Supra and Moomba do not offer PCM anymore. Exclusively Indmar. Sorry if our site is confusing

 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 5:23 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Whinning like a bunch of boat bitches, hahaha. That is what some of us do best.
 
By bill montanye (bill) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 5:25 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
thanks Rick !! :-)
 
By talltigeguy (talltigeguy) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 5:44 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
The Las Vegas boat dealer switched to GM Vortec in the 2004 models. I asked about it and I sensed several four letter words including 'Merc'. I didn't inquire further, but he seemed relieved by his new choice of engine.
 
By Rich (rson) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 5:52 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Who the hell would want a Supra anyway (Bill)
 
By Steven Hahn (solo) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 6:43 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
That's what you do best Dougy! But then again you're a lawyer and your trained at birth to whine. Do I get some sort of award for being your so called Tige defender?

Wakeboarding is fun.

 
By mark (mhsb1029) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:08 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Damn I love this thread, just keeps getting better every day!
 
By zach (klk) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:27 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
i love tige' and tige' loves me because i love tige' i have a tige' and my tige' works great, looks great, and is great. Man your battleships, its time for boat bashing. and malibu's suck!
 
By Doug Hanson (xtigeman) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:28 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Better to be a whinny boat bitch than a whinny boat whore.
 
By Steven Hahn (solo) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 7:36 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
I'll have you know that I whore with the best....
 
By Dan (dfish) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 8:05 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
YEE HAA

I'll weigh in on this one: Nautiques Only!

 
By zach (klk) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 8:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
nautiques are nice but don't ride as smooth as my tige'
 
By zach (klk) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 8:17 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
in rough water that is
 
By Dan (dfish) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 8:25 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
Your right, i'd hate to think I have the "best" because then I wouldn't have an excuse for being so bad.

At least when I talk to the ER doc's, I can tell them it's because I don't have a Tige, BU, MC, or MB.



(Message edited by dfish on March 04, 2004)

 
By Rich (rson) on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 9:16 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
As a professional "boat whore" I take offense to that Doug. Some times it is nice to have a steady rider that can drive, maintain, and supply the beer and $$$$.
 
By Zedz Dead (ktm250) on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 6:07 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Where is Kaiser at? Perhaps he can compare and contrast the ride of his Air Palmetto for us. Last I heard he said it "rides better than any Tige ever built, pulls more chicks than a SAN and is better built than an MC"...
 
By Jeff (tigetx) on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 6:34 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Tinker,

It is confusing, but that is easy to do with me. Am I mistaken or is that a picture of you performing the second quality check also, where do you find the time. LOL

 
By Kaiser Soze (tattoobling) on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 6:43 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
Are you looking at me?

Are you talkin' to me? Are you talkin' to me, you must be cuz there's no one else here....with half a brain left, they've all won the Special Olympics.

Chillin' on my Palmetto, pimping large, knockin' boots, and I bid you farewell and....

 
By Kaiser Soze (tattoobling) on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 6:45 am:    Edit Post Delete Post


That should say it all. Good luck Mr. Gill.

 
By zach (klk) on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 7:40 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
what the hell is a palmetto?
 
By biz (sherminator) on Monday, March 15, 2004 - 1:50 am:    Edit Post Delete Post
i have an australian boat but its got a 350 mpi in it, and i havent used it since start of january...fuel pumps, vapor lock, now the warning comes on over and over before i even start the boat
 
By zach (klk) on Monday, March 15, 2004 - 6:59 pm:    Edit Post Delete Post
so go take it to get it looked at. duh. alot of times minor problems become big problems because someone was too lazy to get it checked out at first
 
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